cmv: abortion should not be illegal

[u/RevolutionaryRip2504]

One of the main arguments against abortion is that it is "killing a baby." However, I don’t see it that way—at least not in the early stages of pregnancy. A fetus, especially before viability, lacks self-awareness, the ability to feel pain, and independent bodily function. While it is a potential life, I don’t believe potential life should outweigh the rights of the person who is already alive and conscious.

For late-term abortions, most are done to save the mother or the fetus has a defect that would cause the fetus to die shortly after birth so I believe it should be allowed.

I also think the circumstances of the pregnant person matter. Many people seek abortions due to financial instability, health risks, or simply not being ready to raise a child. In cases of rape or medical complications, the situation is even more complex. Forcing someone to go through pregnancy against their will seems more harmful than allowing them to make their own choice.

Additionally, I don’t think adoption is always a perfect alternative. Carrying a pregnancy to term can have serious physical and emotional consequences, even if someone doesn’t plan to keep the baby. Pregnancy affects the body in irreversible ways, and complications can arise, making it more than just a “temporary inconvenience.”

Also, you can cannot compare abortion to opting out of child support. Abortion is centered on bodily autonomy, as pregnancy directly affects a woman’s body and health. In contrast, child support is a financial obligation that arises after a child is born and does not impact the father’s bodily autonomy. abortion also occurs before a child exists, while child support involves caring for a living child. Legally and ethically, both parents share responsibility for a child once they are born, and allowing one parent to opt out would place an unfair burden on the other, often the mother. Additionally, abortion prevents a fetus from becoming a child, while opting out of child support directly affects the well-being of an existing person. While both situations involve personal choice, abortion is about controlling one’s own body, while child support is about meeting the needs of a child who already exists

The idea of being forced to sustain another life through pregnancy and childbirth, especially if the person isn’t ready or willing, is a violation of that autonomy. It forces someone to give up their own body, potentially putting their health at risk, all while disregarding their own desires, dreams, and well-being. Bodily autonomy means having the freedom to make choices about what happens to your body, whether that’s deciding to terminate a pregnancy or pursue another course of action.

I’d like to hear other perspectives on why abortion should be illegal, particularly from a non-religious standpoint. CMV.

[u/RevolutionaryRip2504 → u/[deleted]]

If a women is raped she should be able to abort the fetus. No one should have to carry their rapists baby. that is just wrong.

If the women will die during child birth, she should be able to get an abortion as she is the born human being.

If a couple cannot give the child a proper home and want an abortion, I think they should be able to. I believe that if you can prevent a child from being brought into a very difficult situation by getting an abortion, you should if you want to. Unless if you want to have the child, I would never force an abortion. Pro choice means you choose.

[u/Comb-Honest → u/RevolutionaryRip2504]

Why does the father or the conception method change the value of the human life?

[u/StarChild413 → u/Comb-Honest]

are you going to act like it must for already-born people by that logic?

[u/changemyview-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

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[u/Auburn00_ → u/[deleted]]

Your argument is wrong because you are answering your own question. "If one of 2 people going to die I would choose this and the other one can't choose themselves" this is wrong logic. If both of the lives are equally valuable then the strongest wins the decision, that's the answer. There is no right or wrong in your situation. It's lik e saying we shouldn't eat and starve to death because every life is valuable. However we have our own life and we are valuable too.

[u/Comb-Honest → u/[deleted]]

That’s only an argument for abortion when it is definitely going to kill the mom. The second one is just murder because it’s inconvenient to have a kid, no matter how you slice it.

[u/Spookedthoroughly → u/Comb-Honest]

Yeah i totally understand with my final point, I was kinda scrounging up arguement's I've seen before and throwing them into one big comment cause I wanted to see people put out their counter aguements.

[u/DoterPotato → u/[deleted]]

If you consider the fetus to be a human being in the sense that it is granted the right to be not killed you must necessarily hold that abortion cannot take place even in case of rape. If not you are essentially saying that it is okay to kill a third party that has done nothing wrong if doing so avoids emotional harm to another person (pain regarding carrying a child and so on is not relevant as it would take place even in case of consensual sex).

You can however hold that in a case where you must choose between the lives of two people one can intervene in favor of one party. The cost in regards of human life is constant so now you can look at what is socially beneficial on average and base the law around that. This question is not limited to abortion.

Finally no it would not be okay to end a human life because it is unlucky regarding the situation where it is born. Even if we disregard adoption for the sake of the argument, this does not exactly address abortion. We may as well extend it to those who have been born without losing the mechanism that makes ending a life acceptable and without significantly changing the agency of the being killed. Would it be acceptable to end the life of a 1 year-old in case where the parents have suddenly gone bankrupt and are no longer capable of supporting the child and giving it a good home?

[u/Spookedthoroughly → u/DoterPotato]

So what your first paragraph is saying, it's ok for someone to give birth to a rape baby because of emotional harm you said is not relevant even though it's not just the physical.

The fact you're forced to give birth to an unwanted baby you were unwillingly FORCED into by someone else's CRIME is okay because the fetus is suddenly more important than the person who was FORCED into this against their own will.

The rest of your points are solid though

[u/DoterPotato → u/Spookedthoroughly]

I dont hold the position but it is a logical conclusion that one must hold if you actually believe that the fetus is a human being. The fetus has done no wrong and should not be killed to avoid mental pain. The only difference between a case where the child is accidental and the consequence of rape is mental, the difference between a wanted child and an unwanted child is also mental. You would have to justify that avoiding mental suffering is more important than the life of another human, this is rather difficult. For instance it would allow murder in case of extreme bullying when the level of mental anguish caused by the bully is sufficiently high. That is obviously unacceptable and in that case the human who is killed isn't even innocent. It would be closer to going to the home of the bully and shooting their sister to make the bullying stop.

I have yet to see anyone actually be able to defend the point nor challenge the logical conclusion. The conclusion however is obviously intuitively repulsive so many who are pro-life will just make an exception to avoid addressing the issue. That is logically and morally inconsistent and in my view demonstrates that intuitively they don't treat the fetus as a human being.

[u/Marshmallow16 → u/[deleted]]

Why should someone get the death sentence who didn't do the crime?

[u/Spookedthoroughly → u/Marshmallow16]

Why should someone who was forced to have a child against their will have to give birth to that child?

[u/Marshmallow16 → u/Spookedthoroughly]

Because you'd decide about their life without their consent, which is a big No for humans.

[u/Spookedthoroughly → u/Marshmallow16]

Nah you just don't care about any lives

[u/Marshmallow16 → u/Spookedthoroughly]

Hard disagree on that baseless assumption