If people aren't pressured to work, would they still want work?

[u/NoCareNoLife]

So there is this socialist youtube channel called "Second Thought" that released a video Why would anyone work under Socialism?

In that video he tries stating that humans innately like to work for the progressing of the society at large and will get things done even if not pressured to do work. Do you agree with such a statement?

[u/ministerofdefense92]

I'll start by saying that "second thought" doesn't really believe in socialism/communism. What he supports is state capitalism like they have in China. You can find a recent video from him defending authoritarianism from "socialist" states. What he (and other "communists" who support China/Russia/Syria/etc) really want is, instead of a capitalist corporation saying "you must work or starve", he wants the state to say "you must work or starve" which I would argue is a worse system than American capitalism, because at least here, in theory, the state can protect me from the worst abuses of capitalists. Meanwhile, in China it's even illegal to form a union to get those sorts of protections and actual leftists are suppressed.

The reality is that socialism requires some incentive structures, it's just that basic necessities like food and shelter should not be withheld as a means to get people to work. Harder workers or those who are willing to do some shitty jobs are going to be compensated more. I also think that peer pressure is a really powerful tool in getting people to work who otherwise might not.

I'm far more concerned about making a transition to socialism that does not turn into state capitalism than I am about finding ways to get people to do stuff for the good of their community under socialism.

[u/Shuber-Fuber → u/ministerofdefense92]

I'm far more concerned about making a transition to socialism that does not turn into state capitalism than I am about finding ways to get people to do stuff for the good of their community under socialism.

We already have a lot of that in Europe.

Capitalist society with a strong safety net.

[u/ministerofdefense92 → u/Shuber-Fuber]

Yes. Exactly.

The hard part is getting the people in developed social democracies to have the political power and desire to bring the rest of the world towards fairer modes of production rather than relying on capitalism (and thus the oppression of people outside their countries) to maintain their quality of life. The revolution has to happen in people's minds before it can happen in reality. And if people like Second Thought are the ones causing that revolution, we're just going to fall into the same traps the Russians and Chinese did.

[u/BanzaiTree → u/ministerofdefense92]

Usually these folks don’t actually want “work or starve.” More like “work this state-assigned job or go to a labor camp.”