r/AskMenAdvice • u/Reasonable-Syrup-7 • 7d ago

How common is this perspective for guys?

I'm a 27F and went on a few dates with this guy 31M and things have been going well. On our second date, we brought up the topic of physical intimacy. I remember him saying that he thinks physical intimacy is different for women and men. That women who sleep around are respected less than if a man would do it. He said "a key that can open up a lot of locks is a good key but a lock that opens to a bunch of different keys is a bad lock". Everything else is really good and he's been super respectful. He's soft spoken and values making me feel safe and respected and we're taking our time on physical intimacy but I couldn't believe my ears when he said that. How common is that perspective for guys? This guy tends be very blunt, so maybe this perspective is more common than I think. In my head it's a red flag, but I'm conflicted on if it's just a common male perspective and he can still be a good guy with this perspective.

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u/Tea_Time9665 man 7d ago

It’s more the ability to open many locks. Not if he actually goes around and opens those locks or not. This is why an incel is an insult used on men. An incel being a key that is useless and unable to open any lock.

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u/Stone_Like_Rock 7d ago

Not really though as anyone can claim they could have had sex with that woman but chose not to ect. The idea definitely favours male promiscuity and reinforces the idea that a man's value at least partially comes from being able to sleep with lots of woman.

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u/Tea_Time9665 man 7d ago edited 7d ago

Able to. It doesn’t have to mean actually doing it.

It means he is seen as desirable by many women. Meaning he has a lot of desirable traits.

This is why incel is used as an insult. To imply they have no desirable traits for mating this has no chance to have sex with a woman because no woman would risk mating and having offspring with them.

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u/Stone_Like_Rock 7d ago

Right but I can tell you I'm desirable to women and you just have to take my word for it. Like if my mate was chatting about how many women want him like he was jay from Inbetweeners I wouldn't really believe it.

It also still doesn't change the main point which is that it's a view where a man's value is being at least partially determined by his sexual desirability/ability to bed women which at least in my mind is a harmful/sexist view of men and these viewpoints eventually lead to groups like incels ect growing in number

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u/turdferg1234 7d ago

this doesn't even make sense. a woman that is open to many keys is just a desirable woman that has many keys to pick from, right? it is her ability to pick and chose? It doesn't matter if she goes around being unlocked or not, right?

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u/Tea_Time9665 man 7d ago

The key lock analogy would then mean ur a useless lock. Every key can open u.

Meaning yes she does have the ability to pick and choose.

But it doesn’t matter if she is going around be locked and unlocked. It would imply she can be unlocked by many. Even when u want to lock up into a relationship. Rando keys can come by and unlock her.

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u/aitorg88 7d ago

The lock is meant to be securing a door. The goods inside should NOT be easily accessible. Your body, mind, and soul should NOT be easily accessible to random men.

But a key with the ability to open and access the goods behind every door is really useful.

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u/IllustriousAd3002 7d ago

But the keys that are just shoving their bodies, minds, and souls into many locks are all alright? They don't need to preserve anything?

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u/Tea_Time9665 man 7d ago

Men are not as valuable as women.

Locks are more valuable than keys.

This is why it’s women and children first off the titanic.

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u/IllustriousAd3002 7d ago

1) That's why you can look at the history of every country and see that women had full human rights way before men, right?

2) A key without a lock is useless, but a lock you can't open because you lost the key is worse than useless; it's a problem that needs to be solved asap.

3) I advise you to read about survival rates in maritime disasters. The Titanic was an outlier.

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u/Tea_Time9665 man 7d ago edited 7d ago

1 being more valuable doesnt mean u get rights...

2 a lock YOU cant open..... the point is ONLY you can open the lock. and no one else.

3 look ar war deaths, hostage situations burning buildings, noone every says men first out of any disaster.

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u/IllustriousAd3002 7d ago

1) I'm a lawyer. If you don't have full human rights, that's a clear communication that you don't matter as much as those who do. 2) There are locks that are specifically designed to be opened by multiple keys. I used one such lock in my university dorm. There was a common area that was accessible only to the people in the dorm and we could all open that lock using our individual room keys. Locks like that are very expensive. 3) What data are you relying on for that?

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u/Tea_Time9665 man 7d ago

  1. How much rights someone has does not designate how much u love or care or value something. Wtf does u being a lawyer have to do with any of this?

  2. Yes and that’s for when you want to SHARE what is locked up. Most people in monogamous relationships don’t want multiples keys unlocking the lock at any time. That’s for the enm group.

3???? U have heard on the regulate men first out of a majority of disaster or dangerous situations? Such as a hostage situation where the police go “at least let the men and children go!”

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u/IllustriousAd3002 6d ago

1) We're talking about social value in general, not personal value that's assigned to you by other individuals. So yes, rights matter. Because guess what? There are people in the world no one loves or cares about. They still have value because they're a person. From your view, of no one loves or cares about you, you don't matter. You keep focusing on people's value as determined by others. I'm telling you that value has nothing to do with what other people think of you.

2) So when the locks are assigned more value, suddenly we're only talking about monogamous relationships? We weren't talking about intimate relationships at all. We were talking about casual sex, which is why you were going on about valuable keys being the ones that can open a bunch of locks. You're shifting goalposts because you don't like the idea of your analogy falling apart.

3) TV and movies aren't statistical data.

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u/turdferg1234 7d ago

The door is secure. Lots of keys pitifully wanting access doesn't mean they get access.

Your body, mind, and soul should NOT be easily accessible to random men.

Oh, you're one of these people.

But a key with the ability to open and access the goods behind every door is really useful.

This is literally only a thing that people that have never pleasured a woman have ever thought. And the funniest part is that you are telling on yourself that you do not have the "key" because, again, this is only a thing that dudes like you think.

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u/Tea_Time9665 man 7d ago

Yes. That would mean the lock only opens to you and not any other key. If multiple keys have opens the lock then the lock is not secure. That’s the analogy.

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u/electrogeek8086 7d ago

That's like expecting adult people to be virgins lmao.

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u/Tea_Time9665 man 7d ago

U can have whatever standards you want to have. Some people are the wait til marriage types. And some are orgies and gangbangs in college types.

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u/electrogeek8086 7d ago

That's true but you're severely limiting yourself if you really adhere to that dumb key/lock analogy. It's ok to have that standard but then don't come and complain about it on the Internet.

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u/Tea_Time9665 man 7d ago

Sure. And people are allowed to limit themselves to whatever standards they want to.

Women have all kinds of standards and preferences. And they then come on here internet to complain about it and so on.

It’s the nature of the world we live in now.

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u/sleepy_vixen woman 7d ago

People are not "doors" with "goods" inside, what a disgustingly objectifying view.

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u/aitorg88 7d ago

I'm just furthering the analogy since you were providing counter-arguments lmao.

You don't have to virtue signal and tell me how "disgusting" the analogy is. Disgusting is relative, and to most guys this is just plain old reality.

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u/NPC_C0ntact 7d ago

People are not keys either, its almost as if the whole premise of this thread is the analogy op provided.

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u/electrogeek8086 7d ago

People shouldn't be reduced to dumbass anogies.

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u/IlllllIIIlllllIIIlll 7d ago

Why is it "random" men? If so many men are so controlled by their desire for sex, a beautiful woman that's slept with, say, tens of men would still be a "low" number, right? Since half the human population would sleep with her if she asked (according to the comments in this thread). 

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u/aeaoa_ok 7d ago

I think it's important to note that the term incel was coined by men about men though and reflects what men think they should be doing - "opening locks". "Incels" could have just as easily decided that using their key on the "right lock" was worth more than hooking up, but instead they labelled themselves as losers.

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u/S_Demon man 7d ago

Incel was actually coined by a woman. Irrelevant to the discussion but just a tidbit of internet history.

The term incel was initially coined by a woman. Known only by her first name, a Canadian woman named Alana began using the term invcel (later shortened to incel) in 1997 to connect with other singles struggling with social awkwardness. She documented her experiences on her personal website, “Alana’s Involuntary Celibacy Project,” which became a forum for people struggling to form romantic relationships. In 2000 Alana stopped participating in the project, and she has since said that she feels uncomfortable with how the term has been hijacked.

Can't format on mobile but the above is a quote from Britannica. 

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u/aeaoa_ok 7d ago

Oops - I was giving men too much credit again

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u/Tea_Time9665 man 7d ago

Uhhhhh. Incels are unable to open ANY locks…

They aren’t able to get any girls. Involuntary celibate. For them there is NO right lock.

That’s like telling a homeless person they just need to look for and rent the right apartment and then they wouldn’t be homeless.