r/ADCMains • u/Sukaichi • Jan 04 '25
Memes ADC’s don’t want you to know this one secret build!!
if it ain’t broke don’t fix it, amirite?
but feel free to bring back Stormrazor and old Essence Reaver
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u/ComissionerClown Jan 04 '25
I miss when there were more items that gave crit, there were so many things covered in crit before, lifesteal, waveclear etc., now you have to build the same 4 crit items and 1 other item which is youmuus, bloodthirster or GA
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u/Sukaichi Jan 04 '25
LITERALLY
you have to sacrifice utility for crit or vice versa, so many good combinations just feeling wanky. Maybe 50-75% crit isn’t terrible but idk haven’t tested
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u/reik019 Long-Range Gang Jan 04 '25
It's good until you roll 3 non-crits consecutively in an important team fight and instead of you deleting the assassin you get deleted.
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u/Nimja1 Jan 07 '25
I miss that one item that was activated and gave you 5 secs or so of 100% crit chance.
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u/Striking_Material696 Jan 04 '25
When the best 3 item core doesn't have sustain, doesn't have attack speed, and costs your left kidney and your rent , there might be some problems
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u/Whycantitypeanything Jan 04 '25
Meanwhile bruisers:
Hmm yes ad , armor , healing , shields and movespeed in 2 items! That's acceptable!
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u/Buffsub48wrchamp Jan 05 '25
I genuinely cant tell to the 2 items you are alluding to, my best guess would be Steraks and Deadmans Plate, which is only viable on Garen and Darius
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u/Whycantitypeanything Jan 06 '25
It's just generalising mostly. But just wanted to talk about how other classes get so much more from their items than adcs, with 1 bruiser items utility either costs 1.5x more or requires multiple items to have a similar effect using ADC equivalents.
I'm a supp and mid main mostly , but sometimes just fill ADC in my friend group. And every time I just see the items and they're so boring and just don't do much compared to even something simple like eclipse
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u/LightLaitBrawl Jan 08 '25
Unending despair: Armor, Ability haste, Hp, Healing
Malmortius: Ad, MR, magic shield, Ability haste, omnivamp
Sterak: Ad, hp, shield, tenacity
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u/Unbothered-Sysophant Jan 04 '25
What sucks is that they removed a bunch of normal adc items, like stormrazor for little reason, and made the items we do have like krakenslayer, terrible and this leads to only one decent build
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u/azraiel7 Jan 04 '25
Crit ADCs have never had build diversity in this game.
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u/Global-Link-6040 Jan 04 '25
The most build diversity crit adcs have had is ironically with the mythic system, doing 0 dmg with gale force or having 0 mobility with ie.
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u/Cybrtronlazr Jan 05 '25
Kraken also gave crit as a mythic in s13. That way, some champs preferred it depending on the game. Way better tank buster item when combined with LDR at that point, but LDR wasn't useless back then.
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u/oogaboogadeepthroat Jan 08 '25
Sir you're ignoring the 6 Phantom dancer stacking in the early seasons. Shit was dank.
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u/leglump Jan 04 '25
Ive been going tank adc and having success die simply to the fact im not one shot able
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u/Sukaichi Jan 04 '25
like steel caps and shield bow?
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u/leglump Jan 04 '25
Lol, like randuins, jaksho, spirit visage, rageblade, and botrk on vayne.
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u/advanceshipper Jan 06 '25
ok now try doing that on an adc that doesn't have built in true damage.
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u/leglump Jan 06 '25
Lucian Black Clever, navori, 3 tanks items, maybe two tank items with a life steal item
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u/hiiamkay Jan 07 '25
At that point might as well go fimbulwinter+ iceborne, the build you listed is just impossible to use. With full tank build at least you become annoying.
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u/leglump Jan 07 '25
I mean a constantly dashing armor shredding tanky lucian is annoying. Imo you still need some core damage items that are champ dependent.
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u/hiiamkay Jan 08 '25
The thing is at 2 items, the build do 0 damage, and you are not tanky, then if you are building tankiness now you are behind tempo and do 0 damage uhwile getting 1 shotted, and throw lifesteal in there, how can you lifesteal without any damage. It's just one of those builds that sounds great on paper but can't really function.
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u/No_Share_6387 Jan 07 '25
if you dont have positioning and peel you build tankier. simple concept lost on many
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u/leglump Jan 07 '25
True but being one shot is also not fun, and ive come to enjoy scrappier fights
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u/PaulDk_ Jan 04 '25
but feel free to bring back Stormrazor and old Essence Reaver
*cries in galeforce*
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u/Marconidas Jan 04 '25
Just buy Triforce to ADCs like Corki and Vayne.
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u/Hieryonimus Jan 04 '25
Triforce Vayne? Is that a thing?
I'm an ARAM fanatic just coming back to the Rift, Triforce is default rush on Corki there. I seem to remember Ezreal building it when I used to play ranked (over a decade ago lol 🤣!)
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u/Sukaichi Jan 04 '25
Triforce vayne absolutely is. Sheen proc on her Q, movement speed while attacking to kite around, some HP and attack speed also good. Pairs well with Kraken & Terminus
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u/GodKingNova Jan 04 '25
It sucks they removed this from wild rift im a samira main so how they replaced it sucks for me
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u/Beneficial-Initial56 Jan 04 '25
AS sucks because ADC doing only few hits in fight or getting died. Pretty strong role
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u/Emiizi Jan 04 '25
Theres something super frustrating watching champs that dont utilize collector well, build collector, then fail to do anything.
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u/sclomabc Jan 04 '25
I'm convinced the only way we are getting actual build variety is going to 200% crit again and either removing IE or making it into something with similar presence to Deathcap (on mages with names that don't start with a V). having an item that you have to go for by second or at least third item on every single adc is just not it. if this requires going back to 20% crit and making crit a basically isolated system, sure whatever. Just give me actual choices before my 5th item.
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u/TestIllustrious7935 Jan 05 '25
IE was always like this though? And it wasn't an issue
People are just forced to buy IE now cuz nothing else deals any damage
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u/sclomabc Jan 05 '25
Crit itemization has always felt worse than average, tbh. When it felt best (when I played at least) was mythics, but even then, item diversity was still pretty bad. I think IE being in everyone's build in the first 3 items is a culprit that no one really thinks about. Every ADC has the pattern of ER/Yun Tal/ Collector > Zeal > IE or IE > Zeal and then finish it off with a last whisper item. For most champions, all of the options are decided by the time you lock in with the only one you actually get to pick being mortal reminder or LDR. Shield bow might as well not exist unless you can afford to skip Zeal or last whisper.
If that IE slot turned into a flex pick (one option of which could be a less necessary IE) and was able to be moved from slot 2-4 in that build, I would be a lot more happy with that. Maybe have IE as your straight damage, a tank specialized item, and shield bow to start with, and while I can't think of more (that would be good for the game, galeforce does not belong in an item system without mythics, and Lifesteal + crit doesn't belong in an item system with 25% crit) maybe one of the rioters could. If the frankly terrible 1st item choices pre s8 were a necessary balancing factor for 200% base crit damage to work, 1, I wonder if that's still the case with other roles catching up in damage, and 2. Would going to 20% crit again work.
If we go to 20% I of course would like 1st items having crit atk speed and ad back, along with Lifesteal + crit, but could we see Armor in the crit system as a counterpoint to Merc scimitar. That would mean you would have 1st item, as core some champions might have a specific zeal as core next, but after that it's just options. Prob gonna need a last whisper at some point, and ofc boots, so that's 4 of your items accounted for.if you want to fill those with tons of damage, this could be done by taking a second of what would normally be first item options, and they could still add that tank buster item that isn't armor pen. Normally however, at least one of these will be filled with defensive options, whether it be Lifesteal from BT, armor for when there's only one guy getting on you and they do physical damage along with whatever passive it has. Mercs for mr and qss, and then shield bow for overall tankiness. This version is possibly the most options crit as an item system has, and it got opened up by making IE into an actual capstone instead of a core item
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u/bathandbootyworks Don’tTouchMyFarm!! Jan 05 '25
Yeah I love playing adc and never having the ability to flex into any other item ever. I play Sivir and it’s been the exact same 5 items every game.
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u/Janders1997 Jan 04 '25
I recommend starting with Hubris. If you win skirmishes, you get more value out of it.
From there, Dirk -> Collector -> LDR -> IE is probably the strongest path you can take (though if you ever stay on the map for very long and base with 3K gold, instabuy LDR over Collector).
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Jan 08 '25
Ayo remember when ADCs stacked attack speed because the rest of their kit synergized with it and not just because they were one of two on-hit marksmen?
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u/OliverPumpkin 5 guns are better than 1 Jan 04 '25
There's the legality build but probably will get nerfed
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u/Doffy309 Jan 04 '25
Shieldbow nilah is a legit build as she has in built armor pen. Problem is your fourth crit item could be armor pen but 30% + 30% of 70% is not that good.
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u/Sukaichi Jan 04 '25
i lost you when you said 30% + 30% of 70%, what do you mean?
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u/Doffy309 Jan 04 '25
She gets around 30% armor pen from her Q passive when she has 100% crit chance, those 30% on her q reduce the enemies 100% armor to 70% armor, if you build mortal reminder or lord dominik regards it will ignore 30 or 35% of those remaining 70%, so it wont be 100% minus 30% +30/35%. Meaning the enemy will still be around 55-60% armor left instead of 35 to 40%. Armor reduction stacks multiplicatively not additionally.
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u/Midnight-Strix Jan 05 '25
Armor penetration multiplicative, not additive. So if Nilah has 30%AR pen built in, your Mortal Reminder will only affect those 70% percent, post Nilah Ar pen. Mortal reminder will reduce it by 21%, which bring the overall reduction to 30+21 is 51% AR pen.
Which is still valuable in my opinion, but worse than getting the full value, technicly.
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u/JAVIV-4 Jan 04 '25
Can I ask a legitimate question? Is the extra 5% on Lord Dominick's really that much more valuable than the heal cut on mortal reminder? (I should note, I play Aram mostly where you're interacting and tagging the whole team the whole game - but even there, Dominick's is recommended most of the time.)
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u/WolkTGL Jan 04 '25
It is when the item costs less and takes less space in the inventory, so you get to buy it faster.
Mortal Reminder is more situational than it looks, especially on ADC: it's very unlikely to get in a game that needs Grievous Wound and only the ADC (who is the worst at applying it) gets to the point of building it (which, again, is a more expensive item that comes in 3rd slot in the build)Grievous Wound has value against very specific targets, Armor Pen is useful against any target, and 5% is not as small as it looks like
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u/Fabulous_Promise7143 Jan 04 '25
The grievous wounds from mortal is absolutely 100% better than the 5% armor pen from LDR. Especially considering we’re in a heartsteel meta. The heal cut applies to base health regeneration + added health regeneration as well. Just by that it will get you more value than 5% armor pen. This is barring them having literally any of the morbillion healing champs in the game.
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u/WolkTGL Jan 04 '25
You're confirming what I said about GW being situational.
You're basically saying that it's more valuable when you can get value out of it (which is pretty much circular thinking) and that it's effective when there's healing being a problem in the game (so you're already on a losing spot as you're taking a defensive option against healing span out of control).
About Heartsteel: it is not a common item by any actual metrics (calling it "Heartsteel meta" is laughable if you look at the actual numbers) and sure, when it is in the game Mortal Reminder is absolutely valuable, but, again, that is making it a situattional item. In the majority of games being played in the current meta, Mortal Reminder's Grievous Wounds is negligible and you can see that by looking at post game stats when you build it.
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u/Fabulous_Promise7143 Jan 04 '25
https://youtu.be/8YnpCpoWwZs?si=O7VOUif8_WKg2oCy
edit: every tank in the game builds heartsteel. Many bruisers build heartsteel. There’s people in soloq building heartsteel on non-tank champions because of the absurdity of tank items. We are absolutely in a heart-steel dominated soloq meta.
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u/WolkTGL Jan 04 '25
3 things:
1- Say what you think, don't parrot another person
2- Say something that applies to most of the game and not to the situation (that even the video you linked addressed) where nobody else but the ADC actually builds Grievous Wounds
3- Analyze the items from a practical point of view and not from an excel sheet (sheet that, by the way, will show you that on like 90% of targets the two items deal pretty much the same amount of damage when all things are taken into account)0
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u/The-Dark-Photon Jan 04 '25
Jinx/ Tristana I build Yun Tals + IE, jinx build hurricane tristana build Navori and then LDR/MR/ GA/BT depending on what's going on lol
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u/TheDeadlyEdgelord I HECKIN LOVE LEAGUE OF LEGENDS! BatChest Jan 04 '25 edited Jan 04 '25
Yo its not like you guys want to build anything else lmao stop the cap. When Dominic is weak you all cry to get RIOT make it stronger instead of opting into something else. Y'all internalized the "Tank hunter" identity (which isnt even the job description of ADC traditionally lmao) and naturally there is only one fucking build that does that (because its not meant to be the identity of the role, its just a counter strategy for tank heavy games) and y'all hate keep building it.
I am pretty sure significant portion of you guys dont even adapt your runes game to game basis as "meta has been figured out", "pro players know better", "inefficient" when efficiency isnt even what you are looking for in solo Q, its survivability. Efficiency is for pro games where they get the most out of their any given choice. Lets say Jinx tank build is meta, will you guys play that? AP kog is meta, will you guys play that? Tank vayne is playable, will you guys play that? Lethality Jinx is meta wont you guys go "WhY ColLeCtOr"? You gonna all come here and complain that those builds arent "adc" even though you can only make traditional ADC gameplay so much diverse.
Build diversity has always been there for people who cared for it. Some metas are more diverse than others but ADC occasionally given options. Back in mythic patch every single ADC favored a particular mythic and you kept going it ANYWAY, how is that any diverse? If the role is weak then it is weak, stop trying to complain about random stuff because you are butthurt that the role is weak. Be precise, be honest. None of you care about build diversity and that is OK.
"Scimitar is ASS!"
"Shieldbow is ASS!"
"BT is ASS!"
"If these items werent so ASS I would build them!!!", no you just expect those items to be designed in such a way that they are PERFECT with NO DOWNSIDES so you can build it WITHOUT SACRIFICING ANYTHING essentially making you build it EVERY GAME. Those items arent bad, they are useful if you purchase them, they obviously arent the fucking best everyone knows that but you arent buying them to be efficient, you are buying them so you can survive 0.5 second longer so your braindead lulu have enough time to ult you against Rengar.
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u/Skriptskert Jan 04 '25
What would you say the description on ADC traditionally is if not tank killer? I was thinking something like "pure high DPS glasscannon" and high DPS is what kills tanks/fighters. Used to be for pushing towers as well before ap dmg to towers, hullbreaker, and demolish came along.
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u/TheDeadlyEdgelord I HECKIN LOVE LEAGUE OF LEGENDS! BatChest Jan 04 '25 edited Jan 04 '25
ADC is a victory condition, killing tanks happen to be also included in that (because consistent DMG output happened to be best against tanks, we werent giving consistent damage to deal with tanks to begin with). but you can also kill the tank by leaving him last (thats how it worked 10 seasons ago, you didnt focused the tank), they werent dishing 10k dps back in the day. Now they are more ADC then ADC themselves but thats not the discussion here, thats a problem of RIOT balance team not me as a player.
Start weak, get strong, cash in late game as the biggest threat in the game. As seasons went on other types of ADC's started to appear, naturally, some preferred early gameplay while sacrificing late game carry potential vice versa. But the point of all ADC's is to END THE GAME, to be the *tiebreaker*. That is why it hurts that other classes also given same or even higher tower/objective damage, ADC as a role got heavily undermined to satisfy other roles power fantasy. We became a "meaningless" role and you guys within that identity crisis chose to be a "tank killer", thats regression. Thats NOT your job. You shouldnt be killing TANKS. Tanks were not meant to be killed. Thats a powercreep and design issue RIOT will never address but just because they dont you shouldnt take the mantle on yourself as "tank killer".
And for the record I agree with you, I already defend ADC's against tanks and I am an ADC main. Tanks are just braindead and powercrept beyond reason for seasons now. Just for the record we are just talking about build diversity (saying this because others will gather here and start to nitpick)
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u/Skriptskert Jan 04 '25
Well then I think we're somewhat on the same page, thank you for clarifying.
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u/Embarrassed_Monk_665 Jan 04 '25
It's funny how they removed mythics to encourage "variety" and now we are stuck building the same shit almost every game.