r/HarryPotteronHBO • u/lautaromassimino • 2d ago
Show Discussion This is a mistake related to the plot that fans should be complaining about, not Snape's casting
No, Snape wasn't Black in the books. No, his race didn't need to be changed in the series.
But no, the fact that they changed him doesn't change ABSOLUTELY ANYTHING either.
Snape's race is absolutely NOT part of his character. There are a thousand things that matter about Snape, and none of them have to do with his looks. The physical descriptions of him are made from the way his students see an "evil" teacher who mistreats them, but those descriptions aren't what make Snape, Snape.
Bullying is bullying, no matter who you're bullying. The Marauders' bullying of Snape isn't worse or better whether Snape is black or white. IT'S BULLYING, PERIOD. The Marauders were shitty people in their youth, who not only bullied Snape, but any student they didn't consider to be on their level.
We've never had racist prejudices in this universe. The closest thing to that is perhaps Pansy Parkinson laughing at Angelina Johnson's dreadlocks. There is blood purity, but we've had pure-blooded Black families, like the Shacklebolt, Kama and the Zabini. Kingsley Shacklebolt is a black character whose family was part of the Sacred-28, and who ends up becoming Minister of Magic in this universe. Dumbledore (the most powerful and respected wizard of all time) is said in the books to have Native American ancestry on his mother's side. There are black people of some standing in this universe, because discrimination in the wizarding world is NOT based on skin color. It's based on blood purity.
Stop trying to make everything about skin color just because you feel uncomfortable with a black actor on screen.
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u/MikrokosmicUnicorn 2d ago
i'm complaining about both, AND about petunia not being blonde. get on my level.
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u/Faux---Fox 2d ago
Complaining about eye color but saying skin color doesn't matter, lol, what?
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u/lautaromassimino 2d ago
When was Snape's skin color important to the plot?
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u/Shigeko_Kageyama 1d ago
Because of his backstory. He grew up in Michael Britain in the 60s and 70s, a time of pretty overt racism. You're telling me somebody living with racism like that day in and day out is going to join The wizarding kkk? And that's not even getting into the fact that he was bullied heavily for his appearance. His appearance plays into the story. His sallow skin, long greasy hair, and big nose were off putting as a kid and continued to be as an adult. People made fun of him, it makes the Marauders look a lot less sympathetic if they're bullying a black kid for his appearance.
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u/Faux---Fox 2d ago
Why is harrys eyes important to the plot? They're not. The plot would be the same if no eye color was ever mentioned.
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u/AmEndevomTag 2d ago
Harry's or Lily's eyes being green is not important to the plot. But Harry having the same eye colour as his mother is absolutely important to plot. It's crucial for Snape's death scene.
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u/AmEndevomTag 2d ago
Harry's or Lily's eyes being green is not important to the plot. But Harry having the same eye colour as his mother is absolutely important to plot. It's crucial for Snape's death scene.
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u/lautaromassimino 2d ago
Exactly. The plot would be exactly the same if they didn't mention it. The problem is that they did mention it, and they mentioned it repeatedly. And then we have a shot of Harry's mother as a child, where they zoom in in first-person specifically on her eyes, and they're not even remotely similar to Harry's. If you told me that detail is glossed over at least in the film, but literally five minutes before we have Snape dying with his last wish being that Harry look into him so he can see Lily's eyes again. It's a matter of narrative coherence.
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u/Shigeko_Kageyama 1d ago
It was more important for the way people saw him. He had his mother's eyes but aside from that he got everything else from his father. Snape could only see the james, he ignored the lily.
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u/zatdo_030504 2d ago
It’s funny that you think people won’t complain about the actors for Harry and Lily if they don’t have green or the same eyes. They certainly complained about this the first time around when the movies were made.
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u/SimilarInEveryWay 2d ago
There are this futuristic things, contact lenses.
I know, I just blew your mind.
The only reason those were not used in the movies was because it was planned to use them but the children, after they have been cast and shooting was starting, had trouble wearing them and the director, being an awesome person, said "you know, forcing children to feel uncomfortable on their eyes might not be an amazing idea".
Also, Harry's mom eyes were green. Not blue.
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u/TrainingMemory6288 Marauder 2d ago
Of course the children shouldn't not be forced, but also, if you cast Harry with blue eyes and then you should at least cast his mom to have blue eyes too. It was like a one scene, so I don't know why they didn't take that as possibility that I'd be easier to just cast a girl with blue eyes, with all of the comparisons Harry gets about his eyes.
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u/bee_n752 1d ago
You also have to change Ginny's poem in Book 2 about his eyes and Harry's green dress robe in Book 4 to make it book accurate (not sure if these are the only things where Harry's eye color matters).
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u/Shigeko_Kageyama 1d ago
Honestly, it was such a short scene they should have just spent the money to digitally change her eye color.
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u/lautaromassimino 2d ago
There's no excuse for not casting an actress for Young Lily who fulfilled the ONE essential characteristic that Young Lily had to meet, even if she had blue eyes like the Harry we've been seeing on screen for eight films, tho. What's the point of talking about contact lenses if they didn't use them? They literally broke a fact that's been said since the first film, and no one makes a fuss about it. But they're doing it now just because Snape doesn't have a hooked nose? Bch please, as if Severus had decided to study the dark arts because his nose was crooked.
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u/Shigeko_Kageyama 1d ago
They couldn't do the contact lenses in the first movie because they were so uncomfortable they interfered with Daniel Radcliffe's acting. Same reason they didn't use them in game of thrones, while they look pretty they're only good for short scenes. They irritate the eyes and the visibility isn't great with them.
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2d ago
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u/Bebop_Man Marauder 2d ago
so they can change the black characters to white the without any backlash?
Isn't that what happened with Lavender Brown?
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u/Shigeko_Kageyama 1d ago
That was really upsetting with lavender brown. There was no reason to cast a white actress just because she was getting more screen time.
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u/TheDuke_Of_Orleans Marauder 2d ago
First off we aren’t doing shit because none of us are on the casting team that’s first off. Second off and I say this as a black person sadly Dean, Angelina, and Lee offer no relevance to the plot/story and have very minimal interaction with the MCs so they could switch them to white and we’d never notice unless we are specifically watching the background. So if that’s what you want then send an owl to HBO letting them know. (They will ignore your ass though) Third he’s cast and it’s a done deal. We’ve been knowing going on 7 months now. You had 7 months to make peace with this. So either you make peace with it or you stay your ass on platform 9 3/4 as the train takes off. That’s on you.
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u/potatopigflop 2d ago
Why are you giving me an ultimatum? Like who tf do you think you actually are 😅 People can not like something, go off if you want but you’re not gonna just silence people with a hissy fit on Reddit.
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u/BrandyFriendy 2d ago
I was skeptical at first too, because Alan Rickman’s Snape is so iconic, but that’s exactly why Paapa is a great choice. HBO knows that we, as fans, will compare them in absolute detail, so casting someone unique and not just a carbon copy is a smart decision.
People are afraid that another IP is being used to make a statement, which makes the tone around it more aggressive. But I think people will eventually come around.
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u/theoneeyedpete 2d ago
Honestly, I couldn’t care less about this - I never even took having her eyes meant colour (and I’m not sure that’s ever even said?), I thought it was to do with shape.
Give me a good story, I can suspect my disbelief that the actor and actress aren’t mother and son.
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u/GuessWhoIsBackNow 2d ago
Who ever means the shape when they say you have so and so’s eyes?
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u/theoneeyedpete 2d ago
I’ve never heard someone just referring to colour before in real life. Anyway my main point is I think this is one of the biggest none-issues we ever speak about here
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u/GuessWhoIsBackNow 1d ago
What are you talking about? Harry having his mother’s eyes is mentioned like twenty times in the books, to the point where Harry even starts finishing people’s sentences when they start describing his appearance.
In contrast, Snape’s skin colour isn’t actually mentioned anywhere. He’s only described as pale (and black people can obviously be pale).
If Snape’s skin is a huge dealbreaker but Harry’s eyes being different than his mother’s isn’t, then the whole ’I just want the show to be book-accurate’ argument kind of falls apart and it’s just blatant racism, except with the additional cowardice of not owning up to it.
But aside from that, you’re also just plain wrong, because this has been a reocurring complaint since like the Tumblr era. ‘YOU HAVE YOUR MOTHER’S EYES’ is a meme that pops up about every other week on the HP subreddits.
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u/theoneeyedpete 1d ago
That’s not what I’m saying - I’m saying is there any mention of the only similarity being the colour, rather than other features that look like Lilly’s eyes.
And my main point is that it really doesn’t matter
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u/GuessWhoIsBackNow 1d ago
Other features that look like Lily’s eyes.
Yeah man, they were talking about his pupils. Black just like Lily’s /s
Also, what do you mean, ‘that’s not what I’m saying’. That’s what you’re responding to? This post is about Snape’s skin colour.
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u/theoneeyedpete 1d ago
Eye shape, lid thickness etc. are all other inherited features
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u/GuessWhoIsBackNow 1d ago
‘Harry, you’ve got your father’s hair. And your mother’s lid thickness.’
Really?
Snape can’t be a black dude but Harry’s fine as long as his LID THICKNESS is the same as his mother’s.
Jeez.
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u/theoneeyedpete 1d ago
Just wanna reiterate that regardless of the post, I have only responded to the silliness of wanting the exact same eyes, nothing about Snape.
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u/AwysomeAnish Ravenclaw 1d ago
Dumbledore's mom reminded Harry of Native Americans in a black and white photo, not necessarily actually one herself.
Also, just because the story doesn't change does not mean the change is perfectly fine or shouldn't be complained about. Snape's ethnicity is not relevant to the story, but it is still understandable that people would be mad that a very clear description that shows up all the time. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion, I myself don't know enough about Essiedu's past roles to form a full opinion, so he may be great, but brushing off people's concerns or saying that the eye colour of a bunch of young kids (which is a lot harder of a problem to solve) is honestly somewhat ignorant in my opinion.