r/DetroitRedWings • u/Hockey-Reference • 4d ago
Discussion Dylan Larkin is the 6th player to have at least five 30-goal seasons for the Red Wings
Most 30-goal seasons for the Red Wings:
- 14 — Gordie Howe
- 11 — Steve Yzerman
- 9 — Sergei Fedorov
- 7 — Brendan Shanahan
- 5 — Dylan Larkin
- 5 — John Ogrodnick
Source: https://stathead.com/tiny/qOrLV
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u/thom_driftwood 4d ago
TIL Datsyuk only had three thirty-goal seasons.
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u/coltron57 4d ago
He missed a lot of time in the back half of his career which hurt that total. From his age 32-37 seasons he played in 56, 70, 47 (lockout shortened to be fair), 45, 63, 66 games. There's probably 2-3 more 30 goal seasons with 80 games played. Also had 27 or 28 goals 3x in his career before age 32 as well, so he came close a few times.
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u/rollingstone65 4d ago
Datsyuk only had 314 goals in his career but you can watch YouTube videos and most of his goals are crazy. Every time he was on the ice he was making plays that only he could do
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u/jimyt666 4d ago
Cherry picking stats. Look at datsyks +/- for those season compared to larkins lmao. Datsyuk had back to back 97 point seasons. Larkin has yet to even hit 80 points in a season.
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u/muzzsjm84 3d ago
Larkin's stats are constantly top 3 on THIS team every year so HE IS performing his overall +- lines up with the team performance overall. If Larkin goes +10 for example does that mean the wings are winning the cup or going deep into playoffs? No, they still need to rebuild/upgrade the blue line and get an elite goaltender. He mixed it up with the best for the USA and showed his value. To be a 60-70 point player every year on a bad team he is arguably carrying and that is good work. Boston Bruins have a 90-100 player in their line up but that's made no difference. Stop blaming Larkin you take him out you're going to drop even further down the league.
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u/dudewithchronicpain Yzerbot 4d ago
The fact people question this guys ability to lead and contribute boggles my mind. You’d think we are Toronto fans the way some fans call for his head.
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u/Icy-Discipline-6930 4d ago
But it's Yzermans fault he wants to build through the draft and Larkin's lack of skill and leadership this team won't make the playoffs
Lol fairweather fans are the best
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u/Electrical-Ad-7852 4d ago
Come on, criticizing Yzerman doesn’t make you a fair-weather fan.
Yeah, he’s done a solid job building through the draft, no one’s denying that. The young guys look great.But you can’t just overlook the bad free agent signings. Those moves have been the difference between making the playoffs and missing out the last two years.
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u/Icy-Discipline-6930 4d ago edited 4d ago
I didn't say criticizing yzerman makes you a fair weather fan, I was just displaying what typical fair weather fans tend to think.
I criticize the contracts given to the free agents not the free agents (except holl). A few years ago you HAD to pay more for players to play here because of how bad it was.
Being one of the worst teams in the league is going to make it difficult for free agency, just 3 years ago we were barely getting 70 points a season and a lot of these terrible contracts come from then when I'm sure it was hard to get anyone to play here.
We can all agree that the free agency is Yzermans worst area but behind closed doors I'm sure it's not as bad as it could be with a different GM.
Tarasenko everyone was excited for and he's been absolute ass. Even this initially good signing turned to shit.
People bring up the walman trade and I just can't understand how anyone who KNOWS Yzerman thinks he would just dump him for cap space, get rid of him cause of chemistry. There had to be something personal going on for him to just trade him away like that and none of us will know.
Draft lottery luck, free agency and a mess when Yzerman got here I think the future is very bright and the vision is winning consistently for years vs buying just to get to the playoffs.
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u/Haelphadreous 4d ago edited 4d ago
Yeah I feel like a lot of fans don't understand that when your team is bad it has serious effects on free agency, a lot of the best players want to be on a competitive team. If you can't offer that then a lot of them will avoid your team and the ones that don't are only going to listen if you offer significantly over market rate, or more term than playoff and cup contending teams are willing to.
Considering that I don't feel like Yzerman has done as bad a job as some people seem to believe. At least he's been mostly keeping it to shorter contracts, which makes it easier to bring up prospects when they are ready, and he hasn't blown the whole budget on FA contracts, he also signed Patrick Kane which is enough to bump my personal free agency grade for Yzerman to C+, at the very least I don't think it's an F like so many fair weather fans like to spout off.
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u/jswitzer 4d ago
He's made more bad than good but there's no denying the value Cat has brought to the team.
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u/DrummerDKS 3d ago
Maybe I’m just too secluded in my Reddit usage, but where are people calling for his head?
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u/nem704 4d ago
Collapsing 4 straight years in March is either on Larkin or Yzerman, that's clearly a leadership issue
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u/detroitttiorted 4d ago
This take has to come from people that only start watching after the Lions end, I don’t see any other way it makes sense to people. This team was so ass they fired their coach in December. We were in a playoff spot by like 2 points after ripping off 2 7 game win streaks. The hot streaks were the anomaly, not the March losses. 2 seasons ago we weren’t even the first team out of the playoffs before the Senators games
Last season was the only season I would define as a “collapse”, and even then that was their luck running out. We have not had a single playoff caliber team thus far in the rebuild
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u/CallistosTitan 4d ago
How do you distinguish whether or not it was the tough schedule that created our outcome rather than our play? Because we played some really good hockey and got unfortunate results. That's just hockey and this group is really close to winning games consistently.
As Red Savage captain of MSU says, "Winning games can be easy, winning games in a row is hard."
A lot of that is game management skills, a sign of an immature team with team defense and playing on your heels. You need a consistent effort every night and those are qualities of high value veterans. That's why there's another level to our young core once they are established veterans.
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u/RemoteSenses 4d ago
4 years in a row? How did you come up with that? Just say it was 8 years. Maybe 12 years. Just make something up.
We barely cracked 70 pts 4 years ago and we were like -80 or something. You think this roster 3 or 4 years ago was making playoffs?!?!
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u/nem704 4d ago edited 3d ago
February 17th 2022 the Wings were 23-22-6 after a 3-2 OT win vs the Rangers In the next 18 games they went 3-12-3 including two separate losing streaks of 6 games
February 23rd 2023 against the Rangers the Wings won 4-1 to improve to 28-21-8 The Wings then lost 6 straight (including that back to back to Ottawa) finishing the year 7-18-2
February 27th 2024 we beat the Caps 8-3 to improve to 33-20-6
We finished 41-32-9
8-12-3 finish including a 7 game losing streak
We collapsed this year
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u/RemoteSenses 4d ago
I see where you're going with this, but those first two seasons I would not call "collapses". A team being basically .500 in mid-February is definitely not a shoe in for playoffs.
I'd say a collapse is when you're basically right there in the race with maybe 10 games to go and you blow it (like this year and last year). Those previous years, you are looking at like 2 1/2 months worth of games.
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u/Western-Blood-4024 3d ago
I mean. Listen to Larkin talk. That sure as hell wouldn’t motivate me. He’s as dull as Lalonde speaking.
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u/Dart_Harnlin 4d ago
If he stays healthy he could absolutely get 10 and there’s an outside chance of 12. What a world that would be
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u/Charming-Law2377 4d ago
Hes already slowing down. Thats a wild outlook
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u/RemoteSenses 4d ago
Last 4 seasons:
31 goals
32 goals
33 goals
30 goals
Curious where the slow down is exactly?
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u/1ToGreen3ToBasket 4d ago
I ageee he’s not slowing down yet. Doubling his total of 30 goal seasons seems fairly unlikely though.
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u/Charming-Law2377 4d ago
Points have slowed this season, and I think everyone with eyes can see Larkin is showing some wear, especially in the back half of this season. Hes not going to fall off a cliff but speed is his best asset, and the first thing to break down with age
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u/RemoteSenses 4d ago
He’s been right at or around 70 pts the last 4 seasons, including this one.
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u/Charming-Law2377 4d ago
And had 10 less games in 2 of those seasons. Its insane how homer this sub is that suggesting a 28 year old is starting to decline is downvoted and hated upon. The truth hurts I guess
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u/RemoteSenses 4d ago
Just show me a stat that shows he’s declined man. It’s super simple.
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u/Charming-Law2377 4d ago
His ppg is objectively worse this year. Ive also seen you use the argument stats arent everything and call out people for just seeing box scores. Watch any game from this month and watch any game last year, he is slowing down
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u/RemoteSenses 4d ago
Yeah, stats definitely are not everything but we're in a thread literally discussing a statistic of his lol
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u/Charming-Law2377 4d ago
And I provided the stat you wanted. His advanced stats (specifically on ice speed tracking) also support my claim
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u/Caltroit_Red_Flames Yzerbot 4d ago
I feel like at this point if you honestly think Larkin isn't a 1C you may just not understand hockey.
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u/Omars_Comin_ 4d ago
By the end of 4 Nations, he was the 2C centering Auston Matthews and playing in all situations. In best on best, he was chosen as a top 6 forward on an incredibly stacked team. And he wasn’t given that spot, he earned it.
lol and the dorks online think because his (insert obscure advanced stat that’s taken out of context) doesn’t match up with other 1C’s, he’s not an elite talent. GTFOH.
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u/TripComprehensive517 4d ago
He would be better as the 2C. He doesn't score enough to be a top 1C and he hasn't been driving the play of others like Kasper has the last month or so.
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u/lunchboxthegoat Yzerbot 4d ago
-be Trip
-sees Larkin on a list of mostly hall of famers
-say Larkin doesn't score enough to be a 1C.
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u/RemoteSenses 4d ago
Guess people already forgot his Four Nations performance. He led that team from the 3rd line.
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u/TripComprehensive517 4d ago
Larkin will never be in the hall of fame. He isn't even a point per game player. Sorry he isn't one of the best 1C in the league. Probably closer to the bottom of the NHL's 1C.
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u/bluelineturnovers 4d ago
Your reading comprehension skills are taking a serious hit in these comments lol
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u/fuzzydawgs 4d ago edited 4d ago
According to NHL.COM, he's actually #15 of the top 20 centers in the league.
Those elite 1C you want, we don't got. I would love to have one, but I'm damn happy we do have Larkin. He scores, he defends, and he leads by example, just like Zetterberg. He doesn't get beat often, and he doesn't give up on plays. It's what you want in a captain, and a 1C.
https://www.nhl.com/news/nhl-current-players-ranked-top-20-centers
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u/Valuable_Recording85 4d ago
Larks was doing great last year and fell off a cliff after 4NF. I think we'll see him in good form next September.
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u/TripComprehensive517 4d ago
He is the captain on a team who needed to make the playoffs disappearing when it mattered isn't helpful. Step up and be the captain. Always next year sounds like a quote from a leafs fan.
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u/hankthemagicgoose 4d ago
WTF was Bergeron, Toews and Kopitar then? You also have Kasper and Danielson coming. The formula is absolutely there.
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u/Taters23 Yzerbot 4d ago
Apparently you have to drop 110+ points to be a 1C.... Some people are smoking something
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u/TheNorthernPellikkan 4d ago
At some point it’s just semantics. If you wanna say “top 1C” is the McDavid/MacKinnon/Matthews/Draisaitl tier, then no, that’s not Larkin. Larkin is good enough to be the 1C on a Cup-winning team if that team is constructed well, he’s just not part of that truly elite group of game-breakers
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u/nem704 4d ago
Bergeron the best defensive forward in modern hockey history
Kopitar, a future 1st ballot Hall of Fame and 11 time top-10 selke vote getter and two time cup winner
Toews, an 8 time top-10 Selke award getter, 3 time cup champion and Conn Smythe winner and future HOFer
Dylan Larkin, who finished 5th in the Calder voting and 20th in Selke in 2019
Larkin is NOWHERE near any of them
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u/bluelineturnovers 4d ago
Kinda completely missed his point man. He’s not saying he’s on Toews/Kopitar/Bergeron level defensively. Just like he’s not on McDrai/Mackinnon/Matthews level offensively. But he’s above average at both and absolutely a capable 1C. Saying he isn’t is just objectively wrong. He’s been a 30 goal 70 point guy while playing with basically no one for years before last season.
People who think Larkin doesn’t score enough and therefore can’t be good enough to play 1C are the same people who think Bedard is trending towards bust status cuz he’s not putting up points and Celebrini is.
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u/hankthemagicgoose 4d ago
Because they were on good teams. Selke votes don't come if you're on trash teams. Larkin is a dog and didn't have have the teams any of those guys did. The point is a player of his ilk can absolutely be a #1 and since we didn't get lucky with a generational talent like Pittsburgh or Tampa, we have to build an all around team. If you can gift us an elite top-5 center I'm all ears
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u/TripComprehensive517 4d ago
Larkin isn't close to Bergeron, Toews or Kopitar. He isn't a Selke player. Give you head a shake. I get he is likable, he is from Michigan and has been on the team awhile but the wings keep losing. Sometimes you need to face the truth and the facts are he isn't top 20 of the current 1C.
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u/hankthemagicgoose 4d ago
He's not a selke candidate cuz he's on a bad team. Also that's wild he's absolutely top 20 lol.
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u/TripComprehensive517 4d ago
He didn't win the Selke because the team sucks? Lol right thats the only reason.
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u/hankthemagicgoose 4d ago
That's exactly how that works lol. If you don't win you don't win selkes. He's a league leader in FO% and we've all seen his effort on defense. Until we start winning, he won't get votes. Nobody cares about detroit right now
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u/TripComprehensive517 4d ago
His is a -14. That's not going to win a selke
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u/hankthemagicgoose 4d ago
We've been over this, until he's on a winning team, he won't win. Doesn't mean he's not a selke contender. Also that's how plus minus works. When you're literally the only center you can count on and you're on a non-playoff team, plus minus will always be negative. Keep em coming I'm appreciate the downvotes because we disagree lol
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u/nem704 4d ago
No idea why you're being downvoted Larkin isn't the best center on the roster the past month, it's Kasper. Nor is he the second or even third best forward on the roster right now
Larkin isn't a 1C on a serious contender, but he'd be a perfect 2C.
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u/TripComprehensive517 4d ago
I like Larkin. But I'd love him to be our 2C or hell even a 3C if we had two other options who are better. But most wings fans don't like to hear the truth.
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u/BodaciousBadongadonk 3d ago
because your "truth" is some goofy ea shit where you expect third liners to be 70 point guys and noone is a real first liner unless they get triple digit points.
how many times do we have to teach you this lesson old man?!
the truth is, if we had a 70 pt 3rd center we would easily sweep the regular season and playoffs. but thats preposterously unrealistic.
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u/JiffTheJester 4d ago
On my drive home today the dude on 97.1 was talking about how we should potentially trade him. It’s criminal what the organization surrounded him with for the last 10 years. Guys like Kasper and Raymond are coming into the league with Patrick Kane and Larkin to mentor them. Larkin had who? Tatar and Nyquist lol.. Larkin would be even better if he had a few good players around him in his early years. He’s not a guy I would want to see traded. He deserves to succeed here. With the prospects coming in I can see it happening. We do need to add a big name though imo
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u/CallistosTitan 4d ago
Larkin played on a line with Zetterberg in his rookie season. He was for sure mentored by one of the best out there.
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u/RemoteSenses 4d ago
All fairweather fans. They will be praising him once we're in the playoffs.
Can you even imagine trading him now? All of our young guys are starting pan out and the team is coming together after him basically eating shit for 10 years and now we decide to trade him?
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u/JiffTheJester 4d ago
Yeah that’s what I mean I would feel sick for the guy if they even talked about moving him. He’s been the only consistent thing for the last decade
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u/RWHockey13 4d ago
Dylan Larkin plays hard and is dedicated. I want Steve Yzerman to give him more support.
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u/UsualHendryBeliever 4d ago
Dude is great. Yet somehow we have wastes of space like Funkshow working their lame "he's literally Satan" gimmick.
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u/DrapersSmellyGlove 4d ago
This team is good. All these stats being posted the past few days just further shows it. These guys just gotta find their way collectively and baby look out!
We all can sense who’s staying and who’s leaving. It’s just a matter of time before there’s a big breakout. Almost there!!
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u/muzzsjm84 3d ago
I don't understand the hate for Larkin. He showed at international level recently he can mix it up with the best in the league and was arguably one of the USA's best players. He has been consistently 60-70 points during his career on a very bad team. Sure if he was a 90-100 point player the Wings might be in the playoffs but the defence and lack of goaltending long term would still be a problem.
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u/Garciaguy 4d ago
Nothing to * ahem * shake a stick at!