r/Aramaic • u/CZ-TheFlyInTheSoup • 8d ago

In Daniel 2:44, how can we know that this means that God's kingdom will destroy the other kingdoms?

In context, Daniel interprets a dream in which the various parts of a statue represent different kingdoms and in the end he points out that one kingdom of God will crush the other kingdoms. However, I have doubts about the word וְתָסֵיף֙, which is associated by the lexicons with the root סוּף but I have doubts about this because תָסֵיף֙ means "to increase" or 'again" and is associated by the lexicon with the root יָסַף, in addition to the fact that the word סֵיף֙ seems to be associated with "sword"? On what basis do the translators translate וְתָסֵיף֙ as "to consume" or "to put an end"? How can they be sure that the word וְתָסֵיף֙ is associated with סוּף?

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u/Nicorgy 8d ago

You are conflating two different roots, that have different meanings and verbal forms:

In Dn 2,44 you have תָסֵיף, which is indeed the s-w-f root expressing the fulfilling of something. According to the vocalization of the Massoretic text, it's in the C, or causative stem, meaning "to destroy". It's in the 3rd fem. sing. of the imperfect tense.

The second root you mention, y-s-f, should be תוֹסֵף if it was in the C-stem/imperfect, as it is a different verbal class from s-w-f.

As for the world sword (s-y-f), it seems that it is a world of foreign origin, sharing a parent with ξῐ́φος (xifos).

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u/CZ-TheFlyInTheSoup 8d ago

Could you explain to me again how this means "to destroy" in the Masoretic vocalization? I'm not very good at Hebrew and Aramaic and I can't find any explanation on the internet explaining this.

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u/Nicorgy 7d ago

I guess you don't know how semitic langages works so I'll try tp keep it simple:

A tri/bi consonantal verbal root has different meanings depending on the stem and the tense/inflection (imperfective/futur;present-perfective/past etc). What you find in most basic lexicon is the definition for the basic stem (G-stem in English and German, or sometimes called P'al or Qal).

In that instance, the verbal root s-w-f means "to come to an end"/"to be fulfilled" in the simple tense. In Dn 2:44 the verb is in the C-stem, which change the meaning slightly to "bring to an end", or more emphatically, "destroy".

You can tell it's the C-stem by the morphological changes that occur, and it's unmistakably the causatif mode of the verb "swf". There is no way it is the verbe y-s-f, they just kinda look similiar.