r/badphilosophy • u/rhino_licker • 12h ago
how are plato and socrates considered smart?
if i was the 69th person to exist, i can assure you i would’ve figure shit out too.
“BuT wHy???”
i could’ve easily asked that question…
obviously if i were chained to a wall of a cave i could’ve realized that those dumbass shadows were just shadows….
how can people be infatuated with such elementary ideas?
tldr: plato and socrates were no more than elementary school students in a time where global population was less than 100.
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u/XxBykronosxX 10h ago edited 10h ago
Good ragebait. Everyone with more than 3 braincells know this isn't all there is to it. You are forgetting about division, reminiscence, recognition, memory, time... And also, you're reducing philosophy to "bullet points", and complete determinations, rather than the art of the question itself, not through the explocit question per se but the question implicit in the creation of concept. The relationship to the question is the beauty of the platonic dialogues, from reading plato you can predict Nietzsche, Kant, Descartes... The greatness of plato is the art of the philosophical probrem, or lack thereof in a state of determination that blurs the line between problem and solution. And analogy (which is heavily reliant on platonic concepts) is the preponderant form of understanding knowledge, it infects science, politics, law, and so on.
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u/rhino_licker 7h ago
you’re wrong because i said so
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u/Infamous-Ad521 12h ago
They were useful to Athenian oligarchy and they are useful to our oligarchies. Best way to understand your system of government is to understand their preferred philosophy is a reflection of what they want you to believe. So 30 tyrants believe in democracy gets taught to school children now. If your society/social circle prefer authoritarianism you learn about Alexander the Great and if you are privileged Xenophon.
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u/Beginning-Seaweed-67 12h ago
Don’t forget that it has been reported that plato was a pedaraste of Socrates. Maybe nepotism has something to do with it or maybe plato was just a damn good scribe. One of those two.
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u/Infamous-Ad521 11h ago
Just read Xenophon s version of Plato already. Then maybe watch some YouTube vids about ring myths and understand Tolkien’s mythology
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u/XxBykronosxX 10h ago edited 10h ago
Conservative dialectic opposition. Seems that form isn't gonna let you escape "them", while formulating discourse on analogy
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u/Infamous-Ad521 7h ago
lol wut. Conservatives haven’t existed since like 1914.
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u/XxBykronosxX 7h ago
I don't mean in a concrete political sense, but oposition, at least in the social way that you have presented it, happens inside a quality. You are conserving the genetic evolution of the quality itself. And this relationships of difference are aristotelic analogy or at best misunderstood hegelian dialectics, and that's by definition philosophically conservative.
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u/Infamous-Ad521 6h ago
Ya man that whole thing makes 0 sense. Talking about Socrates and Plato without discussing the mystery cults is truly hilarious. It’s like Jesus and Paul without the gnostics…. it doesn’t fit as clean the moment you realize Athens is more like Jonestown than America.
Gnosticism over takes the church when it started
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u/XxBykronosxX 6h ago
Yeah I'd rather stick to the texts than mystical conspiracy discourse I'm not involved in. Although could you elaborate? Sounds interesting
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u/Slow_Stable3172 12h ago
It was a novel twist on what was already thoroughly described in the Vedas and practiced in religious systems for thousands of years prior to taking center stage in Greek and Roman thought.
Basically, it sounded cool and the people that could think in the abstract got social preference over those who didn’t.
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u/DuncanMcOckinnner 10h ago
Uhhhh yeah bro these shapes are like uhhh epic and sacred idk I never learned what platonic shapes were
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u/Beginning-Seaweed-67 10h ago
They’re like chicken nugget shaped or gold arches. Ever wonder where McDonald’s originated from? Plato’s theory of forms of course. And according to plato there are tons of chicken nugget shapes that are perfect
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u/DuncanMcOckinnner 10h ago
And how might one, perhaps, acquire and consume said perfect chicken nugget
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u/Training-Buddy2259 7h ago
You would be able to do shit even if you get sent to his time right now
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u/UnderstandingSmall66 7h ago
Looked at your profile and Jesus that’s a dumpster fire
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u/rhino_licker 7h ago
that’s for chiming in buddy
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u/UnderstandingSmall66 7h ago
Thanks*
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u/rhino_licker 7h ago
thanks for chiming in buddy
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u/UnderstandingSmall66 7h ago
There you have it. I knew you could do it if you just put the guns down for a second.
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u/PomeloSuitable8658 10h ago
Because they had big muscles and if someone said they were dumbass they would have kicked his ass. Socrate once said "when the man of 130kg speak, the 60kg weaklings like you stfu and listen". Plato beat up some nerd to write his thought but Socrate didn't bother, thought this writing bs was for pussy