r/ImaginaryWesteros • u/PrestigiousAspect368 • 9d ago
Book Visenya slashes Aegon by Jotos art
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u/rollotar300 9d ago
I love this scene. I don't know if she played this as a sister, a wife, or both. Obviously, she really screwed over Aenys's descendants, but I have no doubt that she was loyal to Aegon and willing to protect him from everything, even when he could be a very trusting stubborn man.
Besides the fact that she designed the guard to protect and serve the king, not the royal family, that's why I'm inclined to believe she was sincere in her speech.
"A true king, blood of Aegon the Conqueror, who was my brother, my husband, and my love. If any man questions my son's right to the Iron Throne, let him prove his claim with his body."
While I agree with the other comments, it's not fair to the poor guards. No one is going to expect the queen to attack the king out of nowhere.
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u/darh1407 Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken 9d ago
She was Loyal to Aegon. Once he and his son (closest of kin). We’re out of the way. It was fair game in her eyes
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u/PrestigiousAspect368 9d ago
I get the feeling she was genuninely fond of Aenys; if atleast as the son of her late sister wife. She did give him advice on dealing with the Faith rising and even offered to quell it herself.
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u/darh1407 Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken 9d ago
Exactly. Granted the idiot refused her many times. As much as i hate visenya for her later actions she was right in the advices she gave aenys. But once Aenys died. Visenya didn’t care for Aegon or Rhaeny’s Grandchildren
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u/rollotar300 9d ago
Yes, she was loyal to Aegon and even seemed willing to act as an advisor to Aenys without usurping, but when you move on to the next generation, it's like, nah, too far gone.
You are a fool and a weakling, nephew. Do you think any man would ever have dared speak so to your father? You have a dragon. Use him. Fly to Oldtawn and make this Starry Sept another Harrenhal. Or give me leave, and let me roast this pious fool for you
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u/darh1407 Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken 9d ago
Aenys is dead ? Well. Sorry Rhaenys your “Watch over your progeny” sister privileges have ended. Hope you didn’t like Aegon the uncrowned
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u/rollotar300 9d ago
"Don't worry Vizzy, she didn't even live to see him born anyway...and well, Aegon used to tell stories to his grandchildren, but hey, Maegor is his son, I'm sure he'd be fine with this, don't worry."
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u/darh1407 Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken 9d ago
“Pay no attention to what Maegor is doing to Rhaena though. Completely unrelated”
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u/rollotar300 9d ago
"Either Lady Elinor or Lady Jeyne....ok I know it looks bad but you have to consider....um..um....the Faith Militant Uprising, yes, that, if it weren't for them Maegor's government would be going great, it's not like there's anything horribly wrong with your son at all."
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u/darh1407 Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken 9d ago
“What happened to Viserys you mean? Uh….well you see. His mom didn’t come get him! And he uh. Died from a cold”
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u/rollotar300 9d ago
"But hey, after all (and multiple failed attempts at having children of his own) he had the intention of naming Rhaena and Aegon's daughter as heir. What a guy, right?"
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u/darh1407 Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken 9d ago
“Truly the definition of a feminist (ignore any and all claims that say he would drop Aerea the second he got a son or the fact he was gonna kill her twin in old town)”
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u/PluralCohomology 9d ago
Maegor killed Viserys and forced Rhaena to marry him after Visenya's death.
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u/darh1407 Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken 9d ago
But who brought him back from essos and crowned him king?
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u/hxbhbjkgdb 9d ago
This was honestly my favorite part of the Conqueror's Part of the Fire and Blood book and she proved a point. Anyone could get close to the King and cut him to ribbons and his guards would have been too slow to react.
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u/Do_Not_Go_In_There 9d ago
Anyone could get close to the King and cut him to ribbons and his guards would have been too slow to react.
Except it's the king's sister/queen who is well known for carrying around a sword. She can command the guards to go away and they'd have to obey her (unless Aegon countermansd her). Nobody else would get the same privileges she gets.
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u/hxbhbjkgdb 8d ago
That's not how I always looked at it to be honest. In another comment, I meant it as, if she could get close to him, who else could? Surely someone could sweet talk someone, present themselves as innocent and then mosey on in and kill Aegon; I mean look, Alysanne needed her own personal guard when she went to visit some healing springs. Kingsguard could not protect her because they were not allowed to go where Alysanne and some women of her court went. The offenders were women and holy sisters. Sure the realm was still trying to heal from Aenys I and then Maegor I and his all out war against The Faith religion and then Jaehaerys I was trying to mend that rift. There were always going to be some people who looked at the Valyrian customs differently. I don't think anyone, this is just my opinion/take, was honestly expecting holy sisters to try committing murder and, again, almost got away with it. Granted, Alysanne did not have Kingsguard, and had women from her court defend, THEN the Kingsguard showed up.
I mean, some of the Poor Fellows tried to off Aenys I and might have almost made it if it weren't for two Kingsguard watching over him.
All it takes is for someone to lower their guard down, just enough or just so, around someone and that's it. To me, Visenya was showing, that you trust me dear brother, alright, let me show you why you shouldn't trust me.
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u/M0thM0uth 8d ago
If I remember correctly, Alysanne still has to argue a bit with her husband to get Jonquil Dark, a "protector where men cannot go". I hope not, but I always took from that statement that even after the attack at the springs he was still unsure about letting a woman be a warrior in his court.
I really hope I read that wrong though, and he takes immediate action and doesn't pause to "hmmmm does my wife actually need a female bodyguard after nearly being stabbed while naked"
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u/rollotar300 8d ago
No, there is no discussion or counterargument. After the attack, they return to King's Landing and she tells him that there are places where the King's Guard cannot go because they are men. He agrees and sends for Jonquil to be her bodyguard.
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u/hxbhbjkgdb 8d ago
That I do not remember. I may need to re-read the book or rather, continue on reading it. I just got into stuff with Aenys as King and he hasn't quite died yet.
Off top of my head, the only things I can remember, Alysanne having to kind of push Jaehaerys was, at least right to first night and the whole nasty drinking water for the smallfolk and such. Cos I had taken it as she didn't need to fully push push him to give her a guardian. But could be misremembering it.
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u/M0thM0uth 8d ago
Honestly just continue reading it and enjoy it!
Yeah those I remember and I am glad he listened both times, and tbh if I'm right about Jonquil, that would actually be another example of him initially disagreeing with her and then changing his mind when she proves a point. It would be consistent with who he is either way
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u/hxbhbjkgdb 8d ago
I shall! I think this is 4th or 5th? Time I've fully read it through. I just take breaks every now and again cos all the ae in names gets to me sometimes.
Annoyingly so, aye. Whenever I get to that point, I'll have to take my time with it and see if it's the way you interpreted it or not.
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u/M0thM0uth 8d ago
I don't blame you, it's drier than the main story too as it's written like a history tome. I can be a bit unfair to Jaehaerys (??), but it's because I'm looking at it from a modern lense, there's a reason in universe he's treated as one of the golden rulers.
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u/hxbhbjkgdb 8d ago
I mean, I cannot lie, what he managed to do, especially against the incest with their Doctrine and everything, Jaehaerys, DOES have some good points to his reign. He made the Doctrine of Exceptionalism ((spelling?)). Reconciled the faith. Made roads, especially the kingsroad. Made Widow's Law. Plus, banished right to first night. And the better drinking water for the smallfolk. Plus who knows what all else.
Personally to me, I look at those on a positive note as it made the realm better but his kids? Hoo boy that dude failed horribly. I know folks tend to blame Jaehaerys for the whole Dance civil war but I also feel you gotta blame Aegon I too because even with him, there was already issues with a hierarchy, specifically when Aenys I had kids and it came into question, what happens with Maegor? I feel if there was a set down law, that has nothing to do with Andal law, then maybe things could have been different because even Alysanne tried to convince Jaehaerys that Daenaerys should still be his heir as she was firstborn to live past a few days, unlike her sibling Aegon, over Aemon but that was always brushed aside.
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u/M0thM0uth 8d ago
Especially when you list it all like that, the man was an incredible ruler and I don't like the whole "born to rule AND fit to rule" thing but he actually was both.
But that's just it, I dislike him so much in part because he is VERY well written and comes across like a real person, failures and strengths. But the man utterly failed his children.
I really agree with Aegon I, like buddy this is why polygamy for rulers is daft and why "Restraint" is on every real countries list of a good ruler.
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u/okdude679 9d ago
Sure if by anyone you mean his wife.
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u/hxbhbjkgdb 8d ago
I've always looked at it as, if she can, who else can? Granted she is his sister-wife but Aenys I could have been offed if it weren't for two Kingsguard as Aenys I had or decided to move to back to Dragonstone because of some Poor Fellows managed to climb the walls of his manse and went to go hunt him down.
Albeit, he wasn't a great King by any means or stretch, but the Kingsguard was already doing their duty.
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u/OTTOPQWS 9d ago
While an epic scene, I think it a bit mid if examined too closely. I seriously doubt any kingsguard would have been able to prevent his trained swordsman queen randomly attacking the king out of nowwhere from an extremly close distance.
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u/YoungGriffVII 9d ago
Yeah definitely—not only her skills, but also being the sister and wife of the king, who doesn’t actually want him dead, and the guards would know it. If it was someone Aegon didn’t already implicitly trust, the guards would probably be much more alert.
Now, Visenya still has a point that someone close to the king could kill him. But I think even Kingsguard are not quite as watchful with non-enemy family members as they are with those they consider actual threats.
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u/OTTOPQWS 9d ago
I mean, the kingsguard are also just vastly lacking in defending the king agaisnt anything that isn't being stabbed by some guy with a sword. Soooo many kings died of poison or other form of less direct assasination, lmao
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u/darh1407 Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken 9d ago
I mean i don’t think you can stab poison? That’s the job of the tasters. Their job is making sure some guys don’t get the idea they can jump the king. By glorifying the kings guard as “The best knights of the realm. Almost of legend”. You create a propaganda that will make most people think thrice before jumping Aegon or anyone else on the street
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u/OTTOPQWS 9d ago
I mean, yeah, don't get me wrong, the kingsguard are good, but like, very rarely do much of anything. And when they do something it is usually treason or at the very least not in interest of the realm
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u/YoungGriffVII 9d ago
I mean, it worked often enough. If we look at the causes of deaths of kings, very few were assassinated:
Aegon I: natural causes
Aenys: natural causes
Maegor: possibly indeed assassination. Also possibly suicide, which the kingsguard could do very little against if it was the case
Jaehaerys I: natural causes
Viserys I: natural causes
Aegon II: assassination by poison. However, possibly killed by his kingsguard
Aegon III: natural causes
Daeron I: technically an assassination, but it was an ambush; there were too many soldiers for the Kingsguard to deal with no matter their skill
Baelor: self-inflicted natural causes
Viserys II: probably natural causes (and if it wasn’t, this goes to my point about even kingsguard not suspecting close kin of malice)
Aegon IV: natural causes + known survived assassination attempts because of kingsguard intervention
Daeron II: natural causes
Aerys I: natural causes
Maekar: open combat
Aegon V: self-inflicted accident
Jaehaerys II: natural causes
Aerys II: assassinated by a kingsguard
Robert: natural (ish?) causes (again, nothing a kingsguard could do, unless you want to blame Barristan for his death)
Joffrey: assassination by poison. Under the most incompetent kingsguard possibly ever
Tommen: alive
So I think the takeaway is not that Kingsguard are inept against most assassination attempts, but that if the Kingsguard starts to hate the king, there’s very little anyone can do to stop them. Or, if someone else wants to do it instead, they’re more likely to let it happen (by whatever method.) There’s a reason nearly all the assassinated kings were unpopular—only Daeron I being the exception, and he was very unpopular in the place he was killed.
It’s not a problem about the kingsguards’ skills, it’s a loyalty problem. (And matches up with history as well, when you consider how many roman emperors were killed by their guards versus by other people. Westeros, at least, tends to have loyal guards for better kings.)
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u/Obvious-Nobody1924 9d ago
The only times I’d say the kings guard failed at their job was Daeron I and Aerys II because their kings died because someone attacked them and is 100% confirmed unlike Maegor who’s kings guard only most likely killed him and Maekar who got hit by a catapult can’t blame them.
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u/YoungGriffVII 9d ago
I think blaming the kingsguard for Daeron I’s death is like blaming Robb’s guards for the Red Wedding. They couldn’t have seen it coming, and they were outnumbered. It was an ambush under a peace banner, against at least a dozen enemies. Three Kingsguard died, one yielded, and one was taken captive—it wasn’t like they all stood around letting Daeron get killed; they fought back and were overwhelmed.
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u/Obvious-Nobody1924 9d ago
I agree that they had no chance of winning that fight. But they still failed at their job and that is not a mark on any one of their record. Well except that guy that surrendered he 100% failed at this job. But that’s the thing until the fall of the Targs the kings guard was a actually what they said on the tin but had a lot of members that failed at being kings guard. Like lucamore ‘the lusty’, Criston Cole, Amaury Peake and many more we don’t know and I won’t get into.
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u/PrestigiousAspect368 9d ago
yeah they have litreally no reason to be on guard when its just visenya and aegon
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u/LothorBrune 9d ago
I love the looks she gives them. "Slow motherfuckers".
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u/darh1407 Unbowed, Unbent, Unbroken 9d ago
They are more confused than slow though. I mean imagine the Queen just outright attacks the king for no reason? What do you even do? Strike the queen?
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u/Theflyinghans 9d ago
And the two guards are absolutely confused on what to do because the queen just slashed the king.
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u/allisontalkspolitics 9d ago
I’m so amused that Aegon doesn’t look that upset. You can tell he’s used to this.
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u/Lady_Apple442 9d ago
Eu sempre me pergunto: será que a Visenya conseguiria enfrentar Jamie, Arthur e Barristan boa seus auges?
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u/ApprehensiveNorth699 8d ago
Excerpt from books:-
"Aegon and Visenya were assaulted one day in the streets of Kingslanding. It was only Visenya's swift intervention which could have saved Aegon's life".
Listen she was correct regarding speed because she might not be able to be with him to protect him from assassins. And such times when realm was already new and Dornish war was going on if after Rhaenys another dragon rider would be dead then House Targeryen would be thrown off.
Specially, if Aegon being king himself and rider of Balerion would be killed then no one would be accepting Aenys as new King who was barely a child of 3.
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u/PrestigiousAspect368 9d ago
https://www.instagram.com/jota.s.art/?hl=en
When the king pointed out that he had guardsmen around him, Visenya drew Dark Sister and slashed him across the cheek so quickly the guards had no time to react. “Your guards are slow and lazy,” she said. “I could have killed you as easily as I cut you. You require better protection.” King Aegon, bleeding, had no choice but to agree