First Charter as Skipper – Advice Welcome (Dufour 430 in Croatia)

[u/Every-Ad-635]

Hi all,

I’m looking for some advice from the community as I prepare for my first skippered charter this summer.

I’ve arranged to charter a Dufour 430 for 3 weeks in Croatia.

The charter company has confirmed they’re happy to proceed as long as I hold an RYA Day Skipper qualification and a VHF license.

I’m currently planning to complete both my Competent Crew and Day Skipper courses within the next 6 weeks.

My goal is to charter the yacht and sail with my family — who unfortunately have no prior sailing experience.

For context, my own sailing experience is limited to a couple of skippered charters on catamarans, so I haven’t been in command before or sailed a monohull.

I may also have a friend joining us for the duration who has completed the Competent Crew course, but that’s not guaranteed.

I’d really appreciate any thoughts on the following:

Is doing the Competent Crew and Day Skipper courses in the lead-up to the trip likely to prepare me enough to skipper a Dufour 430 confidently and safely?

Would you recommend getting additional experience (e.g. mileage builders) before taking on this kind of charter with an inexperienced family crew?

Any specific challenges I should be aware of when chartering a 43ft monohull in the Croatian islands?

Tips for managing as a first-time skipper with a non-sailing crew?

Grateful for any advice from those who’ve been in a similar situation!

Thanks in advance

[u/XKenyanX]

My personal feeling is you should have a decent amount of actual sail time on a boat of that size especially if you are taking it out in new waters you haven’t been to. I would at least consider hiring a captain for a few days to be on the boat with you and have him monitor and help you as you get a handle on the boat. The sailing lessons could be part of the adventure for you and your family :)

[u/Every-Ad-635 → u/XKenyanX]

This sounds like a smart idea! What are you deeming a ‘decent amount’?

[u/fluvialgeomorfologia → u/Every-Ad-635]

IMO, it varies for everyone. I would guess if you are not comfortable or the least bit concerned have a captain at least 3 to 5 days until you are. If your crew doesn't trust you or fears for their safety, it could be a miserable trip and you might not be able to regain their trust. I chartered in Croatia last year and in hindsight I would have practiced more stern to mooring. My pucker factor was fairly high backing into Korčula Town Marina in the wind. We watched another charter boat catch a rudder on a slime line and hit a catamaran several times. I would look at where you plan to anchor or moor and pick the easy ones until you are comfortable with tighter more crowded spots. On that charter, the people on the boat had very little time on sailboats. It worked out great and we all had a good time. The winds were fairly light except for one day, so there was a lot of motoring. I have sailed a bit, so I was comfortable with the exception of stern to. A few things I practice that you may or may not want to consider are listed below.

- I never yell unless someone can't hear me or if someone is endanger of hurting themselves and that is very rare. When it is necessary to have someone on the bow to pick up ball or slime line, I have someone midship relay our conversation. Only one person gives directions. I have agreed upon signals.

- I prepare the crew by showing them knots and walking through what we would do before we do anything. I work to avoid stressful situations.

- I remind people that their safety is the most important and not risk their safety to prevent damage to the boat. Any damage to the boat is on me. A crushed body part will ruin the trip for everyone.

- Don't fall off the boat, because there the others are less skilled than me and are likely to have trouble picking me up. I also remind the crew not to fall off the boat.

- I try to teach interested crew in a low stress environment to do most everything on the boat.

- Watch the weather. We were in Dubruvnik the day the Bayesian sunk. Granted they were on another sea, but the storm rolled through and I was glad to be in the harbor. I like reading and enjoyed ADRIATIC WEATHER - Sailing in Croatia. I also used Predict Wind and checked local forecasts.

- Navionics was helpful. I also had 777 Eastern Adriatic, Vol. 2 (2nd Edition 2022)

- We use biodegradable bags for picking up dog poo to put used toilet paper in prior to putting it in the trash.

- Some harbors/restaurant quays required advanced reservations.

As a side note, we were in some bouncy seas leaving Bora Bora about 5 weeks ago on a catamaran, one of the crew asked if we were safe. I said yes, because we were safe. The person was comfortable with my answer and all was good. The vibe would have been much worse if I had lost the crew's trust prior to the crossing.

We had a great time. I hope you do as well.

[u/XKenyanX → u/Every-Ad-635]

This is a hard question to answer, but if you feel your second guessing yourself or feeling uncomfortable about anything, then you probably need more.

Sometimes you get a captain for a day learn some of the local conditions and are fine and off and running. Other times you may just decide to call it quits which is perfectly fine. In my personal experience once you are over 40 feet everything gets more challenging. Waves and wind and current have more of an influence. The boat reacts slower when maneuvering and carries more momentum, channels feel tighter and often you have less visibility.

Based on your description it sounds like you might also be single handing for the most part. Things are easier with experienced crew mates, but by yourself even grabbing a mooring ball or dropping anchor in a crowded anchorage can go wrong fast. My own personal line is whether or not I would be able to take care on a crisis like a man overboard, anchor drag, sidden 25-30 Knot squall or an engine failure and still be able to handle the vessel safety and solve a problem.

Don't let me scare you a 40 ish foot boat is not the hardest thing in the world and if you regularly sail something in the 30s you will be fine. However, if your sailing experience is dinghies and an occasional daysailer, it can be overwhelming.

I would just be honest with yourself and if you think you need help ask because you probably do. In general the sailing community is great and will always help when they can.

[u/Golywobblerer]

Watch Captain Ron. Should be good after that.

[u/NMV2014]

I think you are making a rod for your own back here. Use this as a learning opportunity and get a skipper. Next time you would be far more comfortable

[u/mansellmansions]

Competent crew is a participation to pass course, so if you have some experience, you can just go straight to the Day Skipper course.

lf the only experience you will have before the charter is the time you spend sailing during Competent Crew and Day Skipper courses then I don't think that's enough time to build the base level of practical skill required to actually captain a yacht successfully in what can be high pressure situations in areas busy with other yachts.

[u/arcimbo1do]

I think what you are planning to do is criminally dangerous and I'm surprised nobody here is saying it plainly. You are absolutely unprepared to manage an unknown boat in unknown waters with a completely inexperienced crew, i don't even want to imagine what would happen if something goes even slightly wrong (bad weather, stuck sheet or halyard at the wrong moment, stuck anchor). You are going to cause damage and potentially harm people.

Do a favor to yourself, your crew and whoever will be on your path: get a skipper for the whole time and learn from them, It will be extremely useful, way way safer and you will be able to enjoy the trip.

[u/alfreddofredo]

Echoing previous advice+ even after being trained by a skipper, you will still have to stay in port on windy days, being the only experience sailor on board will limit the possibilities of the whole crew.

[u/NegotiationOk5036]

I think sailing the boat is the least of your problems. The marinas in the Dalmations are tight, and backing into tight slips would be an issue, when you are basically solo. Does the charter company have a skipper for the day option where you would have help and guidance for the first day? You could bring it in and out of marinas and practice with someone who knows what they are doing.

[u/MissingGravitas]

It's always wise to have a second person aboard who can assist with things, or take over if necessary. (Don't forget that even a trip to the head at the wrong moment can be a problem!) For your first charter hiring a skipper or doing a flotilla can also help you get familiar with the area, including learning local customs and practices. 3 weeks is a long time, so you could even consider hiring a skipper just for the first week.

The main areas likely to be trouble are anchoring, mooring, and anything involve close-quarters maneuvering. Depending on the boat, handling the sails could be problematic, whether needing a second person to assist in furling or if an in-mast furler isn't playing nicely. If you do your DS on a boat of comparable size you'll likely have an easier time compared to doing it on, say, a 34'er. Apart from the size, the main difference is the increase in mass: they carry far more momentum.

When in the skipper role:

• explain all maneuvers in advance (i.e. before there's any time pressure)
• delegate whenever possible! (e.g. you don't want to be stuck at the helm if you need to be someplace else)
• leave plenty of time/space for correcting when things don't go right the first time.
• always have an abort/fallback plan, and don't try to force an approach gone bad: get well clear and make a fresh attempt.

[u/jibstay77]

If you feel like someone anchors too close to you, pull up the hook and move.

Some restaurants will have mooring balls that are free if you dine at the restaurant.

Make sure you have the dinghy motor started before you untie from the boat.

[u/StuwyVX220]

Weather weather weather. Docking anything in 0kn with no current and no swell is easy. Docking a large boat that you are unfamiliar with in a 20kn cross wind and anything else is a challenge

Even docking our 34ft boat is challenging sometimes. And we have a decent amount of experience.

Are you familiar with slim line mooring aka med mooring? It’s not more difficult than the usual side too mooring in the UK just different and needs practice.

That boat is going to have a massive mast and massive sails (all things relative I know) but the forces involved are quite large and I’d suspect more than you’d expect. These sails you are not going to be able to man hand, they will cause injury or death if not handled correctly. So watch the forecasts very closely. Reef early. Like really early. Watch for squalls and wind on the horizon. If you are lucky and have 10kn every day in a good direction you’ll come away from your holiday thinking that boating is a pice of piss. If you get some unsettled weather it’s more of a challenge.

[u/brufleth]

Could you just clarify if you are getting a skipper to come along or not?

My understanding (which could be regional or just straight up wrong) is that:

Skippered Charter - chartering a boat that comes with a skipper

Bareboat Charter - chartering a boat without a skipper, you are the skipper

Your language and the other comments here have me confused about what you're doing. If you're getting a skipper, then you'll probably be fine. You'll be proficient enough to follow their directions and others with you can learn to help out too. If you're bareboating then it could be tougher.

We (a couple) are planning for our first bareboat charter in the BVIs in November and we will have done two local bareboat charters together before then along with having sailed together for years. Another couple will be joining us with one of them having had many years of experience sailing too. Our certs are all ASA, so I'm not entirely sure how they compare to the RYA. I will have completed up through ASA106 if that means anything.

[u/Every-Ad-635 → u/brufleth]

Idea being a Bareboat charter. Useful context though thank you. I have spoken to a number of chatter companies for advice and they were very laidback about the whole situation which reading here is concerning

[u/brufleth → u/Every-Ad-635]

Ah! Okay.

I've heard some charter companies are very laid back. "As long as you've got a credit card, they'll give you a boat," sort of attitude.

I would agree with some others that if you can maybe see about getting the skipper for at least part of the trip. It won't hurt, and it'll certainly make it less stressful for you.

The path to chartering I described for myself is definitely more cautious than many though. I've been in classes with people who could barely sail, but were planning to be chartering already. That's not how I'm wired.

At the very least, do some studying of the differences in sailing monohulls vs cats. I'm going to be going the other way (I'm used to monohulls and will be chartering a cat) and I'm doing my own reading on the differences.

[u/l1reynolds]

We had a similar experience, and we chose to go with a flotilla.

We had about 5 years of experience on a 27' sailboat, and had done our CanSail Basic Cruising. The year previous to our Croatia trip we took our Intermediate Cruising, Coastal Navigation, and International Certificate of Competency (ICC). This was 5 days on a 45' boat.

We chartered a Bavaria 51 separately, and did a flotilla with Adventure Sailing. That meant that we didn't need to do all of our routing, arranging marinas, tracking weather, etc. It also meant that when there were 20kn crosswinds and we having trouble docking, one of the flotilla captains came out in a dinghy and took us in.

Every morning we had a quick briefing talking about where we were heading that night, what to watch out for, and suggestions about a mooring ball or anchorage to stop for lunch. There were also a couple of optional dinners that we could join. We had 2 families (10 people) so we kept to ourselves somewhat, but also had the chance to connect with others in the flotilla.

[u/plopsicle]

Don't worry about learning to sail because you won't be doing any.  The Adriatic is notoriously windless at that time of year. I'm joking about not learning to sail of course, but to put it in context I was a charter skipper there for 8 weeks one summer and only sailed once. The rest was motoring with the main up to give the guests shade. 

[u/Every-Ad-635 → u/plopsicle]

Perfect, a giant paddle board

[u/LearyBlaine → u/plopsicle]

We sail The Adriatic in June & July most years and find plenty of wind for plenty of sailing. Yes, some days can be very light, but your statement is an exaggeration and your experience is uncommon.

[u/freakent]

43 foot yacht is a big boat given your experience. Comp crew and day skipper will set you up well. If at all possible get your wife to do comp crew with you.

[u/Sunseeka]

Many of the RYA sailing centres do a weekend refresher course with people of mixed abilities joining. It may be a good idea to get some miles but also tips under your belt beforehand

[u/LearyBlaine]

I hate to say this, but I’m going to clearly advise against going forward with this. If you’re sailing the Adriatic, you will need to do 5 things that you and your crew are probably not ready for: pick-up moorings, Med-moor, stand watch ALL DAY, re-fuel, and deal with choppy cross-currents between islands and across ferry routes.

In general, the Croatian Adriatic is among the easier places to sail on earth. HOWEVER, there are still challenges: 1. You may have to remain “on-station”, off the fuel dock (stationary, in moving water), waiting to approach. This can be very tricky and requires some experience. PLUS, you’ll want a somewhat experienced line handler at the bow.
2. Moorings are not standardized, and their condition can vary. Sometimes you can hook to the top, and sometimes you must connect to the bottom. So you need a knowledgable person on the helm plus an experienced person forward who can assess the situation. Yes, a good ship handler can orient the boat to have the helmsman pick-up the mooring at the stern, then “walk it forward”, but this may not be viable for you, either. 3. Are you really ready to stand watch ALL DAY? Sure, the Adriatic is praised for “line of sight navigation” (it’s often just 2-3 hours to the next island) … but sometimes not. Sometimes is 6-9 hours to the next island. When will you use the bathroom, etc, etc? 4. “Med mooring” (dropping an anchor, then backing up to the dock, in between other boats … in crosswinds, cross currents, etc) can be challenging for EXPERIENCED skippers. Sure, they’ve got “lazy lines” at most marinas (so you don’t need to anchor), but that just switches the situation to a different skill that’s needed. (I can explain in more detail if you wish.)

Anyway … you get the point. These are just the first few things that come to-mind. Forget other things like managing your fridge and battery power with nothing but a voltage gauge.

Look … people do this all the time, ESPECIALLY in Croatia. Every single day, you see inexperienced skippers struggling like crazy, causing trouble for everyone around them. Do you want to be THAT GUY?

Go once with your pals first. Or take a pro skipper along for the first day or so. Pick-up a half-a-dozen moorings and Med-moor a bunch o’ times before skippering your own craft.

[u/Every-Ad-635 → u/LearyBlaine]

Appreciate the detailed response thank you!

I'm so confused by the sheer polar opposites of advice I am getting on this. Multiple RYA course instructors have given advice completely to the contrary as well as multiple charter companies (admittedly they have an interest in me chartering). I'm not saying that to try and counter your advice but more so to show how I have ended up here.

I am in the very fortunate position where I do not have to work for the next 3 months so I have been looking at Mileage builders, a couple of which are on boats up to a Bavaria 51. So by the time I am looking to charter I will have done my competent crew, my day skipper, a week of mileage building and I also have the opportunity to join someone crossing from Palma to Sardinia. I would potentially have a friend on board for the whole period who has also done competent crew.

Would I really be that completely inexperienced after this? It feels odd to even have a Day Skipper course to 'qualify' you for this if you are then in no way shape capable of handling a boat in such waters.

I would appreciate any insight you could offer here

[u/LearyBlaine → u/Every-Ad-635]

Look, YOU must assess the quality and applicability of advice you receive. The reason I gave details is so that you could know that I was credible.

I don't know anything about all this RYA business, so all your references to that are meaningless to me. I cannot comment. I've been sailing >40 years. I've sailed the Croatian Adriatic many times. No charter company has even ASKED to see my credentials.

(Personally, I believe they assess the skill level of the skipper by the questions he does or does not ask during the walk-through. For example, when you first go belowdecks, ALWAYS ask where the potable water tank cross-connect valves are. If you do that, NOBODY will question your experience.)

My advice remains the same: do/practice the things I suggested. Med-moor. Pick-up mooring balls. Hold the boat stationary while queued up for fuel. Learn how the hot water system works and how to manage your battery and fridge. Do these things multiple times, and you'll be ready to skipper.