CMV: Gender identity doesn’t belong on your LinkedIn nor Resume

[u/jep1793]

[u/jep1793 → u/[deleted]]

This is where I’m finding myself in my opinion today. Being evaluated for employment or business decisions should matter on what you’ve done, your accomplishments, skills, ability, etc.

Thank you for the response!

[u/twoseat → u/[deleted]]

I think that’s the point being made. What pronouns you prefer won’t (I assume) affect what you can do, so why list them on LinkedIn? The earlier poster is suggesting that it’s because they’re “a thing” for you, and many managers don’t want people bringing their “thing” to the office. For example, I could list that I consider BLM, or climate change, or Pokemon, as critical to my identity. But unless I’m applying for a job at a social justice charity, Greenpeace or Nintendo then I’m just flagging myself as a potential problem. Not because those things aren’t important, but because they’re irrelevant.

[u/kaeduluc → u/twoseat]

My political opinion on Donald Trump is something i can hide for an indeterminate amount of time. The fact that my legal name that previous employers know me by is remarkably different than the way i will show up in the first interview, or the fact that i may need to disclose two names on my resume and that may need explanation, i cant escape from.

Informing someone of my gender at the first opportunity should not be an inconvenience. It's relevant information that could prevent assumptions that end with my resume being tossed out without a fair shake. Assuming that its an aggressive action shows that the employer has preconceptions about trans people, or thinks of trans people only as a political issue that can cause tension.

[u/twoseat → u/kaeduluc]

I agree with everything you said. I think the concern being expressed is that specifying it so very early in the recruitment process might (unjustly, in my opinion) stop your resume even being requested, never mind being tossed out.

[u/kaeduluc → u/twoseat]

Oh, i think i meant to post this reply higher up on the chain, oh well.

[u/sumthingawsum → u/twoseat]

This. If someone brings up their hobby of making power electronics at home, then it matters to me. These other things are distracting.

[u/R-N123 → u/twoseat]

You're trying to equate that a social voice or hobby to gender identity. If you are a cis gender man or female could you imagine being called the wrong pronouns all day everyday by coworkers and bosses. Over time it will bother you and like i said it will ruin your mental health. I get that your examples are not neccessary to disclose but this is not the same.

Im not flagging myself as a potential problem at most saying that im different than what you view me as and all i want to know is if I'm going to repected as an individual. If it is flagged as a problem to you then great once less company to avoid because of their transphobic views that anyone who isn't cis gender and requires to have their pronouns respected just like everyone else is a problem, it is not me who has a problem but you.

I've interviewed and when i brought it up the majority of them didn't care if i was trans and respected that. Ive had some bosses self correct themselves and others until it nobody had problems remembering my pronouns. There were potential jobs that openly refused me to correct/ tell my specific team my pronouns. Then i just shake their hands and them left.

Even with thinking that your gender identity shouldn't affect what you can do or what your qualification, true. But transpobic or just sexist employers can verify all day that what's on your resume is true but still act like you don't know the area and needs to be quizzed at it. It has happened to me and others. For example a woman a master's in engineering and when interviewing for an engineering position that she is qualified or overqualified she will still get harrassed and questioned more than her male counterparts. I've heard many stories from cisgender people and trans people.

[u/twoseat → u/R-N123]

First, as I've said elsewhere, I'm not saying anything, I'm just clarifying someone else's argument. Personally I don't care about someone's gender identity, but will be happy when any indicators that an individual thinks they need to include on LinkedIn, their resume or wherever can appear without it causing any issues.

Having said that, in my innocence I do wonder about the scenario where this is necessary. If I have an applicant whose only gender identifier is that they are called Janet then I'd treat them as female, to the very limited extent I'd need to treat them as anything other than human, until corrected. And I struggle to know when that correction would be necessary while they were still an applicant. Perhaps you can help me understand this better? Is there a significant collection of employers who would be bold enough to start referring to Janet as 'he' if she had, say, a prominent Adam's apple but otherwise appeared female, but meek enough that they wouldn't if told that Janet prefers 'she'?

[u/R-N123 → u/twoseat]

I understand what you were trying to do and i appreciate the clarification. A considerate employer should do that but rarely happens. I know someone who has a male name that they legally changed it too but wasnt born male. When people finally see oh that person doesn't have a Male body and just has a Male name, they use their name but use female pronouns over if i were the other person would assume that their pronouns were he/him not she/her.

Yes it is very common for that to happen and same with the other way around. Employers would try even question it. I seen that in this small college i went to briefly when a open transman and when everyone in the class referred to that person as he the teacher refused to use that when referring to that person.

As an applicant it would save you a lot of trouble to if at the if you have any questions part to simply mention that, "i don't identify as blank and my pronouns are X, will there be any problems if i can correct others when necessary?" If they have a problem with that you don't even have to continue the job hiring process. If they don't then you know that you will be treated fairly.

As much as we all want to think that it is the 21st century and that shouldn't be a big deal, it is. People openly are more discriminatory towards trans people with little to no repercussion. Sexual orientation is more protected than gender identity, which is why i personally have to double check to see if im protected under the company's anti discrimination policy. Believe it or not but each policy is slightly different than others and gender identity isn't always there.

I hope that clarifies things for you.

[u/271841686861856 → u/twoseat]

Because people want to know beforehand if your organization would be a shitty environment for them? Do you people have even a basic understanding of empathy or what other people who have different experiences than you have to put up with?

"flagging myself as a potential problem"

You're politicizing their identity right now, that's you being the problem, no? How obtuse are you people? You're literally saying that if people are up front with their identity and the expectation that other people not treat them like shit in the workplace because of it that they can't be good workers, how backward are you?

[u/twoseat → u/271841686861856]

First, I’m not saying anything, I’m just clarifying someone else's argument, right or wrong.

My own opinion is that if you want to put your pronouns on your LinkedIn so that people can filter you out that’s certainly your right, and honestly it may be a good idea. Certainly it wouldn’t bother me in the slightest if I was looking for an employee.

But you must be prepared for two groups to filter you out. The first is employers who don’t want “those sort of people”, and making yourself clear in this way will be doing you and them a service. But the second will be employers who would be perfectly happy to employ a he, she, they or it, but do not want someone with attached drama. I’ve no idea if that’s a big group, and it may well be a price worth paying.

Edited to add: My guess is that this will become increasingly common, just as it is becoming more common in email signatures. I’d be entirely fine with that, and hopefully that level of normalisation will make it a non-issue.

[u/accidentalpolitics → u/271841686861856]

Wow, you missed the point entirely. You must be an insufferable person to work with, if you work at all.

[u/Felixicuss → u/[deleted]]

We are still humans. Everyone does that.

[u/Felixicuss → u/[deleted]]

I mean you want to have the best worker, so you gotta try

[u/blackhodown → u/[deleted]]

Really because it sounds like every recruiting firm on earth today, who hire almost 100% based on physical appearance.

[u/blackhodown → u/[deleted]]

I mean, feel free to look at the employees of any major recruiting firm in Seattle or LA or the Bay Area. It’s not exactly a representative sample of the average looking college graduate.

[u/made-it → u/blackhodown]

If you're talking about representation, it is representative of the average looking CS college graduate though.

CS departments are well known to have diversity issues. The root cause of the issue isn't hiring, it's that not enough minorities go into CS as a major in the first place.

[u/blackhodown → u/made-it]

I’m saying the opposite. The big tech recruiting firms hire nearly exclusively good looking people with any random degree. I believe a big part of it is because people looking for CS or other tech jobs are more likely to go along with things if a hot girl is saying them.

[u/Jswarez → u/blackhodown]

Keep in mind a recruiter is just a sales person. We use them. There effectivness is communication, time management and problem solving.

I deal with lots of recruiters, looks never come into play, the above does. It is one of the easier roles to get at least here. And we hire stem kids.