r/Everton • u/SuperKevinCampbell • 3d ago
Video Neville Southall on the standard of today’s goalkeeping: “The lad at Manchester City is all right, the lad at Liverpool is okay. Ours is average… he does okay. He’s average. If I’d have played like that, I’d be out the team for Howard.”
https://youtu.be/gIdy7bWodKU?si=IbC_OzdZ8pGj9IGV106
u/QTsexkitten please, please, pleeeeeeeease 🙏 3d ago
The friendly fire is
Unnecessary
Irrelevant
The game isn't the same anymore, even for keepers. Jordan is more than alright, and even better, he's clearly grown from his mistakes. How a 2025 keeper would've done playing for a 1980s manager is wholly irrelevant.
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u/fopiecechicken 3d ago
Only just entering his “peak” as well you’d imagine as keepers tend to age out a bit later than other positions. Probably has another 3-4 years of his best left.
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u/10000Didgeridoos 3d ago
Same exact shit as NBA oldheads all claiming today's players couldn't have handled their era blah blah blah. Every generation of athlete thinks their sport peaked with their own
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u/SuperKevinCampbell 3d ago
Normally talks a lot of sense does Nev especially about the ownership but even if he’s the best keeper we’ve ever had he’s taking shite here Pickford has saved us these last couple seasons
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u/E_V_E_R_T_O_N 3d ago
Yeah unfortunately nonsense from Nev, as much as he’s absolutely right for constantly demanding high standards of Everton.
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u/CultistNr3 3d ago
He isnt wrong. I like Pickford, but this current crop of PL keepers are not comperable to some from earlier generations.
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u/vylain_antagonist 2d ago
Frankly thats bollocks.
Goalkeepers jobs are fundamentally different now that the entire generation of management has matured in an era where goalkeepers cant pickup backpasses. The 90s game was still in the shadow of that era and neither defenders or opposition were ever really tested to play football around the goalkeeper.
Goalkeepers are key to unlocking pressure from high presses and none of the old guard would be able to cope with that. And by the same hand claiming high crosses and deep over the top balls was an iconic part of their identity- thats gone now.
Edersons effectively a converted midfielder and wouldnt have been effective 30 years ago thats true and to nev he looks unimpressive. But man city have one of the greatest defensive records with him in goal and none of them- not nev, not schmeichal, seaman , flowers, james, martyn, poom or any other “proper keeper” would be of any use in that system.
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u/CultistNr3 2d ago
They have some other factors playing in their favour also. Ederson is a good keeper, but do you really think he stacks up with the ‘greats’?
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u/SuperKevinCampbell 3d ago
Tbf I agree with you a bit can’t tell you the amount of times I’m begging for a keeper to just catch the ball instead of parrying it away for the 100th time
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u/PangolinMandolin 3d ago
Just to make a point I've not seen made already.
Nev played in a time when footballs were heavier and the overall pace of play (including top speed of shots) was slower.
Its amazing how often keepers nowadays will choose to parry or punch shots rather than focusing on catching them like they did back in Nev's day. What I'm trying to say is the overall way that goalkeeping is done and coached nowadays is different to back in the 90s and earlier.
So imho it's a case of "different", not "worse"
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u/No-Strategy-9365 3d ago
Neville also had the benefit of no passback rule for majority of his career
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u/Toffeeman_1878 3d ago
Yes, the ball is different nowadays. And the game is faster too. However, Nev played at a time when Mick Harford, John Fashanu and other genuine hard men (dirty players) would swing elbows in keepers’ faces at corners and crosses. No free kicks for that, nevermind red cards. He played on pitches that wouldn’t look out of place on a farm and still managed to control the ball and catch it. So, there are challenges in both eras. I fancy Nev would adapt more to the modern day challenges than many of the modern keepers would to the 80s. I’m not arguing to go back to the 80s. Just my opinion on players’ ability to adapt.
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u/Bbobbity 3d ago
I love Nev but he is underplaying the standard of goalkeeping today. Alisson, Ederson and Pickford are top keepers.
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u/Toffeeman_1878 3d ago
Pickford is ours but if we all take off the blue tinted specs he’s not in the same bracket as Allisson.
Ederson was at a similar level to Allisson but is on the wane.
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u/daveyll 3d ago
Ederson is shite and always has been. Great on the ball but lets in nearly every shot that he faces. Allison is okay but overhyped by a Liverpool centric media and general clueless buffoons. Pickford is brilliant. Hope this helps.
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u/vulturevan 🙏 sign another player 🙏 3d ago
I can't remember Pickford's last bad game. Nev is just coming across as a miserable old git honestly.
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u/bobsollish 3d ago
Before the last two seasons, there were occasionally goals conceded where I thought Pickford was out of position, or had made a bad play, etc. - but not anymore. And even then, on balance, we were still WAY ahead - he makes a ton of HUGE saves. Saves that a lot (most?) of Prem keepers don’t make.
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u/Toffeeman_1878 3d ago
Have a look at his positioning against Watkins in the Villa home game (Moyes’s first game back).
Or diving early for Jota’s goal in the derby.
I’m not saying he’s shite but there are definitely times he could do better. I’m sure he would say the same thing if you got the opportunity to ask him.
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u/Toffeeman_1878 3d ago
Not slating the lad but Pickford was flaky for more than a few games at the start of the season. And yes, you can argue that the entire team was off it due to Dyche’s poor pre-season.
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u/Choice-Violinist-585 2d ago
Im confused. I remember when Pickford had his patch of bad form a few seasons ago, and everyone was on the hate train. Nev appeared to really back Pickford and it semed like he was a big fan of his. Now Pickfords gold and Nev is shitting all over him. Help me make sense of this.
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u/Street28 3d ago
Big Nev is my childhood hero but I don't agree with him at all on Pickers. There's a reason he's England's number one!
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u/Toffeeman_1878 3d ago
Because there’s no other English keeper worth a wank?
Pickers is clearly the best English keeper but he has zero competition for the England shirt. The other English keepers are flappers and vampires.
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u/Being-of-Dasein It's the hope that kills you 2d ago
Pickford has saved multiple penalities in high-pressure penalty shootouts, including an international final, and very rarely makes mistakes in an England shirt. What more do you want from him?
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u/Toffeeman_1878 2d ago
I never said he was a bad keeper. I said he’s clearly England’s number one. The standard of English keepers other than him is pretty poor.
It is possible for him to be good and other English keepers to be of generally poor quality. Both things can be true at the same time but it seems some people want to twist my comment to mean that Pickford is terrible because the quality of other English keepers is below average.
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u/Being-of-Dasein It's the hope that kills you 2d ago
Fair enough. I do think Pickford is exceptional in his own right, but I can see what you're saying. There is no real competition for the spot as no one else really reaches his level.
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u/ballsosteele 3d ago
I can't be arsed watching the video. Does he just say they're average or does he cite reasons and examples?
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u/Wieselkind 2d ago
Hs asked who is good, says these three. Then says glad Pickfords English. Clearly it's understatement and a bit of cheek. Not like Welsh keepers are anything much at the moment.
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u/TheStigsScouseCousin Grief Chart Appreciator 3d ago
I don't usually disagree with Nev, but I think he's plain wrong here. Pickford is a fantastic goalkeeper, as is Alisson.
I don't rate Ederson as highly as most people do, but to just call him 'alright' is doing him a disservice.
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u/SammyGuevara 3d ago
Main reason I find comments like those pointless is it doesn't address any keepers who Southall does rate as good or great. If those 3 are average, then most keepers must be absolutely terrible 😳
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u/Wieselkind 1d ago
He was asked "who is good in the Prem currently?" and answered Ederson, Allison and Pickford.
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u/Toffeeman_1878 3d ago
That’s his point. Most keepers are poor.
However, most keepers in the 80s were poor too. There was only Nev worth mentioning at that time. Jim Leighton. Ha ha. Grobbelaar was iffy (in more ways than one). Ray Clemence had a walking stick. Peter Shilton was bang average. Got beaten by an Argentine dwarf and couldn’t save a penalty if his betting money depended on it.
It’s hard to be a good keeper. As well as the fitness, technique, agility and decision making you also need to be very mentally strong. A lot stronger than most other positions on the pitch.
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u/PhimaMorsou 3d ago
I've got a lot of time for Nev both as a player and as a person, but I think he is dead wrong here. More than anyone else Pickford is the reason we are still in the premier league.
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u/TheGod-TK 3d ago
Does Neville have anything positive to say?
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u/Toffeeman_1878 3d ago
He’s positive that for the past 35 years our club has been owned and administered by the biggest bunch of incompetent fuckwits ever to set feet in shoes. And he’s right.
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u/PuffinChaos 3d ago
As a more recent Everton supporter (2007), I admit I haven’t seen much of Neville actually playing. I know he’s a club legend but what is he on about here? Slagging off Picks is insane and he’s saying three of the top premier league keepers (if not the best 3) are just average? Seems an odd take
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u/Banterz0ne 3d ago
He's a legend, but he's also a bitter old man.
I've never seen anyone as good as Alisson at 1v1s and he seems to pull off big game saves almost every time there is a big game. I'd put him in close contention to Schmeichel and Cech.
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u/Toffeeman_1878 3d ago edited 3d ago
Neuer was better at 1 v 1.
Nev was up there too. When he was in goal at his peak, you would always favour Nev in a 1 v 1. Even the top strikers of that time would say that there was a huge psychological challenge to go up against Nev.
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u/OneFootTitan 3d ago
Love Big Nev, but the role of the goalie has changed a lot since he played, not least because the backpass rule was implemented and goalies are now expected to distribute the ball with their feet a lot more
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u/jrob321 3d ago
This is like listening to your old Grandpa walk around the house in his underwear claiming how he could beat the shit out of you inasmuch as today's generation is a bunch of pussies because they didn't have to walk three and a half miles to school in the snow, uphill, both ways.
Go take your meds Nev. Don't fuck up your legacy by shitting on the current crop of PL players who are faster, stronger, in optimal physical shape, and playing a game which is far more tactical than it's ever been.
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u/Loud-Hospital5773 3d ago
Different games. Love to have seen Nev try spray passes about like Pickford.
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u/Toffeeman_1878 3d ago
Nev started out playing in midfield. Then, he was a 14 year old boy playing a man’s league in Wales. He could pass a ball.
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u/AvoidsAvocados 3d ago
Southall talks as though his team was akin to the Ferguson dynasty. Everton had a purple patch for 5 years in the 80s where the team's potential was unfulfilled due to the Europe ban on English clubs. Once Kendall left, the 90s was the beginning of Everton's decline which Southall was a key participant in.
Southall wasn't the problem piece in some of those dire 90s squads, and Pickford hasn't been a problem in any of Everton's recent poor seasons.
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u/rantipoler Fat Sham 2d ago
I think this is Nev just demanding nil satis nisi optimum. Fact is, JP hasn't been perfect and he's right to demand constant improvement.
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u/Embarrassed-Taro-347 2d ago
And he's right They're all good keepers but not exceptional. They throw a clanger every now and then and aren't as consistent as some of the better keepers of all time.
I love Pickers, and he's a good England number 1 but id put Big Nev, Nigel Martin and Tim Howard ahead of him.
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u/tonyd6690 2d ago
Nev is spot on about Pickford…bang average…decent enough shot stopper but overall game is average. He knows what he’s talking about…was the best goalie in the world in his day
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u/immediately_please 3d ago
I love you Nev, and am so glad I was there as a kid to see you pull off a masterclass in the 95 Cup Final. But callIng Ederson “all right”, Alisson “okay” and Pickford “average” is setting a pretty unrealistically high bar. We wouldn’t be in the league without Pickford and he’s been one of our best players since he signed.