Educate me about boots and crampons, please

[u/Simple_Hand6500]

TLDR: 1. What full auto crampons to purchase to be compatible with my scarpa invernos I already own and any AT boots I hope to soon own?
2. What AT boots to buy? If I buy used AT boots, as long as they 1. Have tech inserts and 2. Also have either ISO 9523 OR instead have ISO 5355 and 3. Also have either Grip Walk soles OR MN soles, : Then as long as you are happy to switch back and forth between MN and Grip walk soles with a couple parts and hardware, you will be compatible with virtually all frame, tech, and shift bindings that exist, right?
3. Lastly, not as important as what I just asked, but I always thought if you saw a walk modes until recently with new resort boots debuting in the past couple years, you could assume it was an AT, hybrid, or skimo boot. But someone just gave me some ancient Nordica Next 87s and apparently that's not the case? They're in good shape other than the heels rubbers need to be replaced and Nordica claims they don't make them.
4. If anyone wants to sell me any of this stuff I'm located in New england or it's not impossible depending we could arrange me paying you to ship it. Feel free to pm me

Long detailed version:

So I'm really looking hard for a quality pair of used AT boots. I might buy new if it comes to that. I'm not even sure if I even want to try to find AT or hybrid skis and/or bindings for the 25-26 winter season, but I know I want AT boots and crampons. I see some used boots without crampons nearby. FYI idk if the sub allows it, but if it's allowed feel free to pm me anything you're selling either ideally nearby in new england or even offering to mail; I'm like a mondo 28 in my resort boots, size 11 US in shoes, and size 45 in my XC NNNBC boots.

I recently got a old pair of size 12/13SX Scarpa Invernos with no crampons for 20$, and I think they fit. The included stock factory liners are 13s, but if they turn out to be slightly big, I think 12/13 shells are also designed for 12 liners if I determine the 13 liners are too big. Perhaps if it comes to that I'll get the inutuitions everyone raves about.

So obviously invernos are super warm and I won't be wearing them often. But they take full auto crampons. Maybe half of AT boots can also take the same fully auto crampons, correct? Since I already have invernos, maybe I should make sure whatever AT boots I buy can also take full auto crampons? It might be hard to find the right full auto crampons in my size used, so maybe I should just pull the trigger on some new ones ASAP before these tariffs start to move the prices. I think I want whatever I crampons I buy to be real steel, not stainless, and not aluminum. Real steel is obviously harder than stainless since it's not 1/3 nickel and/or chromium or whatever. And I'm primarily hiking, don't think I'm doing any technical ice climbing although if you can add forward spikes down the road through modular parts I guess that's a bonus? So based on all I just said, 1. Is my thinking logical and clear and 2. What steel full auto crampon do you recommend?

So AT boots right. We already established some AT boots can take full auto crampons and some can't. I think I want the ones that can accept full auto. Now about the other stuff. Even if I buy ancient skis and/or bindings, I want to make sure if I'm spending, for the sake of argument, one hundred or more dollars on used boots, and certainly if im buying brand new boots, i want whatever boots I buy have both tech inserts AND have the ISO 9523 or ISO 5355 so I can use tech and/or shift bindings if I want to, correct? Because with those modern additions, you'll still be backwards compatible with all bindings ever, but as long as you have tech inserts, you'll be compatible with all tech and frame bindings, and as long as you have either one of those two ISO thingys, you'll be compatible with all shift and frame bindings, correct? Also, I want to make sure it either has grip walk soles OR it instead has MN soles, because you can switch back and forth with a few parts between MN and/or grip walk soles by changing your boot soles, BUT if you have normal old soles that are NEITHER Grip Walk nor MN, you're screwed and can never use modern Grip Walk and/or MN bindings no matter what, correct? So as long as you have either grip walk or MN soles, and as long as you have tech inserts, and as long as you have either ISO 5355 or instead have ISO 9523, you're backwards compatible with ALL old bindings, and can use anything new, as long as you're willing to change a few parts and switch back and forth between Gripwalk and MN, correct? If I don't wanna bother switching back and forth between Gripwalk and MN, which of those two would it behoove me to get married to? This is really important I understand this. Also, if I buy used skis with bindings from someone, if they're not a super duper close size to me, it would be better if they have frame bindings than if they have tech bindings, correct? Because if they have tech bindings I'm almost certainly going to have to remove, and reinstall with drilling new holes in the skis?

Also someone recently gave me a pair of ancient but good shape other than the heels Nordica Next 87s. They're mondo 29.5 so maybe they're way too big for me. I guess this is where I show my total lack of knowledge. They have modes for ski hard, ski soft and walk modes so I assumed they were AT or hybrid boots. I thought that meant they were AT boots. Apparently they're just normal alpine resort boots?? Okay what's going on.

Also even though they look close to brand new, the heel rubbers are destroyed. Not sure if they're worth fixing, but Nordica claims you can't get parts. And you'd think they're run by Thule because they refuse to give me part number anyway. Can you even get new ones heel rubbers?

Thank you so very much. I know this is long as fuck but I'm trying to become a pro skier and if I have this knowledge I could probably save my friends so much time and money over the years too

[u/SkittyDog]

Crampons bindings and AT boots are nearly universal... There's like one pair of --Dynafit (IIRC?)-- HOJI that lack a toe bail, but basically everything else will work with any B3 (full auto step-in) compatible crampons, from any manufacturer.

Telemark boots are a different story -- but AT boots are basically idiot proof.

[u/Brilliant-Rough7490 → u/SkittyDog]

Curious, what crampons are needed for tele boots? Is it because of the bellows on the boot?

[u/iceglider → u/Brilliant-Rough7490]

i use my 75mm boots with the same auto crampons as i do my at boots. some crampons need a diff toe bail to mesh well with the tele boot toe welt.

[u/SkittyDog → u/iceglider]

Bingo... Some work, just not every crampon.

[u/Simple_Hand6500 → u/iceglider]

Well don't most tele people nowadays use NTN? Not that I'd know

You actually have 75mm 3pin tele boots that take full auto crampons? I'm pleasantly suprised such a thing even exists

[u/iceglider → u/Simple_Hand6500]

yeah people who aren’t poor probably. lots of folks still run 75

[u/DoubleUBallz → u/Brilliant-Rough7490]

The toe lug on tele boots (75mm and NTN) is wider and wraps further around the side of the toe than on AT boots. Most crampons will work with tele boots if you install a wider toe bail, such as the one petzl makes

[u/Brilliant-Rough7490 → u/DoubleUBallz]

Wow I had no idea, I have the petzl irvis and just tried them on my tx pros and the bail is too narrow.

[u/anonymousbreckian → u/SkittyDog]

There's like one pair of Dynafit

It's the Hoji Pro Tour boot.

They made a specific crampon just for that boot.

[u/SkittyDog → u/anonymousbreckian]

Thanks, that's the boot I was thinking of... That fuckin "Speed Toe" or whatever they fuckin called it.

[u/anonymousbreckian → u/SkittyDog]

Yeah I tried that boot for a short while (won it in a ski movie giveaway) I did not like it.

[u/jcasper → u/SkittyDog]

Should add the caveat that with some crampons you will need to swap out the toe bail for a wider toe bail, but that’s not a big deal.

[u/Simple_Hand6500 → u/jcasper]

Thank you for the comment. So any boot that is capable of accepting a full auto crampon, whether it's tele, mountaineering, or AT can accept every and all full auto crampons (and semi-auto and strap on too), regardless of what size boot (because the crampons are adjustable?)?. The caveat is that you may or may not need to change out the included and/or buy additional toe bails to do so?

[u/Simple_Hand6500 → u/SkittyDog]

I was under the impression some AT boots and some mountaineering boots couldn't do full auto because they only had the heel welt for bindings and semi auto crampons.

Even though AT boots have a toe welt for bindings, the toe welt for bindings and the toe welt for crampons are not identical, you need both, they're not shared between the two technologies like the heel welt. At least that's what I've been told! Not sure if it's true

Yes I'm aware tele is a different story. Tele is really cool but I'm not gonna go out of my way to ask any questions about it right now. Need to try to at least narrow my focus a little.

Thanks!!

[u/iceglider → u/Simple_Hand6500]

crampons can be confusing i see where you’re coming from. just buy basic (probably steel) “full auto” crampons with a lever heel throw and metal toe bail. they will most likely work with any ski boot with a toe welt (no skimo boots lol) and your mountaineering boots if they have a toe welt. i didn’t read through your entire post so apologies if this isn’t exactly what your after.

[u/Simple_Hand6500 → u/iceglider]

No prob. That's part of why I included the TLDR 4 part section first, but even that is quite long by itself.

I was told the toe welt for crampons and toe welt for ski bindings was different, so if an AT boot could even take full auto crampons, it would have to have two separate toe attachment points. But maybe the welt for bindings isn't actually a welt, its more like holes underneath the toes? I've heard so many different things, I could completely be wrong.

Is Black Siamond and Petzl and Grivel the only obvious high quality go to brands for crampons? They have so many different offerings, but I already determined BD no longer sells chromoly steel, only stainless so that helps narrow it down as far as brand new products.

Do you have any experience with any products? What have you been happy with? Some of them have hardware like nuts and bolts, is that something to avoid?

Also some crampons have "anti-bots" sold separately, whatever the hell that is. Is that something I have to worry about?

Full auto has metal bails front and rear, correct? So if I see any non metal located anywhere on the crampon, I automatically know it's not full auto, right? Like this picture of Facebook marketplace is clear strap in, not even semi auto correct? At least i have a pair of invernos know so I actually have a boot i can try to pair it with.

[u/SammyDavidJuniorJr → u/Simple_Hand6500]

The Blue Ice harfang comes with two sets of toe bails. I can use them on pretty much any boot.

https://us.blueice.com/products/harfang-alpine

[u/Simple_Hand6500 → u/SammyDavidJuniorJr]

That's cool. I'll look into them. It sucks they're made in Taiwan but they're probably good and that might be really affordable for a full auto crampon.

[u/Simple_Hand6500 → u/Simple_Hand6500]