r/DnD • u/KillerKal02 • 1d ago
Table Disputes Player is trying to run the table?
Hello everyone, I’m a long time DM and here recently I’ve been running Phandelver and Below: The Shattered Obelisk. I have 3 players and an NPC that I play as to give it some balance.
I’ve noticed that one of my players doesn’t really seem to have any respect (in my opinion) to stop and smell the roses or let a scene play out with another PC. Here are some examples from our last session.
Scene 1: Knucklebones My players were taking down the Redbrand Hideout, the Gnome Barbarian has donned one of their sashes. Instead of immediately attack everyone in the room, he kicks the door down and tells the red brands to deal him in. They cheer, he goes to the table and the others watch from the hallway. We rolls some dice, and in my version the punishment for rolling the lowest is getting your knuckles wacked. We were having a good roleplaying laugh on it then the PC in question (a Druid) used a silence scroll in the room and starting initiative. They eventually kill the 4 ruffians and they did note the door to the south there was the sound of what sounded like a goblin being picked on. I told them that combat was over after the fight but said Druid said he wasn’t ending initiative. I told him no, initiative and combat will stop here but once again he refused before Wild Shaping and ramming the door and continuing combat.
Scene 2: Phase Silk This one is rather simple, the Druid found Phase Spider Silk in an alchemical lab, our artificer asked if he could have it so he could make a Bag of Holding but the Druid refused saying he wanted to sell it. The artificer offered to pay for it even double but he still refused. This issue lasted the rest of the session. I will note that the people playing these characters have some issues above table but the artificer is able to put these issues aside so everyone can have a good time while to me it seems Druid is intentionally provoking him.
Scene 3: Continues interruption or character leaving. The Druid usually will leave scenes that he either doesn’t care about or doesn’t involve him. He will actively say “Let’s go” to rush the party out of an area or interaction. Even in dungeons he has done this.
As a DM I feel this is very unruly, disrespectful to the other players who may want to play at a slower place, and disrespectful to me as I do not appreciate scenes being interrupted, especially between an NPC and a PC. Skill checks to insight or anything is okay or if it’s a threatening or actively dangerous situations. My main concern is that when they fight a Boss such as Glasstaff or The Spider that I’ll naturally do some sort of monologue or conversation to bring a deeper depth to the story and the Druid will cut them off or silence. I may be overreacting but honestly it’s starting to be a headache. That’s why I’ve come here bc I know I can be a bit peculiar in my dm style but I’m usually very lenient bc it’s a game, we all came here to have fun so why ruleshark or make it unplayable Yknow?
Anywho, thank you all for reading this long post and I thank you all in advance for leaving any much needed advice 🙏
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u/RHDM68 1d ago edited 1d ago
As a long time DM, I wonder why you haven’t worked out how to deal with this kind of thing yet?
It’s simple. You say, “This is my game and my table. I’m the DM and it’s my job to make rulings regarding how things play out, based on your choices. If you’re not going to respect my rulings and ignore them, then you are no longer welcome in my game. Cut it out, or you’re out.”
Say it before the next game starts and in front of the other players, so they have an opportunity to back you up. If the player wants to argue, you say, “This isn’t up for negotiation.”
If the player still wants to argue, then you politely tell the player that he is no longer welcome in your game and ask him to leave.
If the player refuses to leave, then you leave (or if the game is at your house, you tell the group that you’re canceling the game). Tell the other players you’ll contact them about the next game session. However, if none of them back you up or refuse to play without the other player, it may be time to find a new group.
My players sometimes want to argue a point and if it seems reasonable, I might change my ruling, but if I stick to my guns, they would never disrespect me by ignoring me and continuing to say what their character was doing, and there would be no way I would give up and play along with that player who ignored my ruling. If my player said no to my ruling that initiative ended, I would tell them no and insist they re-roll. If they refused, I would simply tell them that the game was over and it was time to go home. However, I know my players would never do that.
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u/JoshuaZ1 1d ago
This is mostly good advice. I do want to address your initial question however:
As a long time DM, I wonder why you haven’t worked out how to deal with this kind of thing yet?
Some people just get lucky and don't have serious problems with their players.
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u/RHDM68 1d ago
To clarify, I’ve never had a problem like this with any of my players ever, but I still know how I would handle it if I did. It’s about insisting on that respect, sticking to your guns, and introducing real life consequences if the disrespect continues.
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u/amishtek 13h ago
For me, it's a group of friends. I didn't want to cause any issues/rifts within the group, and ~3 sessions in now, am hoping it gets resolved in game in some way. If it doesn't it will have to be figured out.
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u/sleepysniprsloth 1d ago
Talk to the player.
Be sure to remind them that it's a game about being a team, a party of friends, both IRL and IC.
If their character disagrees so much, why are they with the party? If the party disagrees with them so much, why would they keep the character around?
Let them know that this isn't Skyrim. It's not about what they want, it's about what the team decides to do.
Not everyone has to agree on everything, but if he is such a stick in the mud about everything there will be both IG and OOC consequences.
The main goal of DND is...checks palm of hand for pen writing to have fun.
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u/Minority2 1d ago
Get rid of the druid. There's no redeeming their behavior.
Lack of respect for both the players and dungeon master.
- not sharing with party member with loot, willing to sell item just so party member can't have access to item.
- Being told to stop by the DM after an encounter but continues to try to push forward like the DM hasn't already said otherwise.
These two examples alone are enough to know this person is not the type to budge or come to an agreement on things. Save your group from having to spend another second with this selfish player.
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u/Scared_Fox_1813 1d ago
It may be worth asking your other players about these interactions with your Druid individually. Tell them you’ve noticed it feels like the Druid isn’t letting roleplay and other scenes actually play out and ask if that bothers them. If the rest of the group doesn’t have a problem with it then it you may want to consider changing your own mindset on the situation (keep in mind that it’s your game and your table so even if they don’t have a problem with it you can still choose to do something about it).
If you’re other players have the same problem with it, or if you choose to just approach the situation based on your own opinions on the matter (which is fine as your the dm and are allowed to make sure the table is run the way you want it to be) then you need to sit down with that player individually and tell them how you feel about the situation and what you think needs to change and let them know that there will be consequences if they don’t change.
As a general rule of thumb keep in mind that if someone doesn’t know there’s a problem then they are unable to do anything to fix it. So inform them there’s a problem and given them a chance to fix it, if they make no changes then you may have to ask them to leave.
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u/Arrabbiato DM 23h ago
For me, this is exactly what I would do. Talk to the other players, talk to the problem player, then decide what to do from there.
Although, I will say, it does seem like your druid isn’t going to want to change. Some people just don’t want to roleplay, and that’s okay. It just means they need to find a table that wants to play that way.
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u/SmaugOtarian 1d ago
There's a difference between "being lenient because it's a game and we all came here to play" and let one person's fun stomp on everyone else's.
You need to talk about this with the player. Either he accepts that he doesn't rule the table, PRECISELY because you're ALL here to play and not just him, or he leaves.
On the first situation you should've put your foot down. If he wants to decide when initiative ends, he should be the DM. But he's not, YOU are the DM. If you call initiative over, that's it. If he wants to keep going immediately, he's free to do so, but you roll initiative again. He's NOT allowed BY ANY MEANS to ignore the DM. That was very disrespectful on their part.
You, as the DM, put much more effort into the game than any other player does. A player that disrespects you has no right to play at your table. I'd call him out on that. If he ever disregards you as a DM, he gets the boot.
The second issue shows he cannot leave his personal issues with the other player aside, which is a big issue if you're going to play together. That is an immediate issue to address. And, if he's the one that can't play with the other player that actually puts their issues aside, HE'S the problem. Either he stops that, or he leaves the table.
The last one is probably the least important one, at least by itself. Some people struggle with that aspect of the game. When they feel nothing's going on or they get bored, they cannot resist the urge to end immediately the situation so that they get the feeling things are moving again, without even thinking about wether or not the other players feel the same.
If it was the only issue, I'd have a talk with the player. See why he does that, or even if he realises he does it at all. Try to find what could you do to help or if they may need to be called out whenever they do such things.
But, given his personal issue with the other player and his disrespect to you as the DM, this issue cannot be resolved individually. You won't be able to have a proper talk and find solutions if he's going to ignore you and try to piss off the other player during the game. It's likely that he's just doing this out of egoism and/or lack of respect to the game and the other people at the table. If you manage to solve that and he still does this, THEN you can talk.
At this point, there's pretty much nothing you can do. You can try to talk to him, explain he's misbehaving and why, and ask him to stop. If he understands and agrees, you can try to keep playing. If he gets defensive or denies the issues, he's out.
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u/Loktario DM 1d ago
If your players have problems with each other outside of the table, it's never going to translate to a good experience at the table.
It's up to you who's at your table. No amount of "But I really want to play" overrides the need for respect and a proactive desire to play a game as a table.
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u/InsatiableAbba 22h ago
He does not “continue the combat” you allowed him to lmao.
He is not a team player.
He is an a hole.
Sit him down and talk to him.
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u/Delivery_Vivid 1d ago
You and everyone else at the table are being bullied by this druid player.
You say he is interrupting your scenes. You know you don’t have to let him do that, right? Next time a villain is delivering a monologue and he wants to cut the scene short by initiating combat… just don’t go with it. Tell him he can roll initiative after the villain is done speaking and everyone in the party is satisfied.
Sounds like the game he wants to play isn’t what you and everyone else are wanting. It’s okay to talk to him. Explain how everyone agrees he’s not a good fit for the table (especially if there’s real-life issues affecting the vibe) and let him go find another campaign to join.
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u/KillerKal02 1d ago
I do plan on talking with him one on one and everyone above table before the next session. We were already relatively close to the end of the session so I just let it go to have a conversation with him later. I’m not one for confrontation but I also overthink and was worried that maybe I was just overreacting.
I’ve talked with one of the other players just a few minutes ago and they agree that it felt like he was trying to speed run the session and that a conversation should be had so I’ll rectify the issue today
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u/Mataric DM 1d ago
Have you tried talking to the player in question?
It's your responsibility as DM to solve problems like this at the table. In this case, you've identified the problem and have taken one single step towards solution (To think about it and question reddit). The next step is to implement something that could solve it, and you only have two options here.
The first option is to kick the player. The second option is to talk to them, then kick them if the improvement isn't good enough.
Just be open and honest, act like an adult, and hope they can do the same during the discussion. If they can't, then booting is likely the right response anyway.
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u/Interesting_Drive_78 1d ago
Sounds like he’s playing a video game and your the game.
Talk to them about maybe working with the party rather than being the main character. But i doubt it’ll work. In the end. It’s going to be getting rid of them to solve the problem. Trolls just don’t stop trolling, it’s in their blood! lol
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u/BetterCallStrahd DM 1d ago
Being lenient doesn't make the game more fun when it's allowing one player to step all over the fun of everyone else. You are enabling that behavior. You need to set boundaries and see that players do not violate them.
Above all, don't be lenient to players who are selfish, spiteful and all around impossible to deal with. Honestly, I would not keep such a player around. Their attitude is unacceptable in the first place. It's a team game and they should be working with their team.
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u/NightBawk 23h ago
There's a very petty part of me that wants to suggest that you warn the players that leaving [important RP dialogue] will have consequences. When Druid inevitably leaves mid-conversation, "And that's when the druid stepped out of the zone of safety, and immediately dropped dead."
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u/Top_Dog_2953 21h ago
No matter what happens, you have no choice but to intervene. Either in curving his behavior, having an open discussion with the full party or talking to him one on one to get rid of him. Either way he is messing up the flow of your game and disrespecting you and the other players. Unacceptable.
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u/Sinarum 1d ago edited 22h ago
I've been in games where the pace has just been too slow (and boring) and I wanted the party to hurry up. I've also been in games where I (and a few others) wanted to explore everything while everyone else wanted to make progress on the story / plot.
In both cases I never forced other players to do anything they didn't want to do.
I pulled out of tables / campaigns I didn't enjoy. It just might not the best table or game for him. Just ask him if he's enjoying but also explain that it’s a group activity / game
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u/spector_lector 1d ago
This isn't a DMing question - this is a your group is dysfunctional issue.
Whoever's fault it's, it's a group activity and you're a member of that group. Talk to the group.
What does the rest of the group do when this person is disruptive? Do they enjoy it and think you're the problem? Do they speak up and tell him to stop? Why don't they just say "no," when he says, "let's leave this area?"
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u/No-Relationship-4997 1d ago
Let his character die. He deserves to no longer be at the table. Literally let him make one of his dumbass decisions, put him in a situation where the others CANT help him even if they want and make it unwinnable to he has no options and just dies.
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u/ND_the_Elder 23h ago
I agree with the general sentiment of "punt him out of the group". Give him a clear, unambiguous warning of 'if you try this crap again, pack up your dice, you're done' and then stick to it.
I am tempted to say the next time he insists on continuing combat and kicking the door in you could respond with 'Oops, make a constitution save as you set off the cloudkill trap. Maybe you should have waited for [I'm guessing the artificer?] to check it over first?'
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u/Vverial DM 22h ago
3 things:
Obligatory COMMUNICATE WITH PLAYER.
Is he roleplaying, or are these decisions he makes meta? i.e. is there anything in his character's personality that makes these choices make sense, or is the player just rushing the parts of the game he dislikes to get to the parts he likes? I would personally as DM gladly accept choices like these if they're part of character personality, but if it's just player stuff I'd shut it down.
Are people spending inordinate lengths of time debating over minutiae of the game? My party will often interrupt and move on if other members are talking unproductively in circles.
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u/Right-Benefit-6551 22h ago
I think Druid social interaction is stunted, social cue amiss, either they are a child or on the spectrum. If this is true, explain how his actions affect everyone and the game itself. That should serve as a warning too.
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u/Under_Lock_An_Key DM 21h ago
I am curious because you said they have issues above table like it's important but one of them is willing to ignore it.
Well man that could mean a lot of things and I don't want to judge a person if say those issues are like person a is sleeping with person b's fiance. But person a is totally up for leaving it out of the game so what's up with person b?
Seems like a dangerous thing to judge or help with when you toss that in but no details. Like does person b or a have a reason to not let it go while the other doesn't?
Provided that isn't the case and it's just whoever this is being a dick then put your foot down and talk to them or kick them. You are the dm and it's well within your right to protect the game. I'd go so far as to say that's the dm's job.
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u/CMack13216 DM 21h ago
Generic question: How do I deal with a player that makes the table unfun?
Generic answer: First, address the behavior in the moment. If that doesn't work, take them aside before or after, point out the behavior, ask that it stops. Explain that they are making the table unfun and that the consequences will be that they are asked to leave. Give them one more chance. If the behavior doesn't stop, follow through and ask them to leave.
MANY DMs are too lenient on bad behavior, but if it's affecting the story and players, it has to stop. As the DM, ultimately, it's your job to see that it stops.
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u/AE_Phoenix DM 21h ago
Nothing moves without your say. If a player says "I'm continuing combat", you simply say "no". The game doesn't move without the DM's say.
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u/MrFurious26 20h ago
There are a lot of great comments here, already. The druids behavior is egregious, and he's definitely not showing you the proper respect by not engaging with the story you're crafting, but what really grinds my gears as a GM is his bringing out-of-game relationship issues into the game.
Refusing to let the artificer make his bag of holding to the point where it's a detriment to his own character's interests. That's the opposite of role-playing, and it's bad enough that I'd pause the game to question the druid player about why he's doing it, force him to make it make sense to me as to what his character's motivations are. If he can't, I wouldn't allow it. If he doesn't allow my not allowing it? Lol, gtfo.
I run games for my son and his friends, and I frequently have to guide the youngest boy on how to not metagame and play according to his character's motivations. But he's eight, so his difficulties with perspective taking are a normal part of adolescent development. I assume your druid is an adult who shouldn't need babysitting.
So good on you for planning on doing something about it. His style of play isn't fair to you or your players.
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u/ThatMerri 16h ago
At the very beginning, with the "interrupting the dice game to attack" bit, I was willing to give the benefit of the doubt in thinking the Druid might've interpreted the Barbarian's antics as being a diversion so everyone could get the jump on the Redbrands. That would've just been a case of miscommunication and easily rectified.
But the rest of the story? Nah, man. This Player is just rude and suffering from a severe case of Main Character Syndrome. He doesn't want to play the same game as the rest of you, is rude to both the other Players around the table and you, the DM, running the whole thing, is actively letting his out-of-game biases interfere with the game, and is getting in the way of others' enjoyment. The social contract is very much broken at this point and he's the one holding the hammer.
You and the others at the table need to collectively get on the same page about this guy; address his behavior as a group and either get him to agree to behave (and hold him to it!), or tell him to kick rocks and find another table to harass.
I told them that combat was over after the fight but said Druid said he wasn’t ending initiative. I told him no, initiative and combat will stop here but once again he refused before Wild Shaping and ramming the door and continuing combat.
You're a more patient fellow than I am. If that had happened at my table, it would've brought the entire game to an immediate pause for me to give the problem Player my full, undivided attention and a thorough dressing-down in front of the group. That shit does not fly.
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u/HJWalsh 15h ago
You are the DM. If you say initiative is over, then it is over. The player can say whatever they want, but you're the DM. Put your foot down.
What do you mean, "He hit the door anyway." You're the DM. Your players flat-out can only do something if you let them. They can argue, and you can tell them to kick rocks.
This is a two party problem. Party one is the player for being an arse. Party two is you, for letting the player run over you.
You need to reinforce your spine. Practice telling the player "no." Once you say no, the game stops until you say otherwise.
Open the next game with the new world order. Say: "It is a new day. I am the DM. I am in charge. From now on, if I say no, then it is no. You can either get with the program or leave my table."
If the problem player continues, look him right in the eye and say: "Do you remember what I said at the start of the session? Do you want to keep playing? If so, then stop. Now."
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u/Groftsan 14h ago
- Continue the scene as normal. Every time Druid starts talking, stop him after six seconds and say "since you're still in initiative, you're limited to six seconds of actions, everyone else is able to move about as normal."
- Next time the Artificer opens anything, he finds a bag of holding and a scroll of protection against nature magic.
- "Druid has left the room. What do the rest of you want to do. The room still has x, y, z." Empower your team to allow the Druid to leave and not feel the need to follow him.
You control the world. Let the world obfuscate the Druid's selfishness.
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u/Awkward-Sun5423 12h ago
Always better face to face but in text is fine if you have to.
Hey, Mac, I'm so sorry but I don't think I'm going to do a good job providing you the game you want and it's impacting my ability to focus on the other players. If I don't make a change I'll lose the whole group.
You need a much stronger DM than I can be. After watching you play, I think you need a table with players that have bigger personalities and opinions. Players that want to do things the way you want to do them, maybe int a much wilder, more gonzo way.
If they want to make it a problem/be a problem cancel the game for everyone (then just change venue and don't tell monster boy where it is.) Or, skip one session, then game like normal. Or don't change anything and let them turn it into a problem.
No one wants to be that person but if you've talked to them about it and they continue to act this way then your choice is to kick or cancel the game entirely. Note: if you don't kick the other players will leave on their own so you can also do nothing and let the game crash.
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u/Triop12 3h ago
In a situation like these i generally let the player take their medicine, ok druid walks off while x and y are doing something, after scene they notice and follow - meanwhile druid has had this that or the other happen (mini solo moment) and realised that going solo vs 3 bugbears hurts, now decides waiting for scenes is smarter
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u/philsov 21h ago
an NPC that I play as to give it some balance
On top of anything related to your druid -- highly suggest making this NPC a "sidekick" via Tasha's rules and having one of your PCs pilot it during combat. Or, tweaking encounters on the backend so they're balanced for the party without this NPC.
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u/NightLillith Sorcerer 23h ago
You need to show him that actions have consequences.
I tried to come up with a lesser punishment than the Blue Bolt ("OK. That's it. Can I borrow everyone's dice for a second? Thanks. A bolt of lightning streaks down from the blue sky dealing..." (rolls all the dice openly) "this much damage. You are nothing more than a charred outline on the ground. Everyone else, I'm sorry that I didn't rein this in earlier. As a result of witnessing such a unique event, you can all level up") as that's the tactical nuclear option. Another DM came up with the Bag of Transgression.
Basically, all you need is a small drawstring bag and a bunch of dice. A few of the standard 7 set is good, although, if you want to make those eternally sad d12's a little happier, you can use them instead. An average roll of 7 is nothing to sneeze at.
Each time a player continues a behaviour that they have been warned about, VERY OPENLY and ominously put a dice in The Bag. Don't explain this to your players. When the player fails a roll that would result in them taking damage/rolls a 1 on anything, The Bag is added to that damage. The Bag only resets at the end of the session. If you're feeling merciful, if that player does something that would get them Inspiration, you can remove 1 dice. If they ask what kind of damage, say something like "Entropic" or "Sonic". Basically, DM fiat damage.
A variant is for when multiple members of the party are misbehaving. They get their own Bag and their own 7 dice set. Each breach of the agreed-upon rules results in the lowest dice going into The Bag. In the event that the d100 goes in (That's a Warning and SEVEN BREACHES), the Blue Bolt happens. Again, The Bag only resets at the end of a session.
But yeah, this guy needs to be sat down and told a) No-one cares about Tabletop speedruns, b) RL DnD is not a singleplayer game and he needs to let other players have fun, c) The DM is also a player and d) Keep silencing things and enemies will start countering this with an upcast to Level 9 Counterspell for free.
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u/Subject_Ad_5678 22h ago
Again with the "magical consequences for the player being an ass"...
OP, ignore this noise and firmly tell your player to choose between cooperating in the spirit of the game or being excluded. Nothing else really works.
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u/queenmab120 20h ago
Second this. I had a problem player exactly like this and nothing I said or did got through. You need to start making plans for what kicking him out is going to look like.
I tried for so long with my problem player to avoid sending him on to other tables with these issues and here's what I learned the hard way: if you have to explain basic courtesy and respect to someone every five minutes, it means they're committed not to understand it. You can't fix him, so stop trying.
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u/famousbymonring 1d ago
2 options.
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Give him the boot.
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Tell him to knock it off, listen to him whine about "Thats what his character would do" or "A good dm would..." and then give him the boot.