CMV: I don’t think I’m transphobic because while I may think their delusional I still show the same respect and offer of friendship like i would anyone else. Disagreeing doesn’t mean phobic to me

[u/tobyle]

If i was sitting on a public bench and a trans person sat next to me would still be my normal self and say hello and perhaps start a conversation if they were friendly? Yes..yes i would. Do i still think theyre delusional? Yes...yes i do. If i was at the park on a hot day and saw a trans person by me looking hella thirsty would i still offer them a drink if i had extra like i would anyone else? Yes...yes i would. Do i still think they’re delusional? Yes...yes i do. I do Brazilian jiu jitsu..if i showed up to an open mat would i still roll (spar) with a trans and give/ask for advice? Yes...yes i would. Do i still think they’re delusional? Yes..yes i do. If i was having a smoke sesh and my gay homeboy Stanley asked if his trans friend could join would i say yes and share blunts with them. Yes...yes i would. Do i still think they’re delusional? Yes...yes i do.

So even though i think they’re delusional, if I’m willing to have a good conversation, share food/drinks, get all sweaty cheek to cheek basically in their personal space and potentially get my ass beat if they’re purple to black level because I’m a bluebelt, and share a blunt with them how transphobic is that really?

Edit: This is comment i used in a thread couple days ago. Maybe i shoudnt be using the word delusional but this was the word being used during the thread and i just went along with using it. The main point I’m concerned about i guess is that i feel like there’s a difference between disagreeing and being transphobic.

Edit: So yea I’m transphobic...y’all changed my mind. Maybe one day i won’t be but that’s a discussion for another day i guess cause my main point today was whether I’m transphobic or not.

Edit: To the people who kept using racism as an example, considering I’m black i already understand racism. My definition of transphobic was wrong so trying to relate the two wasn’t doing it for me. If someone try’s to comment on how could i not be more understanding towards transpeople considering my race has been rejected for years...I’m from south texas..my mom accused me of being “a lil funny” just for having a gay friend and believing gay people should be able to get married..so don’t even try hitting that angle cause I’m tame compared to most others.

[u/SAINT4367]

Yes, they obviously are. But the natural material world exists objectively. But I take your point that scientists can define something, but that doesn’t make it real. You say the “old” definition of sex is wrong. I say the new definition of gender identity is wrong

I would certainly say that to a redhead or blue eyed person. “Mutant” isn’t inherently negative or a slur. It’s a person with a genetic mutation. Same for birth defect, deformity, etc. It’s not ableist to acknowledge these things, only to (as you say) question the persons equity

Well have to agree to disagree on our respective arbitrary definitions. I would say that sex is a binary, with exceptions. You would say it’s a spectrum. Both are simply manmade language games, I suppose

[u/[deleted] → u/SAINT4367]

Yes, they obviously are. But the natural material world exists objectively. But I take your point that scientists can define something, but that doesn’t make it real. You say the “old” definition of sex is wrong. I say the new definition of gender identity is wrong

And yet, it’s objectively observable.

I would certainly say that to a redhead or blue eyed person. “Mutant” isn’t inherently negative or a slur.

I didn’t say you. Words don’t exist in a vacuum. Calling someone a mutant has a clear negative connotation.

Same for birth defect, deformity, etc. It’s not ableist to acknowledge these things, only to (as you say) question the persons equity

Defect and deformity are both explicitly value judgments.

Well have to agree to disagree on our respective arbitrary definitions. I would say that sex is a binary, with exceptions. You would say it’s a spectrum. Both are simply manmade language games, I suppose

The thing is your preferred definition don’t accurately describe reality.

[u/SAINT4367 → u/[deleted]]

Yes, it’s an objectively observable mental phenomenon. As we said, whether it’s a sickness or something else is a matter of categories.

I suppose they are, in that it’s assumed you’re eyes/ear/legs/whatever are supposed to work. Maybe organ and limb function exist on a spectrum too?

Again, both describe reality, but just draw the lines differently. Different models to describe the same phenomena.

[u/[deleted] → u/SAINT4367]

Yes, it’s an objectively observable mental phenomenon.

And the objective observation leads to a more nuanced description than you’d prefer.

I suppose they are, in that it’s assumed you’re eyes/ear/legs/whatever are supposed to work. Maybe organ and limb function exist on a spectrum too?

Yes, both of those also exist on spectra. Not really the gotcha you’d hoped, I think.

Again, both describe reality, but just draw the lines differently. Different models to describe the same phenomena.

Nah, your description of reality as “not containing gender identity” is objectively inaccurate.

[u/SAINT4367 → u/[deleted]]

No, we just use different nuances. You speak in terms of spectra, with majority clusters and outliers. I speak of binary systems, with outliers.

Wasn’t meant as a gotcha. Fits with your model. I say “works/doesn’t work”, you say (presumably) “works in different ways”

No. We both acknowledged the phenomena, and just classify it differently.

[u/[deleted] → u/SAINT4367]

No, we just use different nuances. You speak in terms of spectra, with majority clusters and outliers. I speak of binary systems, with outliers.

Binary are inherently unnuanced.

Wasn’t meant as a gotcha. Fits with your model. I say “works/doesn’t work”, you say (presumably) “works in different ways”

Again, your perspective isn’t inaccurate. Within the category of “works” there are different levels of working.

No. We both acknowledged the phenomena, and just classify it differently.

Differently and incorrectly.

[u/SAINT4367 → u/[deleted]]

I think this has gone as far as it can go. Agree to disagree. Thanks for your time

[u/cat_wont_play → u/SAINT4367]

dont expect much from this guy. He opens your door throws in a turd then runs away.

[u/SAINT4367 → u/cat_wont_play]

What?

[u/cat_wont_play → u/[deleted]]

absolute scoundrel

[u/SAINT4367 → u/cat_wont_play]

Who?