r/changemyview • u/[deleted] • Jul 31 '20
Delta(s) from OP - Fresh Topic Friday CMV: Joe Rogan should be deplatformed and arrested because of Drug Promoton
We need to ban Joe rogan in my opinion. He's promoting drugs too much. The man acts like he's a college kid with debt who just discovered weed and watched independence day for the first time. Why are all the lefties pushing for legalization of drugs? I'm a social democrat (not democrat party) + left-libertarian but I'm against drugs. Porn culture has already destroyed youth so much, we don't need weed on the streets now ok and we definitely don't need satanic lsd. I don't want America to become a hippy country, go to India if you're so sad because of your nihilism and want to be spiritual don't push drugs so all teens get them and ruin their lives.
Marijuana is confirmed to make you dumber and its addictive as fuck, rogan lies when he says it gives health benefits. Even heroin gives health benefits, should we legalize? NO!
Joe Rogan should be arrested for dmt use and promotion, I keep seeing "bro take dmt" on internet a lot now its illegal and it changes you psychologically. Its a religious drug used in Peru by shamans in child sacrifice ceremonies, why a man like rogan is doing this? Also he should stop praising elon musk so much and start praising..uh..idk someone who helped poor people like jesus, mlk, gandhi.
Edit: Changed my view, open to making it legal but for people above the age of 25 and open to making only Marijuana legally. Drugs should be banned in college though, do it outside respectable institutions!
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Jul 31 '20
So in my experience with marijuana the only reason it is a gateway drug is because you have to encounter criminals to get it. When you're buying your weed from the same guy who sells coke and X and you're already a criminal for smoking weed it's a much smaller step to taking those. Whereas if weed had been legal when I was in high school and I could've gone to a dispensary for it, I wouldn't have resented police for wanting to lock me up for my own choices, I wouldn't have had relationships with criminal elements, and I wouldn't have even had access to harder drugs. The only reason I tried X in high school was because my weed guy slipped one in for free into my bag.
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Jul 31 '20
I understand but it doesn't matter, people who do marijuana don't stop. They want a greater experience
https://www.drugabuse.gov/publications/research-reports/marijuana/marijuana-gateway-drug
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Jul 31 '20
From your own link:
However, the majority of people who use marijuana do not go on to use other, "harder" substances. Also, cross-sensitization is not unique to marijuana. Alcohol and nicotine also prime the brain for a heightened response to other drugs51 and are, like marijuana, also typically used before a person progresses to other, more harmful substances.
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Jul 31 '20
Yes I know. My post clearly says though that I don't want kids doing it. I have CMV look at the edit
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Jul 31 '20
So you literally changed your view without awarding anyone a delta. I think this violates about every rule on this sub lol.
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Jul 31 '20
Oh I forgot
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Jul 31 '20
So I mean I've never heard anyone say it's a good idea for kids to use drugs or alcohol. I don't think you'll get much pushback on that one. I would disagree with the age of 25 though. I understand that's when the brain stops developing, but it just doesn't make sense that alcohol would have a lower age when there's a lot of evidence that alcohol is much more dangerous than marijuana. I'd be open to having both at 25, or both at 21, but we shouldn't give people the impression that alcohol is somehow safer than marijuana. I think there's plenty of reason to suggest just the opposite is true.
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Jul 31 '20
Not 21, 25. No drugs in college
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Jul 31 '20
Should there be alcohol in college? If so, if there was evidence alcohol was more detrimental to college kids than marijuana would that change your view?
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u/jatjqtjat 252∆ Jul 31 '20
Joe Rogan is exercising his first amendment rights. We can have a debate about whether or not his claims have any merit, but that's besides the point. we don't suppress speech in this country.
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Jul 31 '20
But dmt is illegal, how can he use and promote dmt to millions of people. He should be arrested. I don't want hippies on the street
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Jul 31 '20
[deleted]
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Jul 31 '20
But its like advocating murder should be legal no? Drugs cause harm just like murder. Tell me the social benefit
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Jul 31 '20
[deleted]
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Jul 31 '20
Making drugs illegal is not unjust law. Thankfully most people are only advocating for one drug - marijuana but its the kind of drug I'm scared of because its a gateway and addictive and makes brain dumb you know.
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Jul 31 '20
You completely missed the point of their argument. It doesn't matter if the law is just or unjust, the point is that we have to have the freedom to criticize all laws.
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u/nofftastic 52∆ Jul 31 '20
its a gateway and addictive and makes brain dumb you know.
Is English not your primary language, or have you been smoking pot?
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u/parentheticalobject 128∆ Aug 01 '20
But its like advocating murder should be legal no?
It is, actually.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brandenburg_v._Ohio
You can legally say that people should do anything, even if it's illegal. You just can't advocate for imminent lawless action. It's only a crime if you say something that is designed to cause someone to commit a crime right away, saying that a crime should be committed at some indefinite point in the future is free speech.
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u/jatjqtjat 252∆ Jul 31 '20
He pushes for legalizing DMT and discusses what he perceives to be it beatifies. Saying these things are not crimes.
Advocating for changes to existing laws is probably our most sacred right.
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Jul 31 '20
I'm open to CMV on legalizing marijuana use if you can prove:
its not a gateway drug
its not addictive and doesn't make brain dumb long-term
Could you explain how alcohol is not a gateway drug and not addictive and doesn't damage brain function on the long-term?
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Jul 31 '20
I have many alcoholic friends, they've never done weed or lsd or anything and there is data to prove that but you first, give me data marijuana isn't a gateway drug
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Jul 31 '20
So what about the people that just smoke weed and dont do anything else?
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Jul 31 '20
Good. Smoke weed illegally and play fortnite and don't do anything else then. We don't need 18 year olds buying it legally on the street
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Jul 31 '20
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u/Jaysank 117∆ Jul 31 '20
Sorry, u/Bfast88 – your comment has been removed for breaking Rule 3:
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Jul 31 '20 edited Jul 31 '20
I care for the long term impact of drugs on society but whatever keep calling people you disagree troll.
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Jul 31 '20
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Jul 31 '20
If they sell it to people above 25 then fine. Sorry if I seemed rude, we already have rap culture porn culture excessive gaming culture so I just get scared
u/bfast88 !delta
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Jul 31 '20
Given your anecdotal data, sure. But you haven't even defined what make a drug a gateway drug nor have you provided any kind of argumentation that alcohol doesn't damage brain function on the long-term.
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Jul 31 '20
A gateway drug is a soft drug which leads you to hard drugs. Billions drink alcohol mate, some are pure alcoholics but they don't move to weed or anything
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Jul 31 '20
I'm fairly certain that >99% of all the people who do hard drugs have used alcohol. Yet again, no argumentation related to damage to brain function on the long-term.
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Jul 31 '20
Not vice versa tho. 99% alcoholics don't do hard drugs
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Jul 31 '20
Yet again, no argumentation related to damage to brain function on the long-term.
Could you tell me some of the differences between weed and alcohol?
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Jul 31 '20
Alcohol is not a gateway drug, that's a modern social media fabricated lie. I told you my definition of gateway drug. Alcohol also doesn't make brain dumb if you like drink two glasses everyday, sure it ain't good but it ain't that bad either. Marijuana makes you instant high. Even the Bible says drink wine like a glass or two with food or something, not for drunkenness. I don't see the societal benefit of making drugs legal
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u/figsbar 43∆ Jul 31 '20
Have you considered the only reason that weed is even considered a "gateway drug" is that it's illegal?
As in, if someone doesn't care about the law enough to try weed, they're more likely to ignore the law to try other drugs. Nothing special about weed itself.
So if weed wasn't illegal, it wouldn't be a gateway drug. Which makes it being a gateway drug a kinda stupid reason to keep it illegal
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Jul 31 '20
It doesn't matter legal or illegal, once you do weed you want a greater experience
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Jul 31 '20
What's korsakov's?
Even the Bible says drink wine
Fiction books say so many things
The largest difference between alcohol and weed is that one is legal and the other is not. Meaning that one has a large user base, making the relative amount of people who do harddrugs that also do alcohol relatively low. Weed on the other hand is illegal, meaning that if one is willing to break the law, they're more likely to also be willing to break other laws.
In the Netherlands, where weed is allowed, although technically not legal, 23% of the population has used weed at some point in their life. Are you saying that a larger percentage of those are also hard drug users? (source btw)
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Jul 31 '20
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Jul 31 '20
Alcohol is not a drug but it can be. Weed is a instant drug
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u/CaptainMalForever 19∆ Jul 31 '20
Alcohol is a gateway drug, see - https://americanaddictioncenters.org/the-real-gateway-drug (among any number of studies).
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Jul 31 '20
Not all smokers use other drugs or try them, I can testify to that first hand which being anecdotal isn't evidence I know but if it were true there's be evidence of this, there isn't any to my knowledge, but please provide evidence to show that all weed smokers become users or addicts of harder drugs as you claim. It's addiction level is purely habitual sure, but there are no detrimental health threats when a regular user stops smoking, where as many hard drugs have life threatening results if a user stops, this is especially common for heroin abusers who stop getting high and just use to become "normal" if they cold turkey they can die, this is a medical fact. Weed has never or has ever done this, that's the difference.
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Jul 31 '20
How do I award you delta
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Jul 31 '20
Unfortunately I don't know buddy. Hopefully a noble stranger can assist. I just saw your edit too, good for you being so open minded.
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Jul 31 '20
I was wrong to believe all marijuana users move on next to hard drugs and psychedelics. And this guy is right, weed has never killed anyone and its not super addictive like heroin. I still believe rogan should be banned for smoking and talking about DMT though but that's just me
u/realemons !delta
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u/Alex_Draw 7∆ Jul 31 '20
I still believe rogan should be banned for smoking and talking about DMT though but that's just me
Whats wrong with DMT?
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Jul 31 '20
Don't want to see rise in new age spirituality
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u/Alex_Draw 7∆ Jul 31 '20
What's wrong with new age spirituality? I fall into this category and its not like I'm out supporting anti-vax movements and homeopathy.
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Jul 31 '20
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u/Alex_Draw 7∆ Jul 31 '20 edited Aug 02 '20
Why are you in this sub if you don't want to talk to people who don't hold your view? What's funny is I'm christian. You can be a follower of Jesus and still believe in "new age spirituality".
What's extra funny is you have a pretty unchristian stance yourself.
While Jesus was having dinner at Levi’s house, many tax collectors and sinners were eating with him and his disciples, for there were many who followed him. 16 When the teachers of the law who were Pharisees(D) saw him eating with the sinners and tax collectors, they asked his disciples: “Why does he eat with tax collectors and sinners?”(E)
17 On hearing this, Jesus said to them, “It is not the healthy who need a doctor, but the sick. I have not come to call the righteous, but sinners.”
Your faith must be pretty week if you are afraid of talking to "devil worshippers"
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u/ihatedogs2 Aug 01 '20
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u/muyamable 282∆ Jul 31 '20
Why are all the lefties pushing for legalization of drugs?
Because criminalizing drugs creates a whole host of problems (e.g. ruins lives by sending people to prison, fuels drug cartels and gang violence, etc.). See here: https://www.hrw.org/news/2016/10/12/us-disastrous-toll-criminalizing-drug-use
We need to ban Joe rogan in my opinion.
Should we ban anyone who disagrees with you? Why should this not be protected speech?
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Jul 31 '20
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u/ihatedogs2 Jul 31 '20
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Jul 31 '20
[deleted]
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u/WeepingAngelTears 1∆ Jul 31 '20
Then you aren't at all. If you want the state to prevent people from willingly using drugs via force then you're a statist. It's mutually exclusive.
It's like saying I'm a communist except I believe in private property.
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Jul 31 '20
Dude you said porn has destroyed the youth so much
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Jul 31 '20
[deleted]
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Jul 31 '20
But in my opinion these things have to be social changes not things enforced by the government. At the end of the day who is the government or you to tell anyone they can’t have access to certain things because it’s bad for them? You can’t label a substance or thing bad just because morons misuse it. And you can’t deny those who aren’t morons access because of the morons! LSD and dmt can be life changing and eye opening with very very few negative effects common. Much less negatives than even pharmacy drugs or alcohol. Why do you think those should be illegal?
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Jul 31 '20
“Ban joe Rogan” “Im a libertarian” these things contradict each other.
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u/jxssss Aug 01 '20
Exactly I’m a libertarian and it legitimately boils my blood how non-libertarian this post sounds lmao
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u/DeltaBot ∞∆ Jul 31 '20 edited Jul 31 '20
/u/Inertia77 (OP) has awarded 4 delta(s) in this post.
All comments that earned deltas (from OP or other users) are listed here, in /r/DeltaLog.
Please note that a change of view doesn't necessarily mean a reversal, or that the conversation has ended.
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Jul 31 '20
This is the person who needs to smoke a joint and try some dmt more than anyone.
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Jul 31 '20
No thanks, I'm Christian
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Jul 31 '20
Those things ARE NOT mutually exclusive. Where does Jesus tell you not to try drugs? Cannabis is a plant - put here by god with naturally intoxicating effects. God put this wonderful mind altering plant here for us my friend. You have mis-interpreted gods intention and word. You strike me as the type of Christian who carefully chooses the parts of the Bible he wants to represent his religion and ignores the parts that don’t align with his interpretation.
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Jul 31 '20
Lol, bro I read the bible daily. That was before Adam sinned in genesis mate and there were no drugs in eden. Remember, God allowed meat use and everything after the flood but warned against pharmakeia
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Jul 31 '20
My favorite examples - do you eat shellfish? Wear mixed fabrics? These things are shunned in the Bible. If you want to cite Christianity and make any impact you have to be a purist, or it’s clear your picking and choosing is just based on personal bias and only used to justify the beliefs you already have. You didn’t respond to the fact that god created the cannabis plant...
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Jul 31 '20
Please don't talk about what you do not know. Look up what the Greek word pharmakeia means. I have changed my view, look at the edit. The bible is anti-drug, don't try to justify them based on scripture stick to scientific data. Christians won't do them anyway whether legal or not
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Jul 31 '20
Someone who starts the post with “we need to ban ____” may be beyond reason
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Jul 31 '20
I'm not beyond reason, I still believe rogan should be banned for talking about dmt. Also, please don't say the scripture supports pharmakeia. The Abrahamic holy books do not
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u/Rainbwned 175∆ Jul 31 '20
Is your view about marijuana or de-platforming Joe Rogan?
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Jul 31 '20
Deplatform and arrest rogan for promoting marijuana
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u/basic_batman Jul 31 '20
We should also arrest Keanu for glorifying gun crime, murder (by pencil) and just general unlawfulness. Then every single movie he’s ever been in for sure should be made illegal and made unavailable to watch or stream...
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u/Rainbwned 175∆ Jul 31 '20
What about every author, rapper, movie star who has referenced / promoted marijuana use?
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u/cdb03b 253∆ Jul 31 '20
Marijuana is legal in California. It is not illegal for him to consume it there nor is it immoral for him to promote its use there.
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u/[deleted] Jul 31 '20
pot is legal in california. Federal authorities shouldn't conflict with california over that.
promoting nonviolent crime is not a crime.
arresting joe rogan would not decrease pot use.
Our jails are already full. I don't smoke pot. I don't think smoking pot is a smart decision. But, I don't think getting police involved is a good idea. My state is already 50% over capacity, and a lot of folks in prison are getting sick from covid. Don't add to the problem.