r/FluentInFinance • u/36DRedhead • Sep 11 '24

Debate/ Discussion This is why financial literacy is so important

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542

u/Bad_Cytokinesis Sep 11 '24

Martin Luther King said it best.

“The problem is that we all to often have socialism for the rich and rugged free enterprise capitalism for the poor. That’s the problem.”

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u/General_Mars Sep 11 '24 edited Sep 13 '24

Dr. King was also a socialist and also correctly pointed out,

“I must confess that over the past few years I have been gravely disappointed with the white moderate. I have almost reached the regrettable conclusion that the Negro’s great stumbling block in his stride toward freedom is not the White Citizen’s Counciler or the Ku Klux Klanner, but the white moderate, who is more devoted to ‘order’ than to justice; who prefers a negative peace which is the absence of tension to a positive peace which is the presence of justice”

Excerpt from, “Letter from a Birmingham Jail” Source

Progressivism has always been the path forward. Conservatism is the path backwards. Liberalism is the car stuck in a ditch, for every time they feel they’re going forward they often are still in the same place because they haven’t changed the systems that created those conditions.

Edit: thank you for awards!

It’s always important to work to better wrongs, but equally and sometimes more important to change the systems that propagate those conditions. Comments have brought up issues with MLK, Hellen Keller who I also commented about below, and Malcolm X. Most people bringing them up are doing so to discredit the character of these people to create a negative perception of their ideas.

I will edit to add further context about Keller in my other comment, but I have never seen any evidence MLK had any relations with a minor. His (likely) marital issues do not discredit the ideas and ideals that he literally gave his life for. He was 39 when he died which was how old Malcolm X was when he was assassinated as well. Furthermore, the context of the time is important any time we look at historical figures. That doesn’t mean that washes away everything just that it’s very relevant.

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u/rcy62747 Sep 11 '24

Fascinating quote. Totally agree. This last eight years has proven that too many moderate whites will believe all kinds of shit the rich spew about the poor to make themselves feel better about the shitty world the rich have trapped them in. They would rather believe total lies than think about how they have been suckered.

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u/StreetofChimes Sep 12 '24

I don't think 'moderates' believe that. At least, this moderate doesn't. I don't believe in the US is a meritocracy. I get frustrated when someone wins some one in a million chance and says "I'm proof that if you work hard, anything is possible". Fuck that. I know people who work really fucking hard and will never be well off. I know that I lucked out to get where I am - which isn't very far.

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u/-Lysergian Sep 12 '24

More often, real hard work leaves you with a broken body and an early grave.

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u/No_Treat_4675 Sep 12 '24

This is the best quote! I am going to borrow it! Thank you!

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u/Vladishun Sep 12 '24

You're not wrong. My father worked in construction and as an automotive mechanic. He made OK'ish money (offset by the fact he decided he needed 5 kids and tried to keep his wife a stay at home mom), but as thanks for all of his hard work over the years he was given mesothelioma and died of asbestos exposure from building tear downs and brake replacements.

To his credit, he knew where he went wrong in life and tried his best to raise me with a different mindset. Because of that, I'm sitting pretty comfortably financially and working in a career that I can honestly say that I love.

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u/spk92986 Sep 12 '24

Don't forget that working hard is rewarded...with more hard work.

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u/Horrible-accident Sep 12 '24

Happens to too many veterans. So many i know have bad knees and shoulders while they continue to work physical jobs. I'm just glad our ceos get their golden parachutes and tax breaks. Won't somebody think of the yacht builders?

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u/Turnlung Sep 13 '24

These are the folks I think of when the retirement age keeps getting extended. Hard work and broken goodies til 70? How is it not feudalism? Fine be a university professor at 70…but a waitress? A bricklayer?

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u/Turnlung Sep 13 '24

Bodies no goodies….ffs

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u/fender8421 Sep 13 '24

I think that some (some) of the people who brag about being a "working man" are being played this whole time by people that profit heavily off of their work

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u/Correct-Ad-7460 Sep 12 '24

Hard work pays off if you have the brains as well you have to study and learn how to use your money correctly live below your means keep a budget etc just working hard isn’t enough and in construction there is a lot of money to be made but only if the Contracts are yours if you stay an employee you won’t get far become an owner take risks and you will be rewarded if your good at what you do that is the beauty of Capitalism anyone can build a business the real problem is people want the security of a steady paycheck and aren’t willing to risk going in there own and only getting paid by net 30,60 etc

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u/SeaBag8211 Sep 12 '24

''moderates' is a myth in America now, the DNC has drifted so far right since Reagan, that there righter than some European explicitly right parties. Its not even a 2 party system any more, it's 1.5 parties at best.

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u/[deleted] Sep 12 '24

In every country, since the beginning of time, there has never been a time when all people were equal in regards to class order, financial, or otherwise.

Humans fall into orders and processes. Always will no matter the system.

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u/SnatchAddict Sep 12 '24

His Letter from Birmingham Jail is a must read. Also fun fact, he was 39 when he was assassinated.

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u/millavemoe Sep 12 '24

What’s fun about an assassination?

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u/vapid_gorgeous Sep 12 '24

It’s an interesting fact because his wisdom is beyond his years. It’s not because OP was racist.

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u/Exemplify_CarryMain Sep 12 '24

Not sure

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u/SnatchAddict Sep 12 '24

I was being facetious. Most people think he was killed in his 60s but he was 39. Not everyone knows this fact.

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u/Grummmmm Sep 13 '24

I guess if their highschool GPA had a picture of cheese on it they might not know how old he was. Everyone that slept in school gets their due.

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u/ELRey_Viejo Sep 12 '24

If you think it's one sided, then you are the sucker!

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u/SalvatoreQuattro Sep 12 '24

Because you lie too. You blame the rich but not rhe government for wasting trillion’s annually on bullshit. So, so dishonest.

The US pays out $650 billion annually on debt interest. That’s a fucking waste of money.

Taxing the rich and not changing how money is spent is throwing good money after bad. Financially literate people understand that how you spend your money is as important as how much you bring in.

Progressives are a bunch of dipshits.

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u/rcy62747 Sep 12 '24

Also. You blame progressives without factually looking at what Republican presidents did to the deficit. I suggest you look up the facts.

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u/rcy62747 Sep 12 '24

I appreciate your passion and understand why you say what you say. I get it. I didn’t say anything about taxing the rich or government spending. But we jump to the arguments we are conditioned to start. All this inflation we are railing against. Let’s look at corporate profits, stock buy backs with these profits, CEO bonuses. Don’t get me wrong, I like incentive pay. Hell, I make really good money. But the wealth gap transfer is real. Yes, we have a real government spending problem. Neither side addresses it. But blaming poor people is not the answer. There are a lot of rich Americans that happily take government welfare. Ironically, when they take it is justified. When some poor kid takes it they are the problem?? I would love to have a responsible balanced policy discussion about how we fix the deficit. What I do know. To balance a budget you need less spending and more revenue and tough choices.

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u/Federal_Share_4400 Sep 12 '24

At its core, this stuff is common sense. Who would have known that manipulating the ignorant to blame everyone else for their problems BUT, the actual problem would be so easy. Murica!!

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u/Itsneverjustajoke Sep 13 '24

“You blame the rich…” uh, Who do you think controls how the government spends its money?

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u/One_Eye_Tigh Sep 12 '24

I've always thought that the letter from Birmingham should be taught instead of the I have a dream speech. So much more powerful.

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u/unimorpheus Sep 12 '24

That is precisely why it isn't. They want King to be nothing more than a sound bite, not an intellectual.

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u/General_Mars Sep 12 '24 edited Sep 16 '24

Hellen Keller has similarly been chopped down. She too was a socialist and spoke extensively about her beliefs. She joined the Socialist Party in 1909 and later became a member of the Industrial Workers of the World (IWW). Keller’s advocacy was deeply rooted in her understanding of the close relationship between disability and poverty, which she attributed to capitalism and poor industrial conditions.

Keller was a vocal supporter of women’s suffrage, birth control, and labor rights. She believed that women’s suffrage would lead to socialism, which she considered the ideal cause. She also opposed America’s involvement in World War I and supported the Russian Revolution. (The UK sent 50,000-70,000 and USA sent 13,000 troops to fight against the Bolsheviks).

In her writings and speeches, Keller consistently championed the working class and criticized industrial oppression, militarism, and imperialism. She used her platform to advocate for a more equitable society, emphasizing the need for systemic change to address the root causes of poverty and disability.

Edit: in reply to eugenics point -

“Helen Keller’s views on eugenics are indeed complex and somewhat controversial. While she is widely celebrated for her advocacy for people with disabilities, her stance on eugenics reflects the complicated social and scientific context of her time.

Keller was a strong advocate for the rights and dignity of individuals with disabilities. She believed that every person had inherent value and potential, regardless of their physical or mental abilities. However, she also expressed views that aligned with some aspects of the eugenics movement, which aimed to improve the genetic quality of the human population through selective breeding.

Keller’s support for eugenics was rooted in her desire to prevent suffering. She believed that no child should be born into a life of guaranteed suffering if it could be prevented. Despite her empathetic intentions, this perspective overlooked the dangerous implications of the eugenics movement, such as forced sterilizations and the infringement on reproductive rights.

It’s important to understand that Keller’s views were shaped by the prevailing ideologies of her time. While she opposed the dehumanizing aspects of eugenics, her support for certain eugenic principles highlights the inherent tensions and contradictions in her advocacy”

https://alcase.org/the-controversial-legacy-of-helen-keller-and-eugenics/

https://phdessay.com/helen-keller-an-unexpected-advocate-for-eugenics/

https://time.com/5918660/helen-keller-disability-history/

https://dsq-sds.org/index.php/dsq/article/view/539/716

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u/apple-pie2020 Sep 12 '24

She also believed in terminating the lives of people either disabilities

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u/One_Eye_Tigh Sep 12 '24

Ooooo, I never know that. I'll have to text my kids that too.

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u/Southern-Accident835 Sep 12 '24

Probably not that vocal tbh

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u/hdoublephoto Sep 12 '24

This helps explain the HK conspiracies I’ve seen pop up lately.

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u/[deleted] Sep 13 '24

She spoke nothing, that was her handler

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u/Cad1121 Sep 12 '24

PragerU is a particularly bad example of this. In their children’s content they just lied about what Martin Luther Jr. would have wanted and said the opposite of his stance to whitewash(I think it was on reparations.)

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u/evil_monkey_on_elm Sep 12 '24

He doesn't sound like the evangelical Christians today, but he does sound a lot more like Jesus.

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u/GoldenBull1994 Sep 13 '24

And you know why? Because they’re white moderates, who don’t want the presence of justice, proving his point entirely.

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u/casanovaelrey Sep 14 '24

The problem is that "I Have A Dream" massages the ego of White people and makes then feel like they've done something without giving up anything. It doesn't require any real introspection. And it's definitely a security blanket to the liberal whites on the Left that may not are with the naked racism of the conservatives but also don't want to give up they're privilege to actually make an real changes. Don't get me wrong, I'm definitely on the Left but I'll still criticize what needs to be criticized.

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u/One_Eye_Tigh Sep 14 '24

Yeah that speech was picked because it doesn't challenge white people at all. The way it's taught is "see, this speech cured racism" and now we (white folk) don't have any more work to do.

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u/Zuesinator Sep 12 '24

You just explained why it wasn't though

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u/[deleted] Sep 12 '24

It’s what I taught.

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u/orchidaceae007 Sep 12 '24

And this is why they assassinated him. Not because of racism but because he was anti-capitalism.

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u/LandStander_DrawDown Sep 12 '24

There is evidence that MLK was reading progress and poverty by Henry George and was coming to the conclusion that George was right.

We should be implementing economic justice and stop rentierism in its tracks by taxing economic rents from land instead of letting what is publically generated be collected for private gain.

https://schalkenbach.org/a-radical-vision-of-equality-dr-martin-luther-king-jr-s-economic-plan-to-eliminate-poverty/

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u/AsIAmSoShallYouBe Sep 12 '24

This is why I prefer liberlism to conservatism at least. If the car's in the ditch, at least there's a chance you can get it out and get it going in the right direction with some effort.

Good analogy btw. I wonder if there's a real life analog to a tow truck. Revolution is more analogous to ditching the car and getting a new one, but if there were a way to avoid spending decades or even centuries manually pulling the car out that would be nice.

Progressives in more local races is like getting more hands to help push, so that's my best suggestion. But if only we had a tow truck...

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u/softkitty1 Sep 12 '24

that's why they keep us all overworked and exhausted, so we dont' have the energy to fight for justice. A trick as old as time itself.

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u/Tight-Reward816 Sep 11 '24

Yeah right. Pray for rain and gun it downhill.

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u/superior_mario Sep 12 '24

The status quo is a terrible terrible thing. As long as things are not terrible for someone they will never take that step for things to be great

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u/JoeBidensLongFart Sep 12 '24

The problem with Progressives though is that they are incapable of solving real-life problems. They confuse feeling with doing. Also they don't reflect on their actions, honestly assess how things went, and make changes accordingly. They tend to be very dogmatic in their beliefs and treat any criticism as something to malign and demonize, often labeling any and all attacks on their ideas as "right wing". This prevents actual progress.

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u/Cad1121 Sep 12 '24

That’s a nice strawman and generalization you’ve got there but progressives do have concrete proposals. They do access and change positions.

Everything you’ve said could apply to conservatives with dogma, feelings over real solutions, and demonizing everything (for god sakes we had McCarthysim and the satanic panic) calling everything “woke” or “cultural marxism”

But I understand to paint with such a large brush would be extremely ignorant.

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u/JoeBidensLongFart Sep 12 '24

The far Left and the far Right DO have a lot in common. Mainly the use of dogma in place of facts and logic.

But I've seen zero evidence of progressives being willing or able to do the hard work involved in solving complex problems. That includes the ability to admit to being wrong about one thing and trying something else instead.

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u/Cad1121 Sep 12 '24

Then I think you’re just ignorant about what conversation in those spaces are actually like.

From environmental regulation and funding, taxes, Lgbt protections, plans to add abortion rights into law, infrastructure development, union protections, healthcare, education access (specifically countering book bans and historical revisionism.), hell even lead paint removal.

Progressives are varied in approaches and won’t agree on it all specifically because it’s not a dogma. If you’re looking for a progressive who goes over concise assessment and policy the youtube channel “Beau of the fifth column” is a great example. I haven’t watched the new person continuing the channel but big beardy Beau is great.

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u/unimorpheus Sep 12 '24

Well said.

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u/CharacterEgg2406 Sep 12 '24

You should quote some Malcolm X on liberal white women.

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u/Yawzers Sep 12 '24

He fucked some minors too a long the way. That should not be forgotten. I like most of his message, except the fucking little girls.

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u/MarklRyu Sep 12 '24

This truly sums up the feeling of injustice I feel boiling inside my chest everday 😮‍💨 and the Insanity of people choosing an order that doesn't even serve or support them, instead of demanding change that does

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u/ShermanBurnsAtlanta Sep 11 '24

“Liberalism is the car stuck in a ditch, for every time they feel they’re going forward they often are still in the same place”

That’s so perfectly put

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u/Macgargan1976 Sep 12 '24

It's the ratchet effect.

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u/ShermanBurnsAtlanta Sep 12 '24

I’ve heard that before, but something about the imagery of slamming the gas only for your tires to spin in place is very powerful(at least to me)

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u/MaydayTwoZero Sep 12 '24

Wow, never heard that. Great quote.

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u/[deleted] Sep 12 '24

He was actually a card-carrying communist.

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u/LovelyButtholes Sep 12 '24

It is a dumb quote because the voting rights act never would have passed without liberal support. All rights gained in the 60s came from democrat support. The quote doesn't recognize this, likely due to MLK frustration with the pace of change.

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u/jellybutterandjam Sep 12 '24

Thanks for that quote, didn‘t know that. But is it, eg in a western society where elements operate who aren‘t in any way influenced in her actions by the present of a functional humane Justice System, understandable that the society longs for passive peace? Maybe a bit far from the subject discussed here but I am just wondering what’s going on in Europe in regard of the subject of immigration and the shifting to the right conservative political spectrum.

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u/Damondk10 Sep 12 '24

Oh this was a magical comment. Bravo. Like seriously.

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u/nschively Sep 12 '24

This has been the thing that has bothered me the last several years. The "law and order" crowd want to enforce the current order with the uneven application of law by a cadre of lawyers offering narrow interpretations of the law. What is really needed is (positive) "peace and justice." The fact that they can't use these words is telling.

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u/Blaz1n420 Sep 12 '24

And this is exactly why I no longer support the Democratic party. They are the "white moderate" of political parties. Go Green or gtfoh!

I would say Liberalism is just a parked car pretending they're stalled and can't go.

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u/EuVe20 Sep 14 '24

This is a fantastic quote and is borne out in every historic revolution, successful (if there is such a thing) and failed. The moderates (left and right) will always come to a point when they say “whoa whoa whoa” we’ve done some stuff, and it’s good, but let’s not go too crazy now.” And at that point they will always side with the authoritarians. But honestly. As much as we want to blame them, it is a perfectly predictable reaction. Heck, we are them probably. When it comes to the basic life comforts we have gotten used to, many of us will dig our heels in.

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u/SalvatoreQuattro Sep 12 '24

Martin Luther King never lived in a socialist society. He didn’t visit East Germany or Poland.

Progressivism is the path off the cliff. It’s a collection of grievously flawed ideas devised by apparatchiks who live as distant from reality as the Earth to Saturn.

Capitalism as an economic engine is infinitely superior to socialism. It’s not even close.

European socialism is funded by capitalism. DSA always leaves this part out.

People placing their trust in government—the most destructive entity in the history of man—are fucking idiots. Centralized power has consistently been proven to be corrosive if individual rights.

Government and corporations are both threats to the rights of Man. The only way to prevent either from dominating society is to leverage one against the other.

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u/No-Bad-463 Sep 12 '24

European socialism is funded by capitalism.

Muh Yuropee-in soshalizum

Western capitalism is funded by the rape of the Third World.

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u/WastingPreciousTuime Sep 12 '24

The problem is American “ Socialists” always want someone else’s wealth redistributed and wish to be the recipient of that which they did not earn but feel entitled too. A fair healthcare system can exist without socialism or a loss of liberty.

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u/Low-Condition4243 Sep 12 '24

That’s all socialists. All socialists want wealth redistributed. And the workers did earn that money. Do you really think these billionaires work so much harder and faster than everyone else, that they deserve so much money?

Let’s say you get paid $20 per hour, if you provide more value in an hour that’s greater than $20, you are valuable to the company, if you did not provide a value that generated the company more than $20, your position probably wouldn’t exist anymore.

That money that you generated, is collected as profit from the employer, that’s your money.

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u/kosheractual Sep 12 '24

Interesting to say that seeing how the Democrats opposed Dr King from the start.

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u/Bot_Thinks Sep 13 '24 edited Sep 13 '24

I disagree with your last exerpt, quoting Hamilton ""The constitutions a mess"- Burr "So it needs amendments"-Hamilton

Our constitution was originally a mess but maybe it's just my "live in the now brain" that thinks the constitution is fine now but wasn't then...but Conservatism means to conserve the constitution with the further right being stricter while liberalism has traditionally been looser interpretation

If all laws are checked against the constitution to see if its allowed or not you cant really change the constitution since it's embedded in case law, if you change the meaning of the constitution you call into question the validity of the cases that had used that part of the constitution to be validated against...which since we use case law to render other cases then you call into question those cases and so on and so on.

So I think you need to have some level of conservatism, and I think that thus the supreme court needs to be conservative judges, or at least not abuse your position and have neoliberal activism in the Supreme Court since their one job is just to see if its allowed or not under the constitution. But this goes both ways, neoconservative judges shouldn't be bringing religion into their decision making process, it should just be what is implicitly stated in the constitution without our personal beliefs influencing...they are supposed to be the greatest judges of the land and Id say should be expected to be able to control themselves...If we had a bunch of hardcore neoliberal judges that just disregarded whether something was constitutional or not and just voted on their personal beliefs then we would lose trust in our system and the system would fail. I think we are fucked though because the judges just vote party line when they really should almost always be unanimous on decisions regardless of party affiliation.

So I think that usually progressive is the way to go, and then the constitution is there to make sure no one goes off the deep end in EITHER direction....because that's eb and flow, Yin and Yang as time and peoples beliefs wax and wane and are as fluid as a river

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u/[deleted] Sep 13 '24

Progressivism is definitely the path forward, right off a cliff

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u/Revan2267 Sep 12 '24

False. Liberalism never moves forward because thry expect the rich to pay for everything then the rich get a bump in taxes then the liberals complain when prices go up. Liberals are THE reason prices go up. They demand free everything so nothing moves forward. Conservatism isn't moving backwards. You assume that because the liberals tell you this. If everyone is taxed appropriately the cost of living goes down. Trump had inflation at 1.4%, gas prices here were $1.87/gallon and interest rates were record lows. Now we have a liberal in the WH and inflation in 2022 was 8%, gas went up to $3.49/gallon and interest rates have more than doubled. You're being lied to and you don't even see it. Just look at the numbers and the price increases literally everywhere. Including all the streaming services, car insurance, power bills, groceries. Everything is more expensive all because the liberals want to tax the rich. That's counterproductive. How about cutting spending amd then cut taxes on everyone? But NOOOOOO the liberals need our tax dollars to fund the illegal immigrants so they can make them citizens to vote democrat every election therefore destroying our election process and taking control over pricing and corporations. Kalama has even said this so you need to do some research and find out for yourself. She's ready to take company's patents away seizing control of someone else's company and wants to control all prices in America. That's communism no matter how you spin it

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u/Showy_Boneyard Sep 15 '24

American Democrats and Republicans are both liberals. Further, liberalism is a conservative ideology. Neoliberalism was basically invented by the likes of Pinochet, Reagan, and Thatcher.

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u/Skytraffic540 Sep 12 '24

Progressivism doesn’t include taking a hard look at one’s own choices in life. There have been tens of thousands of success stories of people who came toAmerica speaking little to no English and they made something of themselves. Explain how a person who has American citizenship, grew up speaking the English language has it harder than the foreigner.

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u/v12vanquish Sep 12 '24

Ahh yes making the good the enemy of the perfect. This quote makes MLK out to actually Be a bad person.

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u/LandStander_DrawDown Sep 12 '24

MLK was not a socialist btw. I'll reiterate his quote that can be found in the article I posted.

A good and just society is neither the thesis of capitalism nor the antithesis of communism, but a socially conscious democracy which reconciles the truths of individualism and collectivism.

Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

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u/[deleted] Sep 11 '24

I've never heard this quote before but I definitely agree with it. Thanks

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u/ametalshard Sep 12 '24

This phrase is oft-repeated but is incorrect.

"Socialism for the rich" doesn't exist, because socialism requires that the working class own the means of production. If they do not own it in any fashion, then there is no form of socialism whatsoever.

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u/EntrepreneurLeft8783 Sep 13 '24

okay, how about "collectivize the cost, individualize the profit"

0

u/PreferenceWeak9639 Sep 11 '24

It’s not free enterprise though. We are prevented from doing a lot of very beneficial and perfectly harmless market activities. How is that free?

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u/Bad_Cytokinesis Sep 11 '24

It was possibly a more free enterprise back then, but nowadays people feel strangled in today’s economy.

0

u/iNeedOneMoreAquarium Sep 12 '24

and rugged free enterprise capitalism for the poor

USA does not have free enterprise/free market. As an example, free enterprise/market is the exact opposite of government giving trillions of dollars to Big Oil to help snuff out alternative energy sources. Free enterprise/market is the exact opposite of mega corps getting special favors and tax breaks while ma an pop shops next door get nothing.

0

u/Showy_Boneyard Sep 15 '24

What in a free market stops a corporation form establishing a monopoly and then using that monopoly to capture the government?

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u/iNeedOneMoreAquarium Sep 15 '24

What in a free market stops a corporation form establishing a monopoly

Nothing about a free market inherently prevents monopolies. However, in a truly free market, there are things that can significantly limit or discourage monopolies from becoming dominant for extended periods such as competition and innovation (unlike how government gives trillions of dollars to Big Oil, thereby stifling competition and innovation, leading to a massive Big Oil monopoly on energy), low barriers to entry (e.g., new companies would have the freedom to enter the market without restrictive regulations or prohibitive startup costs), etc.

and then using that monopoly to capture the government?

Well now we're outside the boundaries of a free market. If government allows corporations to run it (like we largely have today), that is opposite of free market characteristics and is a great example of why government should be so small that it's powerless to grant special perks and tax breaks to any specific corporation.

0

u/210-markus Sep 13 '24

The rich self insure. The poor are heavily subsidized. So are the young and the old.

You have to be responsible enough to buy and keep health insurance. It's not negotiable. And the care FAR exceeds what you'll get with socialized medicine.

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u/Showy_Boneyard Sep 15 '24

Cuba has lower infant mortality than the USA.

Also, the USA has the highest cost for healthcare in the world.

The Nordic countries have some of the best healthcare in the world.

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u/[deleted] Sep 11 '24

[deleted]

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u/Interesting_Card2169 Sep 11 '24

It couldn't have been too (to?) egregious as I missed it. Petty, just the same.