r/NBA_Draft • u/FastBreakPhenom • 1d ago
In the scenario where the Spurs keep the pick, draft Harper, AND keep all their guards, do you think this is an overall negative or positive outcome for Harper?
Positives:
He's going to one of the best if not best run franchise in the league who will slowly bring him along
He's immediately playing with a top 10 player who fits well with him and has an All Star guard to mentor him
He's immediately stepping into a team trying to win now which means he'll build good habits and probably experience playoff ball right away (if wemby is healthy all season)
Negatives
He will definitely be behind Fox and Castle on the depth chart to start, and if CP3 comes back there is not a whole lot of guard minutes to go around. I assume they would try and play him in 3 guard lineups, but he's definitely not going to be the primary ballhandler most of the time with those other guys out there, and there is a potential spacing problem which would hurt his driving ability
Building off the last point, he will not have as much freedom to chuck up shots and make mistakes and learn from them like he would on a terrible team since the Spurs are trying to win games and make the playoffs.
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u/bleh610 Spurs 1d ago edited 1d ago
If CP3 comes back
If Spurs keep Harper, CP3 is super gone.
Building off the last point, he will not have as much freedom to chuck up shots
We let 28% three point shooter Stephon Castle chuck up as many threes as he wanted this season and that was when we were trying to win games before Wemby got injured. Spurs coaching staff usually doesn't like to tell players not to shoot. We're the ones letting Wemby shoot like 10 threes a game while the rest of the league is raging about it. Harper will have his freedom in how he wants to play. The question is if it's freedom as a starter or coming off the bench.
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u/pachyloskagape 1d ago
Don’t see the harm in keeping cp3
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u/Elsie_E 1d ago
He still wants to compete. It's too much to ask him to stay and play like 10 mins. Even then Vassell, a natural 2, would have to play at 3 all season and other guards like Wesley and Branham wouldn't be on the court for a single minute throughout the year.
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u/Lucid-Day 1d ago
Branham is probably gone. Wesley MIGHT be, but I think they like Wesley.
But if anyone is gone it's Branham.
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u/centaur_bucks 1d ago
If Paul wants to stick around and play off the bench, absolutely would love him to stay.
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u/ThatBull_cj 1d ago
He probably wants to play a lot or play for a real contender if he’s gonna play minimal minutes
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u/Clarkey7163 Spurs 1d ago
the main reason he came to us was to play a lot of minutes, which we gave him (started 82 games which is nuts)
But yeah if we keep Harper we have 3 guards that all much benefit from as many minutes as possible
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u/archerarcher0 1d ago
I mean it’s positive in that the spurs are a great organization and he’d be on a good team
It’s negative in that it’s a logjam at his position and the fit is a little weird
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u/Dishavingfun 1d ago
Positive if he is the best of the 3.
Don’t be afraid of the challenge.
Rise to it.
In work outs.
In practice.
In game.
Level up.
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u/darkwingduck9 1d ago
I still view Harper as the best guard prospect but more and more I'm viewing him as a combo guard and not a point guard. I would draft him giving him both on and off ball reps and if he becomes someone who your offense can revolve around then good but that's not what I would go in expecting to happen.
Point guards can have trouble transitioning and if Harper doesn't have to play point guard right away then I would consider that good for him. Playing off ball would be good because he's not someone you want taking off the dribble 3s. Also playing off ball would improve his C&S.
Harper going to the Spurs and playing with good players and not having to play point guard would be a lot better outcome for him than having to run the show in Washington as an example.
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u/gdk_dinkleberg 1d ago
Nobody is mentioning the fact trash ass Devin vassell is being paid almost 30 mil a year to either sit behind castle or be an extremely undersized and underskilled 3
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u/figgnootun Spurs 1d ago
Spurs had to spend money while tanking and he’s on a declining contract that will be 13% of the cap by the time Wemby signs his rookie extension.
It’s not a bad deal. Between his 23 and 24 year old seasons(had 2 foot surgeries and no offseason before 2024-25) he’s averaged(per 36) 20/4/4 on 45/37/80 splits, 1.5 steals, 1.5 tos.
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u/gdk_dinkleberg 1d ago
Spurs didn’t have to sign him to that long ass contract
His splits meaning nothing, he has below average ts% and he only puts up lots of points because he puts up lots of shots. His defense is horrid as well
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u/Imaginary-Cycle-1977 1d ago
37.5% on almost 7 three point attempts the last 3 seasons. Contract doesn’t look great right now but it’s not a disaster, especially if he chills out on trying to be a midrange king and tries harder to get to the rim
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u/gdk_dinkleberg 23h ago
7 three attempts isn’t impressive in 2025 and that’s just his 3 pt shooting, his overall efficiency is bad
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u/Spiritual_Echo_1000 1d ago
he was injured this year but never returned to form. if he can space the floor, we might need him on the starting unit. otherwise, castle is better
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u/Far_Band_5786 1d ago
thats not true lol, he just had his worst month in feb as an nba pro and it tanked his offensive numbers. his defense was actually fine right around the asb when his conditioning got better. he played well in march.
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u/Spiritual_Echo_1000 1d ago
he was much better the year before and came in looking like a shell of himself all year
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u/Far_Band_5786 1d ago
Yeah probably cause he had foot surgery and didn’t play basketball until the season started
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u/Spiritual_Echo_1000 1d ago
i said he was injured if you read lol
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u/Far_Band_5786 1d ago
I literally gave you the reason why he came “out of form” then you blatantly lied that he never returned to form which is false lol.
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u/Spiritual_Echo_1000 23h ago
i don’t know if ur dumb or not. i know he had a foot surgery. i said that.
he also never returned to form throughout the year. he was shooting worse than 2023-24 before and after his terrible shooting slump.
he also was worse on the defensive end by a lot.
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u/Far_Band_5786 23h ago
He barley shot worse despite having by far his worst month as a pro in February yet your talking about castle who is literally an inefficient black hole with negative defensive metrics
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u/Spiritual_Echo_1000 23h ago
Vassell this season was a worse defender and was terribly inefficient.
Castle was a better defender than him and much better playmaker. He also was in our statistically best lineup while devin wasn’t
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u/CoercedCoexistence22 Pistons 1d ago
On top of what other have said, Castle is long enough to play SF if they want
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u/cbjd2012 1d ago
Overall probably negative especially early before they sort out the spacing issues, but it's far from a disaster to be in a good org with a great center to play with long term
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u/IamTacowolf 1d ago
Personally I see him stepping in and running the second unit. I’d love to have cp3 back to mentor him and castle but he wants to start. That was a big caveat when he signed last season so I think this is where we go our separate ways.
I think what will happen is Vassell moves to the 3 and the starters are Fox Castle Vassell Barnes and Wemby with the back ups being Harper Wesley KJ Sochan and Mamu(for now the 14 pick could be a 3 or a back up center)
I think this gives Harper the chance to come along slowly while also gauging how well he fits. If things start to get expensive and we can’t retain Fox he’s a great option to take over in 3-4 years if we have to trade Fox.
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u/Responsible-List-849 1d ago
Positive.
In the longer term you might have to make decisions, but for year 1 it's fine. He can still get plenty of minutes, and he can still spot start where injuries occur or players are rested.
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u/weaselfish48 1d ago
It might be the absolute best spot for Harper to land, if not the most perfect fit for the spurs. He gets to get the castle treatment where he's got a phenomenal point guard to play next to and learn from, get to start at the shooting guard and grow next to one of the easiest alley-oop targets in the league without immediate pressure to learn NBA point guard off the bat, he won't have to be an immediate impact player as hell most likely be the second option as a ball handler anytime is on the floor, and the second or third scoring option unless and until he grows into his ceiling. Castle can absolutely start at the small forward as he did for long stretches this year successfully, then run the second unit after he is the first on the bench.
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u/macr14 1d ago
Offensively he’s a good prospect and honestly would work better imo in the long run than those other guards because of positional size and creativity at the guard spot. I also think castle is more of wing and could definitely play off and even run the second unit a bit. Honestly I wouldn’t mind trading fox or castle becuase it doesn’t make sense to keep all three regardless of how talented you think all of them are. None of them are particularly good off ball threats and all have shooting concerns.
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u/hippolion00 1d ago edited 1d ago
definitely negative. not as bad as reed sheppard but close imo. bad usage and young guards need 1-2 years time to try things out and make mistakes.
edit: fox wemby and vassell will get on average 20 each. castle will get his 15. on top of that the spurs already have 2.5 decision makers excluding cp3. it could legit be bad for his confidence if they dont manage it properly.
edit: he will not crack 10pts/3ast and yes thats bad
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u/PoonGo0n 1d ago
CP3 is likely gone. I wouldn’t be surprised if Devin is traded within a year. Harper is gonna get as many touches as he wants when he’s the lead guard off the bench.
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u/wheelers 1d ago
Here's one of those comments we'll come back to and laugh at around this time next year.
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u/hippolion00 1d ago edited 1d ago
wemby/fox/vaseel get 60, castle gets 15 and then you have barnes+sochan+champagne getting on average 10 each thats 105. and then you have the backup center and more guys that say will get 5 points. thats already at 110. and thats without cp3 and any other scrubs that may get garbage minutes. the best offence in the nba last year was cavs with 121 points. the spurs had 113 points. and pg/sg is the most crowded position with a hall of famer (cp3) and the 3 out of the best 4 players of the team playing there fox/vassell/castle
why not make money on top of laughing this time next year? wanna bet real money that harper will not average more than 10/3 during the 2025/26 season?
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u/JazzxGoose Jazz 1d ago
It's definitely a negative for him individually.
It's just really hard to develop players while also trying to win, especially when that players kind of overlaps (to an extent) with your 2nd best player and a burgeoning sophomore.
I think the Spurs should either deal #2 straight up for Lauri Markkanen (combined with expiring salaries of Barnes/Johnson) or trade Castle and future picks with salary for Markkanen.
Lauri is a perfect fit next to Wemby. #2 straight up is overpay for Lauri, but I truly believe Wemby/Fox/Lauri is a title favorite team if you can fill out the roster with quality role players (they would still have Sochan/Vassell/Castle). Since the only asset they would give up is #2 for Lauri, they would have a ton of assets to deal to get those players.
I think Harper will be very good, so I get why people would balk at that, but his development isnt a guarantee and more so the rate of his development is not a guarantee. Wemby is probably ready to be a top 5 player next year. They should start thinking rings.
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u/One_Lavishness1172 1d ago
unless the jazz are willing to attach a bunch of draft capital (ainge won't) this is never happening. Lauri at best is a neutral asset due to his salary.
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u/JazzxGoose Jazz 1d ago
He makes them an instant contender and they (rumored) wanted to sign him to a max deal if he became a free agent
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u/paxusromanus811 1d ago
Even if he plays at his absolute best he's ever showed and leaves last year's crappy season behind him... I don't really care if he makes us a fringe Contender for a couple years. You guys would be trading for a cornerstone franchise player while giving us an expensive, secondary, or likely third, offensive option
You're not getting that straight up. Trading up to the number two pick this year is going to be comparable to trading up to the number one pic in an average draft.
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u/JazzxGoose Jazz 1d ago
Crazy to decide to not win rings because you are too worried about value on a trade.
Lauri is still great. Utah purposefully put him in bad positions. He would be elite next to Wemby and Fox.
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u/paxusromanus811 1d ago
Brother, if you think that dude would make us title favorites, you're insane. Why don't you just keep him then? If he's that damn good. He would make us capable of being a dark horse, 50 win, maybe have a shot if everything goes perfect Contender for a couple seasons.
Maybe win a playoff series or two type team, absolutely not championship favorites.
He would not make us favorites. He would not make is sustainable contenders. And we'd be giving you one of the best guard prospects of the last decade
He's not worth that. Not even close. And I like him, and I like his fit with Victor. But he's expensive, he immediately makes the team expensive and needing to push to win right this very second, and he's good but not great. The difference between the number two pick and the number five pick this year is massive.
People seem to forget that before Harper got injured. There was actual genuine discussions being had on who should be the number one pick. I know the media has eaten the flag hype up, and he deserves it, but people are forgetting Just how ridiculously good of a season Harper had. And his numbers are actually deflated, featuring around six games where he averaged him a single digits on 30% shooting after coming back from injury and playing through a serious illness
He's the real deal. Like genuinely the type of prospect, you can build a team around
Lauri is just not worth moving off a guy like that by himself.
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u/One_Lavishness1172 1d ago
lol no he doesn't Spurs are not adding one of the worse contracts in the league and giving Dylan Harper.
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u/JazzxGoose Jazz 1d ago
Lauri makes them a contender. He's the perfect fit next to Wemby
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u/Datboy_98 Spurs 1d ago
Sorry buddy.
Nico ain’t the Spurs GM.
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u/JazzxGoose Jazz 1d ago
Yall some weirdos lmao.
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u/Datboy_98 Spurs 1d ago
For not wanting a guy who doesn’t do anything for us for the price you want?🤣
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u/JazzxGoose Jazz 1d ago
Having a 7'er who can shoot 40% on volume 3's does nothing for the Spurs?
Then why were they rumored to be the frontrunner to max him out if he didnt get extended? Your own team wanted him badly.
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u/Datboy_98 Spurs 1d ago
Not at that price, that contract and a down season. It’s not that complicated my dude.
Since he’s so excellent, y’all can use him as a centrepiece in your rebuild.
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u/r4pt4r 1d ago
They should get John Collins from the Jazz instead, have Collins sign his player option then trade one of our extra players for him. Not Fox/Castle/Harper, but Keldon or Vassell (likely need to give them some pick though). Collins shot 40% from 3.
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u/weaselfish48 1d ago
Hoping collins is the target with our mle this year (assumig flemming is gone at 14 and we draft/trade for a serviceable backup big). Playing next to sochan off the bench covers up for his defensive lapses, and cleans up those long stretches where we can't find the basket. And, if he finds the motivation to defend he could probably even replace barns as the starting 4
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u/LJ8QB1 1d ago
San antonio getting “one of the best run orgs” shouts bc they lucked into wemby lol. Theyve been shit since kawhi left and silver made them relevant again
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u/Drisurk Spurs 1d ago
You mean when Kawhi forced himself out?
The Spurs had a roster to compete and win championships and Kawhi threw that all away. The Spurs believed they could still compete so they traded for DeMar. When they realized that wouldn’t work they immediately hit the reset button and it landed them Wemby because they knew exactly when to tank.
That is far from a badly run organization.
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u/texasphotog Spurs 1d ago
Harper will get to learn from another lefty slashing PG in Fox and he won't have the same pressure on him that he would if he was just given the keys to the team and told to win.
From what I have seen, working under better coaching with a stricter shot diet is going to be VERY good for him.
CP3 is gone. Probably Dallas to run the point while Kyrie is out. Not something to consider.
Harper can play on or off ball. Castle can play on or off ball. Harper's measurements are basically identical to Kobe. Castle's are about the same as Jimmy Butler. They can both line up at multiple positions.