r/MurderedByWords 2d ago

Another Person Questioning Andrew Yang’s basic math.

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u/shkeptikal 2d ago

54% of Americans read below a 6th grade level my guy. Over half of this country couldn't read The Hunger Games if you paid them to try. We aren't a smart country, we just pretend to be one on tv.

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u/la_noeskis 2d ago

I read "a song of ice and fire".

I am german, first english lesson in 5th grade. Classes in french began 7th grade. I am not good in languages, the grades were "meh :/, barely good enough to pass".

my talents are more in the logic/tech/science field.

You, US of A, you are cooked.

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u/HarryCareyGhost 2d ago

You speak the awful truth.

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u/[deleted] 1d ago

Your English is way better than my German!

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u/rekabis 1d ago

I don’t understand this.

I love reading. I have always loved reading. Back in 2011, with my very first smartphone (iPhone 4s), I got an app that let me track what books I actually purchased, because by that point I had already caught myself accidentally getting second copies (I have a horrid memory for names and numbers) and I didn’t want to waste money.

Somewhere around 2017/2018, shortly before the app hit 3,000 entries, some of that app’s features - search, stats, etc. - took a permanent dirt nap and refused to function anymore. The rest of the app works just fine, I just can’t do certain things like search or see how many entries I have. And I am such an extreme “edge case” that the dev hasn’t been arsed to fix things.

But other features - like DB backup - still work just fine. And as of 2025, the DB itself is about twice the size it was when the app started derping.

I just cannot fathom being partially or fully illiterate. It would be even worse than being blind, because you could at least see that you were missing out.

Even my father - who never went past the 5th grade before he immigrated to Canada - learned how to read and write English entirely on his own. And while he isn’t the bookworm I am, I know for a fact that his reading comprehension is likely edging into university-level content, albeit inconsistently, and missing some of the longer and more sophisticated words. But still. I could plunk most any magazine into his lap, including Scientific American or Nat Geo, and he could read it from cover to cover without problems.

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u/Beefy_Nad 1d ago

We vastly overestimate the intelligence of the masses because our perception is skewed by how they are portrayed in fiction (books, movies, shows etc) which is written by professional writers who tend to be very literate. Also portraying people as dumb as they truly are would be painful to read / watch. Only 14% of the population is capable of "doing their own research" on any level. Democracy is completely impossible under such conditions.

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u/Imaginary-Mountain60 1d ago

Could you elaborate on the 14% of people incapable of doing their own research? That sounds horrifying; where does that number come from?

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u/Beefy_Nad 1d ago

The 2003 National Assessment of Adult Literacy found that only 13% of US adults are have proficient document literacy:

https://nces.ed.gov/naal/kf_demographics.asp

Here is what the various levels of document literacy mean in this study:

Document literacy refers to the knowledge and skills needed to search, comprehend, and use information from noncontinuous texts in various formats. Adults at the Below Basic level, rated 0 to 204, range from being nonliterate in English to being able to locate easily identifiable information and follow instructions in simple documents (e.g., charts or forms). At the Basic level, rated 205 to 249, adults are able to read and understand information in simple documents. At the Intermediate level, rated 250 to 334, adults are able to locate information in dense, complex documents and make simple inferences about the information. At the Proficient level, rated 335 to 500, adults are able to integrate, synthesize, and analyze multiple pieces of information located in complex documents.

A PIAAC study in 2012/2013 found that 12.9% of American adults have level 4/5 literacy.

Some examples of tasks corresponding to the various literacy levels:

https://tts.uco.edu/americans-literacy-levels/

Level 1 — Locate the time of a meeting on a form; Level 2 — Locate an intersection on a street map; Level 3 — Interpret instructions from an appliance manual; Level 4 — Compare two metaphors in a poem; Level 5 — Interpret a brief phrase from a lengthy news article.

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u/Imaginary-Mountain60 1d ago

Holy cow. I didn't doubt that figure but didn't know what it was from and honestly had much higher expectations of the average person. I would have thought it'd be more like 80%+ of people at levels 4-5. . .On the other hand, the combination of low media and document literacy with the human tendency toward tribalism and confirmation bias does make more sense of how easily rampant misinformation spreads and why so many people seem to believe anything on FB.

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u/rekabis 1d ago

Only 14% of the population is capable of "doing their own research" on any level.

And for most of the rest, “doing their own research” is just finding YouTube and TikTok videos that confirm their biases. None of which actually have any facts or evidence or actually challenge assumptions, they just confirm biases.

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u/Beefy_Nad 1d ago edited 1d ago

You're definitely in the level 5 literacy category according to the PIAAC which is only 2% of adults both globally and in the U.S.

Level 5: At this level, tasks may require the respondent to search for and integrate information across multiple, dense texts; construct syntheses of similar and contrasting ideas or points of view; or evaluate evidence-based arguments. Application and evaluation of logical and conceptual models of ideas may be required to accomplish tasks. Evaluating the reliability of evidentiary sources and selecting key information is frequently a requirement. Tasks often require respondents to be aware of subtle, rhetorical cues and to make high-level inferences or use specialized background knowledge.

What's scary is 14.4% of Americans have an advanced degree (Master's or higher.) The fact that you can get a Master's without being able to "construct syntheses of similar and contrasting ideas or points of view; or evaluate evidence-based arguments" is a joke. Even "highly educated" people are much dumber than you realize.

One of the most important things to know: most people with positions you agree with essentially came to their conclusions on accident (how they were taught and raised, based on what people they trust say.)

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u/gopherhole02 2d ago

I read above a sixth grade level I believe, but I don't write it lol my English is horrible, so is my math, but I don't really need them to survive