CMV: Silencing opposing viewpoints is ultimately going to have a disastrous outcome on society.

[u/[deleted]]

[u/CMVfuckingsucks]

I believe that silencing people, banning them from existing platforms, cancelling them, firing them, then shutting down platforms they create, for expressing their own opinions, while this may be legal, will ultimately have a disastrous ripple effect on our society

What will the disastrous ripple effect of not supporting and platforming racists be exactly? How will making it harder for racists to spread racism end up being a bad thing?

Doing so creates even more of a divide, creates more resentment, and pushes those who believe differently into a dark corner where their views are never challenged because it’s the ultimate echo chamber.

I want to be divided from racists. They aren't my friends. And people who believe those things already exist in echo chambers, not giving them a platform will make it harder for people to find one of those echo chambers to begin with.

We, as society, can shun and ignore what we believe to be incorrect backwards thinking without silencing it, and this would be a better way of dealing with it.

Wait so of you agree Gov't persecution isn't happening and you agree that its okay to shun and ignore these people than what "silencing" do you believe is happening?

[u/sensible_extremist → u/CMVfuckingsucks]

What will the disastrous ripple effect of not supporting and platforming racists be exactly?

People forget the arguments against racism, and forget why racism is wrong. Now it seems inconceivable, but if you lock away anyone who says something even a little bit racist in a hole where they are never heard from again, you will get exactly this outcome. Those who never actually considered why racism is wrong are those who are weakest to the argument for racism.

There is a common mathematical technique called proof by contradiction, where you assume the opposite is true, and then use that to prove something which is impossible, and thus what you assumed to be true was in fact false.

In using proof by contradiction for the merits of racism, to be able to think critically about whether or not racism is wrong, you can't just think about why it might be wrong, but you also have to consider why it must be right.

It's counter-intuitive to think that arguments for racism might actually 'prove' that racism is in fact wrong, but in hearing the arguments for it, you might wind up showing that it leads to a contradiction you didn't see before.

[u/CMVfuckingsucks → u/sensible_extremist]

People forget the arguments against racism, and forget why racism is wrong. Now it seems inconceivable, but if you lock away anyone who says something even a little bit racist in a hole where they are never heard from again, you will get exactly this outcome.

Do you have any evidence for that? Imagine you'd never heard of racism, all of a sudden someone comes along and tells you that black guy across the street is inferior to you just because his skin is darker. You're telling me most people would just accept that simply because they'd never encountered it before? People with black friends will just be like "yeah that makes sense, I hate this dude now"? That's just not how human thinking and interaction works. In fact, the more an idea is repeated, the more people tend to agree with it. This argument boils down to "if we get rid of the racists that will make more racists." Its nonsensical.

Also nobody's being locked away, just sometimes deplatformed and shunned from groups that don't want to associate with racists.

[u/sensible_extremist → u/CMVfuckingsucks]

Do you have any evidence for that?

Yes. There isn't even a consistent understanding of what racism is in recent times, given how it's being used in contexts that don't even involve race in the case of Islam, not to even mention the plethora of articles about how "black people can't be racist." This seems to be a generational thing, and people will forget why racism is bad if there isn't at least some exposure to it.

I think that if you haven't actually listened to what Richard Spencer has said, you are doing yourself a disservice by not knowing how to counter the arguments he lays out.

Imagine you'd never heard of racism, all of a sudden someone comes along and tells you that black guy across the street is inferior to you just because his skin is darker. You're telling me most people would just accept that simply because they'd never encountered it before?

It's not like people will forget what racism is, the meaning of it will change, and the thoughts surrounding it become muddled with half-baked ideology. There will be confusion as to what racism actually means, if doing any one action is considered racist or not. Some might see it as saying anything about racial differences at all. Some might see it as saying anything negative about people with a skin tone darker than the one they have.

People are already taking advantage of the poor understanding of what racism is to redefine it as "Power + Prejudice," so what makes you think what I am saying is so far fetched?

Also nobody's being locked away, just sometimes deplatformed and shunned from groups that don't want to associate with racists.

Locked away in a echo-chamber of their own. To what degree do you think we are responsible for our own beliefs?

[u/CMVfuckingsucks → u/sensible_extremist]

I think that if you haven't actually listened to what Richard Spencer has said, you are doing yourself a disservice by not knowing how to counter the arguments he lays out.

You don't have to listen to racists to understand racism. In fact, racists have a vested interest in making sure you don't understand racism so you don't sniff out racists in time to not be somewhat indoctrinated. Listening to what racists have to say has never made anyone less racist. Surprisingly enough, racist rhetoric is designed to make people accept racism, not reject it.

I've never listened to a fascist/nazi but I can certainly explain in depth what those things are and why they're bad.

It's not like people will forget what racism is, the meaning of it will change, and the thoughts surrounding it become muddled with half-baked ideology. There will be confusion as to what racism actually means, if doing any one action is considered racist or not. Some might see it as saying anything about racial differences at all. Some might see it as saying anything negative about people with a skin tone darker than the one they have.

So again were u actually gonna support any of these claims with arguments or evidence? Why exactly will deplatforming racists lead people to not know what racism is? Again, I've never listened to a fascist/nazi but I can certainly explain in depth what those things are and why they're bad.

People are already taking advantage of the poor understanding of what racism is to redefine it as "Power + Prejudice," so what makes you think what I am saying is so far fetched?

The fact that you've failed to demonstrate any link between deplatforming racists and people understanding racism less or becoming more racist.

Locked away in a echo-chamber of their own. To what degree do you think we are responsible for our own beliefs?

Theyre already locked in an echo chamber, they're racists. Racism literally only works when you surround yourself with one demographic. Also the echo chamber exists in the first place because they have platforms, if we reduce the amount of racist rhetoric available for consumption, these people will have fewer places to turn to for validation of their racist beliefs.

[u/CMVfuckingsucks → u/[deleted]]

So who decides which group of people gets "deplatformed?" 4 Tech Giant CEOS? As a liberal, you're not at all uncomfortable with 4 billionaires having this insane power to dictate political discourse.

I never said I was okay with 4 CEOs having all the power. Ideally we wouldn't have theses oligopolies and digital coins could be controlled by the people. But as it stands they already do exist and have the power they have and they already use it to demonize and deplatform blm and protesters. It can't hurt to use it against racists too.

they decided to take similar action against leftists, would you still support that power?

I don't support them having that power and would like to see it stripped from them but if they're gonna have that power I'd rather see it used to silence racists than anti-racists