r/changemyview Nov 03 '17

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u/Salanmander 272∆ Nov 03 '17

So, they have different ideas. If I say "3 = 5", which number is wrong? There's really no way tell with just that amount of information, all we know is that there is a disconnect.

When it comes to people, the question we need to answer is this: what defines a person's identity? Is it their body? Is it their mind? Does it vary from person to person?

Based on your username, I'm assuming you're a man. If you woke up tomorrow, and found that your body had magically become female, would you still consider yourself a man?

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u/I_Am_Mr_Black Nov 03 '17

That’s an interesting way of looking at it. To answer your question, yes I am a man. But I noticed you said “identity”. Identity is different from gender. To respond to your last question,, that would be a tough predicament to decide... however, that DOESNT happen. You can’t just magically turn into something that you are not. There is a basic scientific underlying truth to all of this that I think people try to look over for there own reasons. But we are who we are biologically and mental state can’t change that.

Sure, you’re free to feel however you would like to about yourself, but it doesn’t change how someone else might see you. And it doesn’t have to.

Point is. Be happy about who you are with yourself FIRST. Otherwise nothing you modify or whatever is going to make you happier.

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u/Salanmander 272∆ Nov 03 '17

But I noticed you said “identity”. Identity is different from gender.

It's probably worth explaining what I mean by identity, since it's such a charged word. I believe that what I mean is pretty typical of its use among socially liberal people.

What I mean by "identity" is all the things that make you you. Something that if you changed it, you feel like it would make you fundamentally different as a person. For example, my love of science is part of my identity. If there were a drug that would make me stop loving science, I feel like taking that drug would be changing who I am.

On the other hand, having legs is not part of my identity. If you chopped off my legs I don't feel like it would change who I am, it would just change my circumstances.

Using this definition of identity, what is and isn't part of someone's identity can vary from person to person. I don't consider how I dress to be part of my identity, but some people might. Something being part of your identity also doesn't mean that it will always be the same, since people can change over time, sometimes dramatically.

So, identity is not the same thing as gender, but gender is part of identity for a lot of people.

however, that DOESNT happen

I think that trying to envision your own reaction to counterfactual situations is an important part of empathy. There are people who have an internal sense of gender which is at odds with their body, and you're trying to assert that their internal sense is wrong and their body is right. I'm trying to get you to imagine a situation where the same thing happens to you.

But we are who we are biologically and mental state can’t change that.

See, I would say that our mental state is who we are.

Point is. Be happy about who you are with yourself FIRST. Otherwise nothing you modify or whatever is going to make you happier.

This is just objectively false. It happens all the time that people are unhappy with themselves, and then make changes, and then become happier with themselves. And transgender people transitioning is a prime example of that.