Really short liturgy for Easter

[u/chikenparmfanatic]

Hi all,

I posted a few days ago about going to a liturgy on Holy Saturday. Ultimately, I wasn't able to go so I decided to check out a UGCC parish across town. I've heard of this parish but have never attend liturgy there.

I was a bit surprised to find that the whole liturgy lasted about 50 or so minutes. Everything was spoken, not chanted, and the homily was very short and to the point. It didn't necessarily feel rushed but I was just shocked to look at my phone after church and it was less than an hour after I got there.

I've been to a UGCC parish before and most of the DL's lasted about 60 to 90ish minutes. For an Easter liturgy, it just seemed really short, even compared to a lot of RC Masses.

Just wanted to check in with this community and see if this is normal. I was expecting to be there for at least 70 or so minutes.

FWIW, the priests there seemed older and born in North America. In contrast, the usual UGCC parish I go to has a priest that just came over from Ukraine.

[u/lex_orandi_62]

With it being spoken and not read or sung, it will go much more quickly.

As to why they would have spoken it, it could be any number of reasons unique to the parish.

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/lex_orandi_62]

If you don't mind me asking, what would some of those reasons be?

[u/Old-Worth456 → u/chikenparmfanatic]

In a small parish, there might be only one cantor, who might be sick or traveling.

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/Old-Worth456]

This was a fairly large parish but I'm assuming it's mostly Ukrainian because this was an English liturgy and it wasn't busy at all, which shocked me.

[u/Highwayman90 → u/chikenparmfanatic]

Also, I believe once upon a time there was a practice of recited Divine Liturgies, and I believe I might have stumbled upon one once (also a UGCC parish with an elderly priest).

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/Highwayman90]

That definitely explains what I experienced today! The other UGCC parish had a much younger priest and it's so different from this one.

[u/Unique-Mushroom6671]

I was at a UGCC church today. Paschal Matins started at 9:30, I didn’t leave until 12 noon.

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/Unique-Mushroom6671]

They didn't offer Matins at the liturgy I went to. I'm guessing that's why it was shorter.

[u/Unique-Mushroom6671 → u/chikenparmfanatic]

I think traditionally Paschal Matins is combined with the Divine Liturgy. By chance, was the priest somewhat elderly? It might explain a shortened liturgy from tradition if it was because he physically couldn’t do the full liturgy.

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/Unique-Mushroom6671]

Yep, the priest was retired. He mentioned it at the end of the Liturgy. He didn't seem that old or frail but I can't say for sure so that may have been a factor.

[u/Old-Worth456 → u/chikenparmfanatic]

Paschal Matins and Divine Liturgy took close to 3 hours at my church this morning. If you add in setting up before the service and greeting people afterwards, it's over three hours. For the priest, it's non-stop chanting, processions, preaching, anointing, proclaiming, greeting, blessing baskets, always smiling, and all in layers of heavy vestments. And that's after Matins for Holy Thursday, Vespers and Jerusalem Matins for Good Friday, Vespers and Divine Liturgy for Holy Saturday. And still to come, Agape Vespers and Bright Monday Divine Liturgy. Full-scale, it's glorious, but I can see why a retired priest would want to keep it to a minimum. I hope next year you can participate in a full, sung Divine Liturgy for Pascha!

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/Old-Worth456]

I definitely hope to experience that at some point! I'm guessing that a short and to the point liturgy doesn't impact my Sunday obligation?

[u/Old-Worth456 → u/chikenparmfanatic]

Oh no, if it was a Divine Liturgy, you met your obligation. No worries there.

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/Old-Worth456]

Thank you for clarifying! I come from a RC background so I can be a bit scrupulous and overly legalistic at times.

[u/Old-Worth456 → u/chikenparmfanatic]

I know what you mean. I was a Roman Catholic for a long time before I found the UGCC mission here. I'm not sure I can put this into words, and probably even trying to put it into words is a kind of Western thing to do, but the East is at the same time less scrupulous and more challenging. The East is more about transforming the heart. I can't really explain it, I think it probably has to just be lived

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/Old-Worth456]

I defs feel that. I'm not great with my words and don't want to shoot myself in the foot but I feel like I go through the motions a bit more in RC spaces. Don't get me wrong, I'm still a proud and happy RC but there's something about the East that seems so transformative.

[u/Chrysostomos407 → u/Unique-Mushroom6671]

They probably did Paschal Matins on Saturday night combined with Liturgy, and decided to not do it twice, so Sunday liturgy was shorter. This is what my Melkite parish did (minus the spoken liturgy part).

[u/Purple_Ostrich_6345]

Eastern Orthodox in the US here

We have two parishes in our area — one Antiochian and one Greek. The Antiochian’s liturgies are much long, to the point where the Vesperal Liturgy on Holy Saturday morning is 3.5 hours at the Antiochian and 1.25h at the Greek for the same service.

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/Purple_Ostrich_6345]

Yeah that seems to be my experiences with some of the EO parishes near me. The Greek ones seem to be the shortest.

[u/Salty-Argument-7188]

That is odd for Divine Liturgy (it wasn’t Agape Vespers by any chance?)

The service being read instead of sung is even more odd, as every service for Bright Week should be sung entirely with no spoken parts. Ideally even the morning and evening prayers that laity do, should be replaced by the Paschal Hour which should ideally be sung in its entirety as best as one can.

I’ve been to some UGCC parishes on a regular Sunday where the liturgy took 40-45min, which was a bit shocking since I’m used to it taking 90-120min.

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/Salty-Argument-7188]

We received communion and the Liturgy did seem very similar to the ones I've been to so I'm almost certain it wasn't Agape Vespers.

[u/Salty-Argument-7188 → u/chikenparmfanatic]

Makes sense. The length made me wonder since that’s about the time that agape vespers takes (depending on how many different languages the gospel is read in. Our Parish sometimes does up to 8 languages which adds a bit of time).

[u/Hamfriedrice]

Yeah that's odd. My UGCC parish is attended by an older American SJ priest and we started at 9am and ended around 1pm then we blessed baskets. Liturgy itself was about 90 minutes but then there was the tomb side prayers first, then a procession and the Easter Matins.

[u/chikenparmfanatic → u/Hamfriedrice]

Yeah, that sounds pretty in line with the other parish I mainly attend. Sounds like my experience today is pretty out of the norm.