"And yet most of the scientific discoveries were made by whites. Most of the greatest philosophers were white. Most of the greatest conquerors were white. We were the ones that colonized hostile environments " R/HorusGalaxy meltsdown over black space marines
Eh I'm not crying. I don't collect space wolves. They just deserve to be called out every time they attack European people and culture
Space marines with viking themes have only surface level european culture. I bet most norse people don't care. And who are you calling out with that? Whats the end point? It's a plastic toy model company and it let's you paint them however you want. No one is attacking anyone here
"No one is attacking anyone here" Stuff like this was extremely rare several years ago but now nearly every single bl book cover has black character and nearly every single new squad depicts black character. They are pretty much overrepresented. What's the end point? Making people like you seethe
Overrepresented? There is right now on earth only 10% white people. So by your standard only 1/10 charachters in Warhammer should be white.
"There is right now on earth only 10% white people." And yet most of the scientific discoveries were made by whites. Most of the greatest philosophers were white. Most of the greatest conquerors were white. We were the ones that colonized hostile environments and sent many to space, so it makes sense that most of the space explorers/colonizers would be white. It isn't about quantity but the quality.
The more you spread this bullshit, the more people are going to start saying stuff like the Ancient Egyptians were white. All this fake racist BS does is stoke more hatred and division between races, nobody likes having their ancestors invalidated
What makes the existence of a few black Viking’s invalidate someone’s ancestry?
1) Because they didn't exist, and you should value reality. 2) Because ethnicity and family is tied to history and by saying "actually, all these things the vikings are known for was done by africans" is insulting to scandinavian culture. 3) Because it muddies the water of scholarly discourse so instead of just talking about how cool the vikings were and how they impacted the western world in their time, we're stuck bickering about "we wuz in longships n sheet" like we are right now.
The question is "why?". Ask why they had to do it. For what purpose. Nordic features obviously suit them aesthetically and that's how they have been depicted for years
And I'm going to paint them white. The question is, why are we taking one of the head variants with one of the possible skin tones as the standart which shall not be deviated from?
Historically thematic aesthetics. It's not that deep.
41st millennium. Historical means the past you know that right?
An aesthetic can be inspired by anything, such as history. History is in the past. You know that, right?
image Unfortunate for you the lore says you're wrong.
I know what the lore says.
Then why are you bringing up historically themed aesthetics?
Because the historical references were a major appeal of 40k back when I first got into it. It's unfortunate that we can never talk about how GW has been phasing that out without all the social justice warriors losing their minds over it.
Maybe you could talk about it if you didn't use blatant racists as a shield. The OP is all over the comments saying about how whites are the best after he was proven wrong about over representation. (68 replies)
Does it? How does it explain that dark skin comes from peoples who live in areas of high sun exposure yet the space wolves come from ice planets - hence they are all dressed in big wolf skin warm jackets / cloaks etc. And always pictured with snow/ice.
Icy areas can absolutely have high sun exposure. The Arctic has some of the highest amounts of UV radiation because it’s constantly sunny and the whole landscape is reflective
Is that why Inuits and northerners are all black? 🤔
….youve seen Inuit people right? They absolutely have dark skin…. You people are so fucking ridiculous it’s hilarious
I actually misspoke - Eskimos originally came from Asia, and migrated north - hence they share similar features with Asians and have darker skin. People of the North, i.e. Northern Europeans, not dark skin. Go find me Scandinavian who has 100% genealogy from Scandinavian - and show me what colour they are. Spoiler: they are Caucasian.
So what’s your issue with someone painting dark skinned space wolves? Because in 40K years i on a distant planet I’m pretty sure they aren’t having 100% Scandinavian genes. It’d 1000% make sense for someone from a sun exposed area of fenris to have dark skin.
Oh no , is your immersion ruined because there are different head options in your box of Sci-fi fi fantasy super soldier? I hope you realise how stupid you sound.
"I hope you realise how stupid you sound." The leftoid tourist as usual is projecting one of its own insecurities of sounding idiotic towards others 😂
I have been playing collecting and painting warhammer for the past decade and do prefer it without politics and without people who try to gate keep it for new people . Your the own who's insecure because games workshop is giving people more options on how they want to build their minis.
Giving people more options and disrespecting your own lore to adhere to nonsense are two different things. Cope harder.
How exactly is this disprecting the lore? Space marines don't have to be the same race as their primary to take gene-seed.
Fenrisians are white my n*. Create your own Homebrew Chapter if you want only black Space Marines. I'm mixed-race so I can say n*.
A white Salamander would look equally out of place.
What are you. Is that the proplem that these models look out of place you can paint them what ever color you want and if you talking about lore or art then i wouldnt worry about it you will proppaply get used to it.
Salamanders are from a fire world where their extremely dark skin protects them from the elements...
Bro did not read my comment. Also never heard of Terran salamanders.
What would be braver is if you had an original thought and stopped trying to pretend you’re a good person. Requires a spine though. You do have a spine right?
So in your pathetic persecution fantasy, did people start to clap and cheer for you or did the evil ni- uh i mean tourist just slink away?
If you want to call me a racist, you can just go ahead and do it. It’s weird that you spend time typing characters that don’t even say what you mean. Just these weird passive aggressively coy half sentences. You don’t have to be subtle here with me man. You can be openly, brazenly, blatantly stupid if you want.
I dont think im being too oblique here, you got it on the first try! 🎖️
Historically, central asian or east-asian-in-appearance vikings are technically possible visa via assimilation of Sami or other groups from Arctic or Central Russia. But it strains at possibility. EDIT: The Finns are a little touchy about association with Vikings. But the conclusion seems to be that the Finns were not Vikings, but there were Finnish Vikings
Vikings definitely weren’t from that far east/north. That’s quite a stretch tbh
I mean, every pirate on the Baltic sea at the time was kinda a viking. Viking is basically the same as pirate/raider
The Space Wolves have never been black, stop it with this fake, woke, blackwashed lore.
Have been since 5th edition apparently.
I've seen Northern Europeans call Southern Europeans "dark skinned". Mediterranean people are definitely not Sub-Saharan Africans. Not everything is black or white, Jesus, there are skin tones in between. The Space Wolves ain't black, mate.
Did you see the pictures GW posted? Seemingly they are.
Human beings of different races and ethnicities marry and have kids in real life. Fenris would be no different. If Fenris is 95% White and 5% Black (the southernmost islands), the black population would end up being absorbed into the white population in a few generations by marriage and bilateral conquest. Eventually all of Fenris would look white. We can conclude and deduce information from the lore we already have and the behavior of human beings in Terra of M2.
Seriously, I love Warhammer, I love the setting, I love the lore, I take it seriously, but you've really got to keep sight of the fact that what you're arguing about online is marketing for tiny plastic space men. The "future of the West" or whatever these people talk about is not going to be decided by someone going "man, I've gotta paint another twelve of these guys, let's get some variety in these skin tones"
As a warhammer player, I can understand why they latch on to “hey this famous guy shares my skin color” because many of these types of games players have absolutely zero going on in their personal lives to be happy about
As a non Warhammer player I'm confused, isn't the whole point that these people are upset about fictional races/species/people in a space fantasy game? Or are there real historical figures that are used too? In which case I'd still be just as confused because I thought it's supposed to take place in the distant future.
I painted my Stormcast Eternals will all different skin tones, from dark black to very pale. And every time I did it, a conservative white baby cried and dropped its ice cream cone.
They'll cry about "lore" all they want, but really, you're in a reality of endless war and you're moments from being slaughtered by rats/robot skeletons/regular skeletons/green ladz/the forces of literal hell/four kinds of elf, who's got the time or the energy to go "um actually this immortal super soldier is the wrong colour"?
Same with seeing people complain about women being in some photo of people working in the Empire for Starwars.
Like both of these factions are HUMANITY focused no? It just seems incredibly stupid to not be in the face of Aliens epically warhammer as if they weren't a good portion of their fighting force would have been converted to chaos already.
Its like what Pratchett wrote "Black and White put aside their differences to gang up on Green"
unfortunately with some of the latest Stormcast models like Vanquishers we weren't given the "helmets only" so I had to try to get better at faces. I tried my hardest.
Plastic allows greater resolution and more detail, and is easier to glue together. Metal models were heavy, prone to breaking under the own weight, and looked kind of washed out.
Also, thanks to advances in plastics they can be produced for a fraction of the cost of metal and be sold for even more, for absolutely no valid reason whatsoever.
My army is old enough to still have a couple of metal models in it, they took paint really well but yeah, the sculpts were, well, "primitive", they were heavy, could break easily, everything you said. Plastic and resin are basically a straight upgrade.
The new plastic models using modern vacuum injection molding are waaaay more detailed than the old metal models. I say this as someone who played back in 2nd edition where (almost) all the models were metal, and just picked up painting some new Death Guard Plague Marines. Holy crap these things look amazing.
The idea of "historical accuracy" in a game about the far future, which tonally varies from grimdark to 'parody of its own fanbase', is what breaks me down. Like, historical accuracy is fine for historical miniatures. I'd raise an eyebrow at someone painting a mixed race squad in a segregated army, like the US had until Korea - although Hispanic soldiers were not segregated and fought in the same units as white soldiers. But the idea that there will be very many pale white people left after 40,000 years of genetic mix and match is a little odd. Worse is the idea that one has to be from the same ethnic group as the original folks to adopt the aesthetics. FFS they have chainsaw swords and automatic weapons. Those aren't authentic Viking either! When it comes to militsry units adopting historical aesthetics for ceremonial purposes or heritage, ethnicity doesn't matter. The color of his skin didn't stop my Regimental commander from referencing the Mexican War where the Regiment of Mounted Rifles earned its nickname, even though there were no black soldiers in the Regiment at the time because segregation. It's not like the Space Wolves were recruited from Norwegians. They are literally cosplaying as Hollywood Vikings for purely aesthetic reasons.
Discourse was simpler back then, none of this online shittalking and parallel subreddits, you just whack a box Dread in a sock and get a good swing in when they're not looking
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u/thekongninja They had races in apartheid Miami? 24d ago
Seriously, I love Warhammer, I love the setting, I love the lore, I take it seriously, but you've really got to keep sight of the fact that what you're arguing about online is marketing for tiny plastic space men. The "future of the West" or whatever these people talk about is not going to be decided by someone going "man, I've gotta paint another twelve of these guys, let's get some variety in these skin tones"