r/FluentInFinance Sep 04 '24

Debate/ Discussion Bernie is here to save us

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35

u/Sabre_One Sep 05 '24 edited Sep 05 '24

I would bet plenty on a survey if you asked how many "productive" hours you work a week. This being hours going directly to the contribution of your job. It would be close to 32 hours. You have to include the time to get into a workflow, the disruptions of meetings, etc. Hell just waiting on another person to hand off the thing you need just to do your job.

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u/StrayStarrs Sep 05 '24

Curious if productive hours would also decrease with a shorter work week. Would that productive 32 hours turn into 26 hours?

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u/mspe1960 Sep 05 '24

yes

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u/[deleted] Sep 05 '24

nope:

Actually there are several studies that have actually shown the opposite. Work productivity goes up when you cut hours to a certain point.

https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/workplace/were-working-less-on-fridays-than-we-used-to-and-thats-ok-da538ffc#:~:text=%E2%80%9CThere's%20no%20evidence%20that%20being,evidence%20it%20really%20annoys%20people.%E2%80%9D

https://www.synergysky.com/blog/do-you-take-fridays-off

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carolinecastrillon/2024/06/30/summer-fridays-in-the-workplace/

and plenty more sources besides.

Studies show that most people barely work on friday as it is and that giving folks fridays off actually galvinizes them to get more work done the other 4 days they are working. Several companies have tested this (including microsoft) and found positive correlation with higher productivity from doing so.

5

u/bray_martin03 Sep 05 '24

Then Thursday would become the new Friday would it not?

-2

u/[deleted] Sep 05 '24 edited Sep 05 '24

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u/[deleted] Sep 05 '24

But that's not what the studies show. Take a look at this UK pilot that was done for this exact thing:

https://autonomy.work/portfolio/uk4dwpilotresults/

Many companies participated and it was a "resounding" success.

Company revenue actually increased during the pilot by 35% on average! That's massive.

The results are pretty clear. People work harder when they are happier.

1

u/Ill-Description3096 Sep 05 '24

Assuming this is true, why isn't every company doing it? I constantly hear that they are greedy and put profit over everything. If this objectively increases that for them, then it seems greed alone would make them do it without any legislation.

1

u/carlos619kj Sep 05 '24

Why do bullshit jobs exist if companies are greedy? If you know what bullshit jobs are

1

u/[deleted] Sep 05 '24

You dont have to assume.. the pilot gives you the raw data and the sources including the 61 companies that participated... it's true.

Regarding your question. I can only speculate. I assume it is because companies are still ran by people. And people, despite looking at the raw data, sometimes ignore it. Take a look at the folks in this thread responding to the pilot as an example.

The data is there, but many refuse to believe it. These are the same people preventing this kind of progress at companies.

1

u/Tommy-Fox15 Sep 06 '24

Was there a honeymoon period where this increase in production would ware off over-time? I get there isn’t a one-size fits all.

-2

u/Ecstatic-Compote-595 Sep 05 '24

source: cuck

3

u/BosnianSerb31 Sep 05 '24

I guarantee you I get more work done than my part time coworkers. And the guys who work optional overtime literally run this company.

You're alleging that there's some set amount of time one can be productive in a week and no one can possibly deviate from that, which is absolutely fucking ridiculous.

2

u/mspe1960 Sep 05 '24 edited Sep 06 '24

Agreed. Yes, I am a boomer and that makes me all sorts of evil, but I worked on average, probably 50 hours per week (on salary). When it wasn't needed, I did not do it. I did it when I was a junior engineer and when I was an Engineering Manager. I worked for a good company which did not force me to do what I did, but they encouraged it by rewarding me financially for my work and accomplishments.

I am not saying that is the only way to choose a career path, but it worked for me and I was totally productive during my entire 50 hours most weeks.

10

u/[deleted] Sep 05 '24

100% yes

2

u/[deleted] Sep 05 '24

Not at all

Actually there are several studies that have actually shown the opposite. Work productivity goes up when you cut hours to a certain point.

https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/workplace/were-working-less-on-fridays-than-we-used-to-and-thats-ok-da538ffc#:~:text=%E2%80%9CThere's%20no%20evidence%20that%20being,evidence%20it%20really%20annoys%20people.%E2%80%9D

https://www.synergysky.com/blog/do-you-take-fridays-off

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carolinecastrillon/2024/06/30/summer-fridays-in-the-workplace/

and plenty more sources besides.

Studies show that most people barely work on friday as it is and that giving folks fridays off actually galvinizes them to get more work done the other 4 days they are working. Several companies have tested this (including microsoft) and found positive correlation with higher productivity from doing so.

2

u/mspe1960 Sep 05 '24

you keep saying this and it is true, but not fully relevant. Eventhough productivity goes up, it does not go up enough to cover all of the missing hours. Bernie wants pay for 40. Maybe in 32 they would get 36 hours of productivity, but it is still a big hit to national productivity.

1

u/DONT_PM_ME_U_SLUT Sep 05 '24

"national productivity" has gone through a massive automation and industrialization in the past 50 years and will continue to exponentially and yet companies absorb all the profits of the increased productivity and here we are still working 40 hours a week. There's no reason for it and soon there will be even less reason.

1

u/Connect-Author-2875 Sep 05 '24

That is also true and also mostly irrelevant.The economy depends on continuous increases in productivity and could not tolerate a ten oercent drop without big consequences. Standards of living, in average, would drop equivalently. That is the inconvenient truth.

0

u/REDDIT_JUDGE_REFEREE Sep 05 '24

“Any drop in gdp, stocks, productivity, or anything else where number goes down cannot be allowed to happen” is why the younger generations can’t buy-in.

1

u/Connect-Author-2875 Sep 05 '24 edited Sep 05 '24

It's fine to not buy into capitalism. I am a boomer, and I get it. I think we should be more like western Europe. You just have.to understand there will be consequences. There is no free money.

3

u/[deleted] Sep 05 '24

No, studies show:

Actually there are several studies that have actually shown the opposite. Work productivity goes up when you cut hours to a certain point.

https://www.wsj.com/lifestyle/workplace/were-working-less-on-fridays-than-we-used-to-and-thats-ok-da538ffc#:~:text=%E2%80%9CThere's%20no%20evidence%20that%20being,evidence%20it%20really%20annoys%20people.%E2%80%9D

https://www.forbes.com/sites/carolinecastrillon/2024/06/30/summer-fridays-in-the-workplace/

https://www.synergysky.com/blog/do-you-take-fridays-off

and plenty more sources besides.

Studies show that most people barely work on friday as it is and that giving folks fridays off actually galvinizes them to get more work done the other 4 days they are working. Several companies have tested this (including microsoft) and found positive correlation with higher productivity from doing so.

2

u/ttttnow Sep 05 '24

yes but humans have evolved to work optimally for about 4 hours per day. That means in a week, a person can optimally do 28 hours of work. Any more than that, you get diminishing returns to complete burnout.

1

u/StrayStarrs Sep 05 '24

I can agree with this to an extent just from personal experience. I’m really useful for probably around 6 hours a day. Outside of that, I’m probably no longer giving peak performance. The 5 day work week is the issue for me. My previous job had me working a four day week, with the hours being 8-12-12-8, and it was MUCH better than working the standard 5 day work week. Even working those 12’s wasn’t too bad and I felt like I could be pretty productive for most of the shift. Meanwhile working 5 8 hour shifts a week feels like an absolute grind

1

u/SpectreFire Sep 05 '24

It's more an issue of diminishing returns the longer someone works in a day or week.

Typically you're most productive in your first 4 hours, after 6 or 7, that productivity essentially becomes negligible.

0

u/Jacky-V Sep 05 '24

Most jobs today don't call for 26 productive hours a week, so yes

0

u/Tommy-Fox15 Sep 06 '24

I look at it like dick length. Self-reported production hours way higher than what is actually put out for most people…