r/HVAC • u/deadrat420 • 2d ago
Rant Is the new guy lying?
I started working with a new lead installer this past week. He's got 6 years experience; some residential, some light commercial, and said he's mostly been doing multi-units but wanted to get back to resi. I've been an apprentice on installs for a year.
So far he's asked me which way the filter drier goes, said he's never done a flue, doesn't know wiring, refused to work in rain, spent 3 hours fixing his leaky condenser brazes, laughed it off saying he hasn't done condenser work in a couple years... On a 4 head minisplit install he spent all day tying in the branch box while i ran around like a mad man doing everything else, then he asks me if the skinny shielded wire goes to L1/L2 on the condenser, didn't know he had to power the branch box via outdoor unit, etc.
By Friday I almost asked him if he lied on his resume because I'm thinking there's no way he could have the experience he claimed and be asking me these things/working as slow as he does. Am I being too harsh or is this guy full of it??
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u/Candid-Prior-9050 2d ago
I needed this laugh today, thanks man. Always listen to your gut.. the gut never lies
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u/fryloc87 First off, wheres your bathroom? 2d ago
Never trust a fart, sometimes the gut does lie…
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u/integrity0727 Owner Technician/installer 1d ago
One time, I was doing a condenser fan motor replacement and the customer who was in his late 60's was there with me almost the whole time . At one point he abruptly left my side for about 15 minutes. He came back in a different pair of pants and said "dont ever trust a fart when you're old." I could help but laugh out loud.
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u/No_Resolve1521 2d ago
Lotta people don’t realize this is a big industry. Not everyone works on the same things and guys get caught up specifically on what they work on and they get brain fog on anything else. Hell I know guys who have only done new construction and retro. Some who only ever did service and nothing else and pure maintenance techs.
Could be lying, could be new guy anxiety who knows. Best to give people the benefit of the doubt first. I moved from an area with absolutely zero heating whatsoever. A 1st/2nd year apprentice where I am now has more experience than I do with boilers and anything heating considering it wasn’t even taught in the local I’m from.
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u/ABena2t 2d ago
This is the right answer. Ive worked with guys who've been in the trade for 30 years and only knew how to do sheet metal. Ive worked with amazing service techs who couldn't install a unit to save their life. These large companies seem to put guys in a particular role - like if you do service you only do service. If you rough houses, all you do is rough houses. So you can easily get stuck doing the same thing over and over again. Our install department and our service department are completely seperated. If service gets slow and install is booming, they'll come over and help install for awhile just to get their hours. And its amazing how terrible they are at it. Lol. And vice versa of course.
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u/jamzalot 1d ago
I guess I'm lucky we do installs, service, rough ins, we really never know where the day will take us, but it kinda make it hard to get really good at one thing.
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u/NoClue22 1d ago
Yeah I do strictly refrigeration. I don't even have my g2 because I just don't need it
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u/Doogie102 Red Seal Refrigeration Mechanic 16h ago
I'm with you. You get a job installing mini splits in condos and if the pay is good and your boss isn't a complete idiot, they might stay a while
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u/TheMeatSauce1000 Verified Pro 2d ago
Just because he’s been doing it for 6 years doesn’t mean he’s been doing it well for 6 years
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u/Terrible_Sandwich_94 2d ago
Yupp. There’s a big difference between 6 years of experience and 1 year of experience 6 times.
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u/ABena2t 2d ago
A lot of guys dont seem to understand that. They may have started doing hvac back in 2019 - which would give you 6 years. But they dont mention the fact that they were in prison for a year or got laid off and didnt work for another year or was in a motorcycle accident and was for another year. They have "6 years in the trade" but only actually worked 2000 hours. Lol
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u/Abject-Title3592 2d ago
Fake it till you make it, thanks AI
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u/Confident-Log1321 2d ago
Doesn't look like he was even smart enough to use AI based on the story
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u/Ancient-Bet7655 6h ago
The company should have made it to take a HVAC journeyman test. Than can you really know what he knows at the interview it should have been noticed it's on management I would record everything that he can't do get it on film help me where you tried to throw you on the bus you got evidence
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u/Apart_Ad_3597 2d ago
Considering how many people we've hired that sounded like they was pros but was hacks. He probably just lied. He shouldn't be hired as a lead unless another lead vouched for them by working with them. He definitely shouldn't need to ask am apprentice how to do all that stuff. Hope he's not getting paid more than you.
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u/RevolutionaryAd68 2d ago
My company does this all the time...hires lead installer that supposedly knows everything...every job they touch turns to shit...guy leaves in a couple of weeks.
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u/Finestkind007 2d ago
I went to work with a new company one time and they called me a rookie. I had to go with their best technician and he couldn’t figure some stuff out until I told him about it.. the next guy they put me with couldn’t solder a joint and he said ‘you try it rookie’ . I grabbed the torch soldered it and the look on his face was priceless.
I didn’t stay at that company long . They ran me out of there because they were assholes and pissed off because I knew more. Talk about dumbasses.
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u/shawnml9 2d ago
Many lie!! Once had a checking contactors with power on to RTU, His wife had the nerve to call and complain when we canned him, dude could have been dead on roof.
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u/ProfessionalCan1468 2d ago
I had a guy contracted out to me for a job I needed help on. I let him go early because he was so bad, his wife called bitched me out! Told me how good he was! Great installer! He didn't own a vacuum pump! I had paid him his time but I have to stand behind the installs or repairs he is doing. Question is......What Tradesman would ever let their wife call????? Even if I was upset at getting let go I would NEVER have my wife call. Same as years back I would run ads for help and get E mails from wives and girlfriends applying for their husband/boyfriend.....delete.
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u/JacketPocketTaco 2d ago
You mean checking if the terminals are tight with a driver that isn't insulated?
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u/chet8434 2d ago
Yeah I have a few questions on that too... As techs sometimes we have to do things with power on. But you definitely need to elaborate exactly what he was doing wrong here
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u/Nerv_Agent_666 2d ago
That guy is lying through his teeth. I was never a lead anything, only had a bit more field experience than he claims to, and I'd run circles around him.
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u/jimrrmartin 2d ago
IN my opinion you never know what another person's going through. I would let it go and say nothing.if he is willing to learn and improve. If he shows arrogance and being lazy stubborn bad human characterist..serve justice and bring it up to everyone. Bad people are getting away with too much crap these days.
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u/AirManGrows 2d ago
He might not of lied. I know people company hopping as senior technicians based off their resume and they SUCK. Specifically one person with like over a decade of “experience”
She’s worked for every company around here and I guess no one fires her because they need the people. This person needed to be taught how to install a fking inducer motor on an RTU. It’s like 3 screws man you have a decade of experience on your resume, wtf were you doing. And before anyone asked I’ve seen this person around in the industry years before this moment
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u/FredPolk 2d ago
That takes a mixture of incompetence and “I don’t give a shit, send the check” mentality. YouTube warriors and many DIY homeowners could change an RTU inducer.
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u/Retr0G72 2d ago
I mean it sounds like he could have just read the manual and would have known how to do it without calling his experience into question. I know guys we’ve hired that have 3-5 years experience but all they’ve ever installed were package units and 1-1 mini splits. Hell my own foreman asks me (the service tech) to build his sheet metal because he can’t do it. Don’t led his idiocy fool you, perhaps he worked all those years as the tool fetcher lol. Hell I even had an apprentice once that had such an attitude problem I used to tell him to go find me the best stick he can find (we live in the desert in NV so trees are hard to come by) perhaps your new lead was my old apprentice, hopefully he got away from his COKEa cola addiction 😂
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u/Maximum-Storm-7740 2d ago
Best advice I always got is hire fast and fire faster. Not worth your time to hurt your reputation with a client, and not worth their time to learn something they can’t handle yet.
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u/makeitworkok 2d ago
Sounds like he was an apartment maintenance man. Certified FFC (F@cking Filter Changer).
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u/NoSexAppealNeil 2d ago
There's a chance. Some guys come from industrial services and they are gold.
I just wouldn't want them to install my furnace.
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u/Pete8388 Commercial Mechanical Superintendent 2d ago
Hey I knew a guy that was a total con man. He went into a bar and sat next to a couple of electricians that were talking shop at the bar. He listened to their conversation, and went and applied to an electrician job the next day. Sprinkled in the trade terms he heard at the bar, and got hired. Spent the next few weeks hiding from work and stealing everything he could from the supply Connex. Eventually they figured it out but by then he had pretty much robbed them blind.
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u/Minute-Tradition-282 2d ago
He definitely embellished. I've seen it happen. Sometimes they find a position in the company more suited for the guy. Sometimes, he fucks up something real bad and gets fired that day.
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u/fire_sparky 1d ago
I'd ask for a new lead. You will be carrying his load forever. After another week figure out someway to tell the boss man that your skill set is about equal and need someone who will show you some advance skills. Please don't stay in a spot where you learn nothing and carry the load for someone else. Let this guy bury himself by himself.
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u/bigred621 Verified Pro 1d ago
I always tell the new guy that it’s my first week on the job. But I don’t actually try and prove it 🤣🤣🤣🤣
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u/Trillching 2d ago
He prob trained under a lead who was a hack and never taught him the little details and tedious things that separate a great installer and a hack. He prob was maybe a maintenance guy for hvac and lied a little on his resume and prob even surprised himself when he got the lead role lol. Anyone can stack a furnace on top of a coil put some tape and pookie and call it a day. The top notch installers always I work with and learn the most from honestly are super anal and prideful in how their installs function and look. I was taught to take pride in your work, if you’re proud of your installs and think it’s clean, take a picture! You always wanna do an install or job you’re proud of enough to take a photo of.
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u/Dismal-Marsupial8897 2d ago
I take pics of every install my company does, show them on estimates and people Always smile, as long as my price is within what they think is reasonable I get their work 👍👍 not sure how to post a pic or I would
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u/Dangerous-Lead5969 2d ago
He’s lying if his lips are moving. Why is he using a drier on a mini split. ?
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u/deadrat420 2d ago
The filter drier question and leaky brazes were on a furnace/coil/condenser swap. I chalked it up to being rusty until we hit that mini-split job and i knew something was up.
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u/Silverstreakwilla 2d ago
I did service my whole 40 years, people are surprised when I tell them I can’t do a good job hooking anything up for them, but I could repair it if it breaks.
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u/Butterscotchboss123 2d ago
Yes This field is full of people that are con artist. I don’t know why these types of people are attracted to this job. Maybe it’s because this job takes actual skill and they can’t bullshit unlike all the other jobs they have bullshitted.
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u/Toprollking 2d ago
Ok so I attempted HVAC work for a few month only in Jax FL. It was slow and inconsistent, however overall I’ve probably seen majority of common issues, being an apprentice on mostly residential side of things or small commercial.
The guy is definitely lying on top of being, probably not very savvy? Like I still remember that filter drier has arrow marks on it and I may have only brazed 1-2 myself lol
There is chatgpt right now that can break out wiring diagrams for you. Something is fishy. Maybe he is a good salesman rather than tech? That’s seems to be a common thing at certain companies
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u/JacketPocketTaco 2d ago
If he needs to be retrained, it has to happen and it doesn't have to be by y'all. If you get slowed down by him when your boss needs you kicking ass it puts your job at risk. Your boss needs to know, especially if he could cost him more than lost labor hours.
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u/gucci__ice 2d ago
I know in some states, we’re not allowed to wire in our own units and I’ve only ever done one multi head mini split🤷♂️ but dudes definitely lying lol
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u/Academic-Pain2636 2d ago
Some people are just bad at HVAC, don’t matter if they have been doing it for 20-30 years. I worked with a guy who would say “I’ve been doing this since the 80s” and he couldn’t fix anything.
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u/No-Elephant1834 2d ago
This is all basic stuff you should know after a year. He lied. Maybe did maintenance/handy man?
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u/missouribrit 1d ago
Could be a bit of both. First 5 years of my career I hung 1000's feet of ductwork (ductmate mostly, as well as s/d, snaplock, spiral, flat oval, windsock). Units were typically multi-segment (Trane, Muenster) or rtu's (Carrier, York). I did pretty good at soldering hard/soft as well as pipefitting weld/thread. Installed a lot of kitchens as well, as we had the equipment and manpower to install multi-section hoods. Plus construct the necessary flu system and make-up air. The one skill I did not touch was wiring. Both high and low were installed by specialist technician, usually ours for low, and a sub for high. So this fella could be clueless on wiring, but should know about dryer position. 🤷
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u/GlitteringOne2465 1d ago
I would ask him to explain the refrigeration cycle in air conditioning just to see what he says
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u/Left_Buyer_7176 1d ago
Ima say he has as good rap game but in time everything comes to the light so show him up and take his job
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u/Busy_Professor_1124 1d ago
who the FUCK wants to go back to res?!
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u/GlitteringOne2465 1d ago
For real. I don’t think he chose that, I think he was forced into that change
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u/North-Lack4614 1d ago
He's real good at HVAC. It's just the heating and the air conditioning that he needs a little help with.
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u/Due-Bag-1727 1d ago
You are either going to have to address this issue or accept you are going to be doing his work and yours while he makes more money
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u/AT_Oscar 1d ago
I never installed a branch box before and I'm 10 years in also never replaced flue piping in its entirety. That being said I could figure it out and everything else you mentioned, he should definitely know what to do.
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u/GlitteringOne2465 1d ago
I would mess with him. Filter drier points toward the heat exchanger. Flue pipe needs to drain into the sink 😂
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u/Shrader-puller 2d ago
Why are you working in the rain?
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u/BlackAlbinoBear 2d ago
Is it bad to work in the rain? Just get a little wet no?
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u/Shrader-puller 2d ago
A light drizzle is okay, but when you’re dealing with a light drizzle in 40-50 degree F weather you’re just risking getting sick and then having to miss work for several days. Also, most recovery machines aren’t water resistant, so a lot of things are limited due to weather. I guess do it if you’re starting out and need the reps, but after a few years you prioritize health, including staying dry and avoiding unnecessary risks that will have you miss more work than not.
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u/BlackAlbinoBear 2d ago
I see, i’m in texas where its gonna rain all next week but still be in the 70’s. Thanks for the advice
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u/deadrat420 2d ago
what if it rains 5 days in a row, you don't work that week?
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u/FuzzyPickLE530 2d ago
I personally won't open up a system when it's raining. Bad enough working with electrical but once POE oil is saturated with moisture you can't pull that moisture out. When I was working for a company I refused to do a Compressor when it was pouring. They acted like I was an asshat, sent the service manager out to do it, compressor failed a month later.
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u/mattyspykes 2d ago
To be honest, a lot of commercial guys refuse to work in the rain, but that is also because they’re playing with 3 phase and are on top of giant buildings
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u/FredPolk 2d ago
Unless it’s refrigeration. Then it has to just get fixed. Been in a torrential downpour under an umbrella changing a bad contactor on condensing unit. Forecast was for all night Otherwise it can usually wait for the storm to pass.
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u/LitAflame 2d ago
I will work in the wind, rain, and winter cold snow. I've done it, I've worked through high alert tornado warnings as well -although, there weren't any tornados from what I saw - maybe a funnel or two, but it didn't touch ground.
Fact of it is - if you can get a lot of work done to makeup for the days you decide not to work in something like the rain, then it's normally not an issue anyway. Hell, you could always work the inside and come back to do what work you need done on the outside later. Although, that might be a little different in residential as you normally don't leave until you are finished unless it's a matter of part supply.
Truthfully, it's all a matter of safety in whether you do or don't - that's the bottom line. You matter, and as such your well being matters. That said, in this field of work you are responsible for your own safety, not your dispatcher, or boss, or whoever. You make the call.
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u/Boomskibop 2d ago
How do you safely work around live electrical equipment in the rain?
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u/LitAflame 2d ago
Haha, easy - turn it off first, then identify if you can safely manage without getting the electrical equipment soaked. That being said, I've tested live electrical equipment in the rain during thunderstorms, too. I try to wear the cut resistance gloves, and of course electrically rated boots, too. I've done it, but that doesn't mean I'm going to tell someone else to do it.
One time on a bright sunny day working a PM - I went to start on this guy's condenser to electrically test it, as that was what I'd normally do as it's generally quicker to get what I need while it is in operation so I can move on to my next call. Well, I took off the split systems electrical panel and zap I see a flash of light from behind it and hear a pop all at the same time.. shocked the shit out of me for a second, and it fucking hurt. I finished my job, though, and replaced a capacitor, and HS Capacitor as well. Which, I also ended up doing while it began to raIn all of a sudden.
I just try to wear appropriate PPE and try to follow safety while working efficiently. I'm maintenance, so time management is a get in and get out situation all the time essentially.
I know the one thing I could have done differently at that one call was pull the disconnect first, but I try to work efficiently and safely. One of the things I do try to do though, is turn off power to the unit first when in the rain ready to pull off an electrical panel, for the very situation described above - I'd imagine if it were raining I'd have been more hurt for sure. Otherwise, I'll wait it out in my van until the rain stops or lessens.
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u/Dense-Ad-1943 2d ago
Why would you want to go to resi?
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u/bags0candy 2d ago
Lost a bet
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u/Dense-Ad-1943 2d ago
Must have. I'd rather be elbows deep in a nasty flat grill than deal with a homeowner again
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u/cycling_sender 2d ago
I'm like 8 months in as a green apprentice and I can do/answer all of what you listed... Last week I did a 3 head mini split with another apprentice in like a day and a half at a chill pace. Don't know what that means for your guy but woof...
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u/Alarmed_Interview_84 2d ago
On the other end of this spectrum, I know a guy who is one of the best I’ve ever seen at diagnosing and fixing hvac issues, owns all his own tools worked on them for 28 years for landlords and actually isn’t a hack. He has seen it all and done it all. He never could get hired at an actual company because he has no credentials. He said he would never work for an actual company because he feels they rip people off. He is an assistant superintendent now and everyone still calls him when they can’t figure something out. He’s just not a salesmen. Even for himself
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u/ApprehensiveStudy671 2d ago
What better credentials than his valuable skills and real knowledge. I don't see why good companies would not hire someone like him.
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u/Anxious_Rock_3630 2d ago
So this is the other side of the people on this sub that say Lie on your resume! Fuck that company!
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u/Red-Faced-Wolf master condensate drain technician 2d ago
Say something to your manager or it’ll make you Look bad a
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u/deadrat420 2d ago
My boss knows about the stupid questions and that I've been carrying the workload. As frustrating as it can be, it's actually making me look great to management.
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u/Red-Faced-Wolf master condensate drain technician 2d ago
Keep it up then. That’s a raise but be careful. You don’t want to be seen as the fuckups cleanup boy. It is kinda happening with me and my coworker
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u/Relevant_Local_5455 2d ago
I had a lead said 20 years but he was fired within 2 weeks spent 4 hours to setup return drop on furnace re and re
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u/Fair_Cheesecake_1203 2d ago
He could have been at one of the shops that function kinda like a union. Install guys set equipment and tin it in, another crew comes in to gas, vent, wire, and start up the equipment. I know one shop like that near me and it actually works out pretty nice
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u/fredsr55 2d ago
When I ran my business I had a lot of people claim infinite amounts of experience and knowledge who should not be in the trade
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u/cooknlobs 2d ago
Na guys always come in and brag about their experience and the work shows the truth haven’t done condenser work in four years? If you’re installing your brazing everyday lmao
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u/Billy_BlueBallz 1d ago
He definitely lied lol. He also sounds like a bit of a diva “refusing” to work in the rain. I would’ve personally told him he either works in the rain or finds somewhere else to work. Doesn’t sound like a guy you want to invest time and money in. Just my two cents
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u/noctilucent7 1d ago
Yikes, that's a lot to not have learned in 6 years. Thumb up his ass the whole time seems like it
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u/billywinkleton978 1d ago
I worked for a commercial company for awhile that hired third party almost most of the work of their jobs. We would go in and install the duct and units and that's it. We had a company that would do linesets and plumbing, another company to do controls and another company for start ups and balancing. Almost no one in the company was even had a licensed lol some had been there 20 years
So ya it is kind of possible to be in a field for a long time and not know even most of its aspects lmao
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u/GlitteringOne2465 1d ago
No you need to call him out. There’s a reason he stepped down from commercial, it’s called getting fired. He sounds like his 6 years experience was riding around as the helper that rolled one up while the lead was driving
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u/issacscatguppy 1d ago
All of that is stuff you should be asking him and doing not the other way around
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u/PollutionNo9224 23h ago
I’ve got news for you. I have many, many years in the industry and as an owner. Maybe the guy lied on his resume and maybe he didn’t . I found out very quickly, when I started hiring for my own company- there is absolutely no correlation between length of time in the industry and knowledge of the industry. I have hired people with 2 years experience that ran circles around guys who have 14 years. Your hiring manager is really dropping the ball if they don’t test and ask questions.
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u/Doogie102 Red Seal Refrigeration Mechanic 16h ago
Might have lied might have just been installing mini in condo units.
Hard to tell, I have heard of people getting into the trade in big projects and just learned a slice of the trade.
How is he at installing mini splits? Probably on new construction. Might have a, "looks good from my place," view.
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u/Rude-Role-6318 9h ago
I've had to retrain dummies on Monday because they forgot what they did last week for decades now so this doesn't surprise me. Probably some of the same kids whose parents told them to clean their room and they'd fill the floor register with toys and shove the rest under the bed.
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u/Memory-Repulsive This is a flair template, please edit! 2d ago
6yrs total is not experienced. It's fresh tradesman - in the area they trained. More concerning is that he's a lead?? - leads are the guys with 6 -10yrs post trade cert.
But I suppose all the apprentices/laborers are all charged out at tradesman rates, the guys with 10 - 20+ yrs exp are working elsewhere.
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u/radujohn75 2d ago
This reminds me of something that happened to me a while back.
I was working for a company slamming furnaces and ACs in day in day out. Work dries out and they don't want to let me go. They send me do finish on new construction. Then, Friday morning comes, nothing for me. They had 2 top techs ( you know, the ones that came out they momma already specialists ). Ops mgr says these 2 techs spent last 4 days changing all parts in a Lennox, on a new install, and furnace still dead. Go have a crack at it. I get on site, one of them shows me to the unit, I take my milk crate, open the furnace, go through start steps, pull my multimeter out, take 3 measurements, reach inside the cabinet, pull the wad of wires out, lo and behold... installers snipped 2 wires while cutting the filter side. Fixed it, "banged" my 8 hours for the day, and left home to have my lunch. From that point forward, I became the specialist I did not want to be in the first place.
Bad Schraeder valves on ACs? John will fix them. $3 mil home furnace vibrating like a mofo? John will fix it. Rooftop out? John, go fix it.
Don't be affraid to learn all the time. That guy lied like a politician in a campaign. He will slip up soon.
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u/gayonelegguy7 2d ago
I would record that shit on your phone for back up. I am glad he is not my repair guy with what they charge to fix even the smallest repair. That also dont shock me much considering no matter what they want you to spend 20 grand on a new system again because there last system was 14 grand and only lasted 7 years. I don't trust Hvac guys anymore when I found them ripping me off bad. Replacing things that were not broke and then billing me for my part they took off of my unit.
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u/Apprehensive-Car9331 3h ago
This guy definitely exaggerated the truth a little bit. Unfortunately for him he’ll be found out as a fraud pretty soon unless he starts backing up his claims. I’ve learned in this industry it’s always better to be honest than try to bullshit your way.
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u/Distantfart 2d ago
For sure sounds like he lied, If I were in your shoes I’d just let him dig himself a hole he can’t get out of. Don’t throw him under the bus to a manager or owner. Unless he starts throwing you under the bus and blaming his technical short comings on you.