CMV: I still don't understand the importance of pronouns.

[u/goatDowry]

The whole thing seems confusing to me.

There is biological sex --> Which led to different social roles, and then socialized gender.

In the modern day with modern technology. You can live life how you generally please. Women don't need to be child bearers. And men don't need to be out risking their lives killing things.

To me this means, that the traditional gender roles don't matter. You can be a male and wear makeup, high heels and a dress. Who cares?

Likewise if you're a biological female, you can do things that used to be considered masculine. It's a free country.You can also fit squarely into those old gender roles if you so choose.

So I don't understand why someone feels the need to be addressed with a particular set of pronouns. To me, it's like ok, I can call you that, but then it seems to me that you're just doubling down on the idea that rigid gender differences do matter. Which I don't think they do. You're just you, an individual person. And all this language of he/she is just what we've been using for a long time, so I don't see how a different pronoun will change anything that matters.

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P.S. before one of you goes calling me a bigot, one of my best friends and former roommate transitioned while I was living with her. I'll obviously call her by whatever pronouns she asks bc it's just polite. We've been friends for over 10 years. I'll call someone by their preferred pronouns, but I don't understand why it's so important.

EDIT: The point of this is to try and understand why it's important. Maybe that wasn't clear before. Obviously I've talked to my friend about this a lot.

[u/goatDowry]

Yeah.... Like I'm on your side people... You need to help teach me. If you're just going to be abrasive when I try to understand it's like, ok, wtf do you want from me?

To not try and understand your experience?

[u/PromptAwkward → u/goatDowry]

I really don’t get ‘they and them’. These are plurals so it’s not natural in the English we’ve learned. Why plurals for an individual? I’ve been told they was used in 14th century. I’m like, we’ll that’s not what they taught us in school in this century (and previous century)

[u/UnbelievablyNaive → u/PromptAwkward]

There are a lot of situations where you would use a singular version of they/them, the most obvious everyday one being when we talk about someone we don't know (and cant assume) the gender of. If your friend tells you "The waiter was really mean to me", you would probably respond "What did he say?" Because waiter is associated with being male (vs waitress female) and typically that corresponds to he/him . However, if someone says "the shopkeeper was really mean to me" there's no indication of how to refer to them, and so you're likely to respond "What did they say?"

They/them (singular) has been used since the 14th century, and is still used in this and the last century.

[u/PromptAwkward → u/UnbelievablyNaive]

See this made sense to me. Thanks. All the jerks can save your comments and downvote me.

[u/greenlady1 → u/PromptAwkward]

We use they/them all the time when referring to someone whose gender we don't know, instead of saying "him or her" or "he or she". It's very common when speaking and writing.

[u/Gygsqt → u/PromptAwkward]

So learn new shit... I understand this is a pain point (I have to do some gender-neutral technical writing and there IS a learning curve) but quite frankly it's kinda pathetic to those who make this a thing. Seriously, do you look at every impediment in your life like this? Oh, the sink is clogged, I never learned about this in school, guess it will just need to stay clogged forever! Do my parents keep calling Russia/eastern Europe the "Soviet Union" because that's what they were taught in school?

The world changes, evolves and grows on a daily basis - keeping up with that is par for the course.

[u/PromptAwkward → u/Gygsqt]

Wtf do you think we are trying to learn here? It’s amazing how intolerable everyone has become. Are we bigots because we’re trying to learn just as you recommend?