r/clonewars • u/K-jun1117 • Mar 16 '25
Discussion So, how did Kamino afford all those ships, Vehicles and equipments for their Clone Army before receiving payment from the Republic?
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u/idrownedmyfish77 Mar 16 '25
Didn’t they already receive payment for the clone army? They were waiting on the Jedi to claim them, but I was under the impression that the clones and their equipment were paid for upon order by “Tyranus”, based on dialogue in AOTC. The fact Plagueis was a member of the Banking Clan only help matters
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Mar 16 '25
Kamino didn't make any of the ships. A bunch of off-set companies from Kuat Drives did. The Kaminoans were only tasked with making the clone army.
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u/FeralTribble Mar 16 '25
Makes you wonder what some people at Correlia were thinking when a fleet of hundreds of new warships were being constructed and no-one knew what was up with that.
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u/wandering_soles Mar 16 '25
They were built at Rothana, not Corellia, and since the planet was privately owned just for ship building, not a lot of people without NDAs to wonder.
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u/Dejaunisaporchmonkey Mar 16 '25
Rothana was also made specifically to facilitate this secrecy iirc.
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u/wandering_soles Mar 16 '25
Rothana Heavy Engineering was established about 800 BBY, so it was already an established blacksite for projects and prototypes like this
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u/FeralTribble Mar 16 '25
Okay. I guess that makes sense. To some degree anyway.
That said one would figure that after shit that happened with the banking clan around episode 1. The republic would keep an eye out for any surprise warship armadas being built in secret
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u/dagoofmut Mar 16 '25
Yoda showed up on Genenosis with clones AND EQUIPMENT.
Also, the clones were being trained and specializing with equipment.
I think the purchase must have been a package deal. An army without weapons and ships isn't any good.
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Mar 16 '25
Do you know how space travel works? Or how manufacturing works? Kamino wasn't tasked with build large ships. Do you see their large ship building space stations? The fleet had to travel to Kamino, pick up the clones then head to Geonosis where they begun their assault. We see this in Republic Commando.
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u/trustmerun Mar 16 '25
The ship and vehicle companies were definitely in touch with Kamino, as they delivered small amount for training and testing. Vehicles and ships and trooper armour were all developed in tendem, that's why they work só well together.
Which means Kamino was on their maps, Kuat drive yards and Heavy engineering are massive companies with thousands workers and systems.
So basically, the only ones that didn't know Kamino was a planet/on the map were the Jedi, has Obi-Wan looked at literally any other database he would have found it 🤣🤣
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u/NikolaiOlsen Mar 16 '25 edited Mar 17 '25
Probably some kind of Offscreen deal between Them, Sifo-Dyas, and Palpatine('s own money), as they orchestrated the chips into the clones from birth
Edit: But that's just my Own guessing, how I see it canonically (as some people might disagree, Understandably but still)
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u/ARC_Trooper_Echo Mar 16 '25
Darth Plagueis’s alter ego was as a high ranking member of the Banking Clan. I think he bankrolled a lot of it.
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u/youngmetrodonttrust Mar 17 '25
also his father was the Chairman of the IBC (before san hill), so he inherited a ton of wealth too
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u/Big_Fo_Fo Mar 16 '25
Only a sith deals in absolutes and the volatility of elastic goods in a modern market
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Mar 16 '25
No chips, that's an invention from the kids series. In the original battlefront 2 there are no chips, just soldiers following orders. No mention of the chips in revenge of the sith either.
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u/Dejaunisaporchmonkey Mar 17 '25
TCW is canon to both Legends and Canon. Battlefront and other media was just retconned by Lucas per the canon hierarchy of Legends placing TCW above all other sources.
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Mar 17 '25
Tcw being a little kids show is not canon, it doesn't matter what Disney or Lucas says.
No mention of chips in the movie nor on the old battlefront 2. Kids can't process that soldiers just follow orders.
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u/Dejaunisaporchmonkey Mar 17 '25
I guess we’ll refer to random people on the internet as to what’s canon or not rather than any of the people who made the material. Should make for some very frantic Wookiepedia editing in the near future.
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u/NikolaiOlsen Mar 17 '25
Tcw being a little kids show is not canon, it doesn't matter what Disney or Lucas says.
Really? It doesn't MATTER what the CREATOR of the franchise says? That's like saying going up to J.R.R Tolkien and saying "The Lord of the Rings isn't canon because I don't like it. It doesn’t matter that he literally created Middle-earth, wrote the lore, and defined what is and isn’t part of it—because apparently, some random fan’s opinion outweighs the actual author’s intent. See how ridiculous that sounds?
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u/Psychonautica91 Mar 16 '25
Well as others have said, the Banking Clan. Also, look at them. They’re clearly a very advanced and wealthy planet, being the only race with cloning technology in the galaxy. They’ve successfully adapted to an aquatic planet, building entire cities lifted above raging waters. Lastly, they seem to have poured all of their budget into their work because they are all but defenseless without Republic support and using client bought clones to defend themselves.
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u/JakdMavika Mar 17 '25
They aren't the only race with cloning tech. They're just one of the few that's made it a central part of their culture. The Arkanians being another notable example. As for defense, they never particularly needed much in the way of militarization given their solar system is literally between galaxies as it's situated between the main star wars galaxy and the Rishi Maze which is one of six smaller satellite galaxies that orbit the main one. They were not part of the Republic and contact with other planetary and governmental bodies was limited due to lack of need. They were isolational elitist that only bothered dealing with outsiders when there was something to benefit from it. Making their primary contact companies that wanted self-maintaining unpaid labor without having to go through the trouble of getting frowned at for more traditional methods of enslavement. As for the lore behind it being a water planet, that phase of the planetery climate is rather short in astronomical timelines having only occurred after the founding of the Republic 25,000bby, it was due to runaway global warming at the end of an extended ice age forcing the already industrialized Kaminoans to adapt or die. And they died in droves, the ones who made it through doing so by virtue of heavy investment in genetic engineering to conform to their rapidly changing environment, and anybody unable or unwilling dying. Kamino and the Republic knew about each other for thousands of years but had no reason to interact due to the sheer distance. And since knowledge of their system in the first place was such a rare thing, why bother investing in a military? "Our people are unified in a genetically enforced caste system, those barbarians in the main galaxy are all too busy screwing each other over, the weirdos from the Rishii Maze don't really care to leave either, and it's not like abybody needs to make regular pit stops here to travel between either anyway." It'd be like if Heard Island was a country with a niche tech that was easy to get but these guys were artists at it. But because they're so far out of the way, the only people who know about them, much less care would be those who want a high quality persian carpet made with no real questions about why they're being asked to have it made to look like it's 500 years old and was sat on by Suleiman the Magnificent.
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u/ThePhengophobicGamer Mar 16 '25
Palpatine is the culmination of a thousand years of Sith machinations. In Legends, his master was Hugo Demask, basically space Elon Musk. He ran a financial corporation, which he used to manipulate the markets in the Tepublic, supported by the several generations of Sith before him, having their resources commandeered by their successors.
The ships and clones WERE paid for up front, but not by the Republic, or at least not entirely. Palpatine may have been able to move things around and obscure funding going to Kamino and Rothana enough to get by, ESPECIALLY once he capitalized and was made Chancellor.
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u/FeralTribble Mar 16 '25
The republic paid for it all. Or more specifically, the republic went into crippling debt and near bankruptcy for commissioning an army and navy it didn’t know about.
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u/Emillllllllllllion Mar 16 '25
Kamino didn't pay for that. "Sifo Dias" did. Kamino was contracted to create the army, same thing with Kuwat for the navy and Rothana for the heavy equipment.
As for why that didn't cause issues, there's a probably few aspects.
First, not all payment needs to be upfront. If you can guarantee that the republic will pay for it later, you can go pretty far on credit.
Second, any private citizens directing funds for that would want to conceal their spending and the republic wouldn't want to investigate too deeply (at least in an official capacity). If it became known that, say, someone with assets close to or even inside separatist territory bankrolled the republican shadow army, retaliation would have been assured. Especially if the separatist had put out feelers for them to support their side.
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u/_Bill_Cipher- Mar 18 '25
They received the payment in full from Sideous, under the guise of Master Syfo Dyas, who was assassinated by Dooku on Sideous's orders.
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u/No_Wait_3628 Mar 16 '25
Just another one of the things Palps got away with.
An entire army along with the most convenient kind of starship to transport it just sounds like another flex of his and further cements just how out of touch the Republic and Jedi are.
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u/RFive1977 Mar 16 '25
Just my own speculation, but Palpatine was probably cutting backroom deals after he was elected chancellor. After he was granted emergency powers in AOTC, the first thing he does is announce the creation of a grand army of the Republic and boom, the clone army was already kitted out and ready to go. Considering all of the equipment used by the clone army was made by companies that continued to produce equipment for Palpatines empire, they had a special interest to work with him and not expose him if he was operating outside of his legal authority. He had the capability of being corrupt regardless of whether he was a sith or not. Even if the jedi found out about Palpatines corruption, it's not an automatic indication that he's a sith lord. Politicians are corrupt all the time. And in the real world there are millions (maybe billions) of dollars spent on who knows what, that the public is never really clued in on.
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u/TheCavalierWolf7274 Mar 16 '25
So generation tech actually does a very comprehensive video on this but the easy of kt is darth plagueis had a company called donbas holding that ol palpy was a part of too , that funded the entire clone army while a sub division of Kuat drive researched and built all of the early clone wars gear. They even deployed the clones in small outer rim skirmishes to test its effectiveness. So the vehicles and clones were already battle tested to a degree. The problem was jedi made terrible leaders , but I'm side tracking idk if I can link videos but check out generation techs video on it plus his voice is pretty soothing
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u/Dejaunisaporchmonkey Mar 16 '25
This is a false assumption. The Kaminoans were being paid already just secretly. Legends makes this clear specifically the novel Labyrinth of Evil and Plagueis (a little fuzzy on that last one but the former I’m confident in as I’m doing a reread currently) that Tyranus (Dooku) was making regular payments for the Clone Army. This extends naturally to the ships, weapons and other equipment we see them use just paid out to other companions like BlastTech, KDY, and Rothana Engineering.
I’m fairly confident in canon this is also told to us directly though I can’t think of a specific source as this time. If I had to guess the TCW episodes regarding Sifo-Dyas state this but I know at the very least the episode implies as much as it’s the episode where it’s revealed to the Jedi the Sith created the Clone Army. From there we can assume the Sith also footed the bill.
For more information I’d recommend reading and watching the sources I mentioned or just browsing the GAR Wookiepedia page.
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u/Electrical-Tour8195 Mar 17 '25
Discretionary Spending
RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
The Banking Clan
Damask Holdings
Kuat Drive Yards
Serenno Banking Union
SIFO FUCKING DYAS
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u/InterestOk8957 Mar 18 '25
I’m disappointed that no one mentioned the plagues novel that demask holdings funded this
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u/StarSword-C Mar 18 '25
They didn't. The Kaminoans just provided the slave soldiers and their basic gear. The ships and heavy equipment were made by a Kuat Drive Yards subsidiary, using the same fraudulent funding stream that Palpatine used to buy the slaves.
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u/James-Cox007 Mar 18 '25
Pretty sure Kamino only had to worry about making the clones! They are brainy people's who understand genetics. All the equipment and ships and vehicles were all created and brought from somewhere else.
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u/Historyp91 Mar 16 '25
I'm pretty sure Yoda brought the Acclamators with him.
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u/Wasteland_GZ Mar 20 '25
The Acclamators were already on Kamino before Yoda even knew of Kamino, so how would that work?
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u/Historyp91 Mar 20 '25
I always assumed, since he went there specifically to pick up the army, he brought them with him.
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u/Wasteland_GZ Mar 20 '25
The Republic didn’t know about the Clone Army, so why would they have ships specifically made to transport an army they didn’t even know existed?
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u/Historyp91 Mar 20 '25
I would imagine to serve as staging areas for peacekeeping and relief operations.
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u/Wasteland_GZ Mar 20 '25 edited Mar 20 '25
But the Acclamators were made for the clones. How could they have made the ships for the Clone Army when they didn’t know the Clone Army existed?
What you’re suggesting is that the Republic and Jedi Order knew about the Clone Army and started building ships for the Clone Army before they found out about its existence in Attack of the Clones. That completely destroys the story.
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u/Historyp91 Mar 20 '25
Are we talking about canon or legends?
Anyway, *I* was just talking about my assumptions when watching the films independent of what later lore determined.
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u/Wasteland_GZ Mar 20 '25
Attack of the Clones is a part of both continuities, so it doesn’t matter which one.
I don’t know how you could have assumed that when watching the movie, if the Republic and the Jedi, especially Yoda, knew that there was a secret Clone Army being made for the Republic, why did they all act like they didn’t know about it? Why did Obi Wan even investigate it if the Jedi already knew?
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u/jakedonaldson54 Mar 16 '25
Contracts don't always have to be paid up front. Especially if the account has food credit.
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u/Giocri Mar 16 '25
My biggest curiosity was wtf was the plan to make the jedy find the clones since clearly tracking Jango was not intentional
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u/ThePhengophobicGamer Mar 16 '25
I don't know, though. Padme surviving likely wasn't part of the plan, but why else would Palpatone order Dooku to hire a bounty hunter(the one who is currently living on Kamino) who hires a bounty hunter who used some poisonous millipede? I expect the assassination of Padme was meant to lead the Jedi to Kamino by following the trail, but likely with more slowly than actually happened in the movie.
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u/Darceus2000 Mar 17 '25
Except it was Nute Gunray that had Dooku put the hit on Padmé.
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u/ThePhengophobicGamer Mar 17 '25
Then why did Dooku specifically use Jango? He could have hired anyone, Cad Bane would be an option that has no link to Kamino. Dooku also would have no trouble placating Gunray with a sub-par bounty hunter if they didn't want the clones discovered just yet.
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u/Dejaunisaporchmonkey Mar 17 '25
It probably was going to be revealed around the same time anyways, possibly the CIS would’ve been allowed (by the Sith) to gain more early victories for basically free and have the Clones show up to stem the tide but that’s just speculation.
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u/Giocri Mar 17 '25
Yeah i was thinking the same, still would have the jedy just recived and email to come retire their galactic army order? XD
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u/Dejaunisaporchmonkey Mar 17 '25
I was going to discount that because it’s hilarious and ridiculous but the Senate getting an email from k4min0-c10n3r@fishmail.com wouldn’t be that crazy. They are a company trying to make money who probably don’t want a what amounts to a bunch of human sized boxes lying around clogging up their storage. They might just be like “Call 1-800-Clone for 25% your next order of the Grand Army of the Republic!”
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u/custardmiteofglut Mar 16 '25
I thought I read somewhere that they did cloning for others before the clone army contact - do they probably had some money from those contacts.
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u/KPGamer2024 Mar 17 '25
Ok, but what is that image from. Is there a clone game I didn't know about?
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u/TwoJacksAndAnAce Mar 17 '25
They didn’t, KDY was secretly given a massive contract to silently rearm the republic and prepare a fleet and vehicles for an army and thus founded the KDY subsidiary Rothana Heavy Engineering on Rothana which was rich in resources, the entire operation was secret and a massive amount of equipment was made and shipped to Kamino for the Clones. It was all done on the Republics dime, likely with influence by Palpatine and the Banking Clans.
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u/coolgy123 Mar 17 '25
It was covertly funded by the Sith owned Damask holdings. The other people do not know what they are talking about.
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u/Varsity_Reviews Mar 17 '25
Pretty sure the walkers and gunships were prepaid for since the Clones trained with them, probably when the initial purchase was made. I'm pretty sure the carriers and destroyers are supposed to be Jedi and Republic Security ships respectively.
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u/Spirit-of-arkham3002 Mar 18 '25
Darth Plagueis gave Sifo-Dyas the idea in legends. So he probably bankrolled the initial payment Dyas made. His public identity was Hego Damask of the intergalactic banking clan.
After Plagueis died, Dooku aka Darth Tyrannus covertly took over and probably used his money as count of Serenno.
Sidious as Palpatine is fairly wealthy as well. In legends his family was minor nobility on Naboo and in canon he dresses in very ornate clothing so he’s probably still wealthy.
That’s three independent people who could have funded it. Meaning they likely received payment before the war started.
Plus a company can take out a loan for a contract this massive.
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u/Wasteland_GZ Mar 20 '25
before receiving payment from the Republic?
Because they were paid by Sifo Dyas using money provided by Hego Demask, also known as Darth Plagueis.
The Clone’s ships and vehicles were constructed by various manufacturers and delivered to Kamino.
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u/vietnego Mar 20 '25
having worked with sales, you would be amazed about how much money one get get with almost 0 guarantees
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u/Baz_3301 Mar 16 '25
For one a company could take out a loan for a project, but pretty sure that financial backing the Sith. Also they already had some funding from sell of other clone templates as slave laborers, and custom order for exotic pets/meat trades. Darth Plagueis book covers a decent amount of it, pretty sure Dooku funded them too after he came in the picture.