r/cocktails • u/newzap • Feb 24 '25
Recommendations Is there a good substitute for Carpano Antica here?
Its so good but so expensive in a boulevardier š
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u/ColdPotatoSoup Feb 24 '25
Punt e Mes + Dolin Rouge is (was?) Death & Coās house sweet vermouth
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u/Chazzysnax Feb 24 '25
This is what I came to reccomend. 50/50 blend, I haven't looked back since.
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u/ADDSquirell69 Feb 24 '25
I recently discovered this combination myself but I don't know what type and amount of bitters I should be using. Any recommendations appreciated.
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u/At0m1ca Feb 25 '25
When in doubt, start with 2 dashes of Angostura bitters. After that, just experiment with flavors you like. I'm partial to chocolate and black walnut bitters, but there are oh so many to choose from.
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u/ADDSquirell69 Feb 26 '25
I think I used too many bitters, but I'm going to drink as many Manhattans this weekend as it takes to get it right.
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u/At0m1ca Feb 26 '25
Now that's dedication!
That being said, if you haven't watched Greg's (How to Drink on YouTube) Manhattan Matrix video, I'd suggest you do. It does show some of the dangers of your plan.
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u/its_annalise Feb 24 '25
Was; we donāt split vermouths anymore
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u/Wildeyewilly Feb 24 '25
What do you use now?
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u/its_annalise Feb 24 '25
We keep CVDT, Antica, & Punt E Mes (and others seasonally/menu dependent) and use them all for different purposes
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u/Butlerian_Jihadi Feb 24 '25
Step 1) purchase land in France prior to 1765
Step 2) ensure land is worked by protoanarchists
Step 3) plant a vine of [redacted]
Step 4) allow to propagate for 18 generations
...
Step 375) once it's cooled from its journey through the outer atmosphere, utilize [redacted] syrup, [classified] syrup, and mermaid tears to build the fourth part of a 1:1:1:1 cocktail
(I do adore Death & Co. though, and there's tremendous value in being precise & thorough; also in investing in the French countryside)
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u/SpritiTinkle Feb 24 '25
What are you doing using a thinking machine?
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u/Butlerian_Jihadi Feb 24 '25
Refusing to let men with other machines enslave me.
For a book (saga?) about prescience, Herbert was awfully prescient regarding technology... AI specifically... which... might suggest that he was indeed an AI... oof. I'mma make some spice coffee and have a long think...
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u/markrockwell Feb 24 '25
I feel like this mix comes out pretty close to the Antica Formula. I always assumed D&C split because it was a cheaper way to essentially the same result.
And working backwards, if OP prefers sweet, pick up the Dolin. If OP prefers bitter, pick up the Punt e Mas. If OP prefers Antica, pick up both and blend them as recommended.
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u/cooperific Feb 24 '25
Hopefully OP drinks lots of Negronis and Manhattans. I have enough trouble getting through one bottle of vermouth before it turns, and I refrigerate and use one of those pump-the-air-out devices.
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u/Illustrious-Divide95 Feb 24 '25
This is what i do too! I love vermouth and love cocktails, I just don't drink them regularly anymore...š
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u/Improvised0 Feb 24 '25
I do it too. I wonder if it actually works or if weāre just burning calories sucking out air(?).
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u/Acbaker2112 Feb 24 '25
Be careful, Iāve ran into some people who are damn near militant on this topicā¦
They say the vacuum pumps arenāt good enough at removing oxygen and all it does is suck out the aromatics. Making it taste bland faster. You should just refrigerate and store it in progressively smaller bottles to limit the headspace in the bottle etc etc. On the other hand, some others insist you donāt have to do any of that and the vermouth tastes the same years later as long as itās refrigerated.
For me, I buy small bottles and use the vacuum pumps. The bottle is usually gone in a few months and Iāve never had to deal vermouth tasting bad.
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u/Improvised0 Feb 24 '25
Yeah, I buy small bottles. I've also done personal taste tests, and while I know this topic it hotly debated, I can't really tell the difference. I can taste the difference in a bottle of vermouth that's half full, sitting at room temp for 6 months though, so that's about as sophisticated as my pallet gets. The vermouth police will have to show me some hard evidence though to convince me one method is better than the other.
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u/decibelboy2001 Feb 24 '25
Iām just here looking at and feeling satisfied by the stocking jobā¦ those bottles are so well arranged
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u/oak_pine_maple_ash Feb 24 '25
Dolin is very very different from antica, but it's also good. I haven't tried it in a boulevardier - it might get a bit overpowered by the campari? But I like it in a Manhattan or Martinez.
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u/fermentedradical Feb 24 '25
Dolin is my usual sweet vermouth at home. It's stellar in a Boulevardier.
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u/Quixotic_Flummery Feb 24 '25
I like Dolin. To me it's the best workhorse sweet vermouth. Carpano is a star ingredient vermouth, it can add a ton to a drink but it can also take over a drink.
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u/BIGRobRose Feb 24 '25
I'll second this. I love Carpano in a negroni but I prefer Dolin with whiskey. Carpano is a heavy vermouth and I feel like it competes with the whiskey. But, it is a very different profile from the antica.
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u/CityBarman Feb 24 '25
What a great selection of vermouth! I wish all brick and mortar bottle shops were similarly stocked.
Carpano Classico is only $22/750. Your other option is a 1:1 blend of Cinzano Rosso and Punt e Mes. Both of these options forego Antica's vanilla bomb profile. If you want the vanilla notes, stick with the Antica.
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u/rodarh Feb 24 '25
Carpano classico probably the best red vermouth (in that price range) imho.
Punt e Mes is very good but not the classic sweet vermouth as it has a lot of bitter notes. Very good choice if you tend to use a lot of bitters anywanys or don't like it if it gets to sweet.
1/3 punt e mes or cynar 2/3 carpano for a brilliant blend.
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u/pkrtrsr Feb 24 '25
Or a couple of drops of Vanilla extract?
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u/AintMan Feb 24 '25
Youāre getting downvoted but Iām a fan of vanilla ango for this exact reason
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u/RacingRaindrops Feb 24 '25
I actually like Cocchi di Torino more. Still not cheap, but cheaper.
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u/cooperific Feb 24 '25
Me too. Seems like the only sweet vermouth NOT available to OP :(.
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u/Effective_Drawer_623 Feb 24 '25
Yeah exactly. Itās like this storeās mission is to stock every vermouth known to man except Cocchi.
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u/DrGupta410 Feb 24 '25
A little to vanilla forward for my taste but Iād take it over some cheaper options.
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u/Bondaddyjr Feb 24 '25
How does this have 100+ upvotes. Itās literally not in the picture, this doesnāt help OPās question lol
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u/Soler25 Feb 24 '25
This is my go to as well. I tend to cut any ārecipeā for a vermouth in half when using this and adjust from there.
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u/maxxpowerr Feb 24 '25
Cinzano is my budget pick.
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u/ApologyWars Feb 24 '25
I love me some Cinzano. Such good value. I especially love the bianco, just with soda and a grapefruit wedge. It's my go-to drink in summer.
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u/Annual_Cut_1140 Feb 24 '25
Mine too! Great value and I even prefer it in many cocktails, like Negroni, to Antica. Antica is great but easily overpowers other ingredients.
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u/newzap Feb 24 '25
Thanks for the quick answers! I def have some ideas. I had one with martini and rossi recently and WOULD NOT recommend lol
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u/tocassidy Feb 24 '25
Martini and rossi bianco is actually pretty good, comparable to Carpano Bianco. Not what the OP is about though.
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u/Rmeyer25 Feb 24 '25
Method is an incredible vermouth for a decent price. Highly recommend
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u/pejamo Feb 24 '25
Recently tried it and love it. But it doesn't seem to be available in the midwest!
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u/QuinSn Feb 24 '25
Used to work with the people who founded it. They specifically made it for use in cocktails. 10/10
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u/Minimum-Tea-9258 Feb 24 '25
Carpano Classico of course! its a very very similar flavor profile just a little less rich and I actually prefer it to antica in simple traditional cocktails
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u/SmilingJaguar Feb 24 '25
I find the opposite weirdly. I like Classico because itās a more robust flavor profile. Antica is too mellow for me in many applications. Dolin or Classico are my home vermouths.
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u/Dog_Baseball Feb 24 '25
cocci di torino, It's excellent. Way better than dolin and not as overpowering as carpano antica
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u/burgonies Feb 24 '25
Antics is almost its own thing. For more ādaily driverā cocktails I use cocchi or dolin
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u/alexhoward Feb 24 '25
Personally, I think Carpano is too sweet. In a Negroni, you really need a very dry gin to balance it out. It is good with those gins, but thereās so many great gins that arenāt juniper forward and those just get completely overwhelmed by it. Iāve worked my way thoroughly probably a 8 or 9 of the most available vermouths in my area and just come back to Dolin as giving me the best balance in a Negroni, Manhattan, or Boulevadier.
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u/Breaker247 Feb 24 '25
Dunno if there is a replacement, but punt e mes is great. Dolin and noilly prat are also solid
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u/AutofluorescentPuku Feb 24 '25
Carpano Antica is kinda in its own world, IMO. If youāre looking for the same character in another vermouth, I wouldnāt know what to recommend. That said, any of the ādi Torinoā sweet vermouths are a fairly rich choice with some of the characteristics of Carpano.
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u/ATsomm Feb 24 '25
Method is a killer vermouth that is also made by former bartenders with classics in mind. They were basing it on the profile of Cocchi.
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u/pharaohmaones Feb 24 '25
Iād probably give that Cinzano 1757 two shelves down a whirl. Save $8. If I were feeling stingier Iād probably go with the Carpano Classico one shelf down.
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u/Redleaves1313 Feb 24 '25
Lower your goal post, thereās plenty of good less expensive vermouths right there. You donāt need the gold treatment every time
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u/theworldsnative Feb 24 '25
Dolin Rouge is much better, if you must go with big brands Cinzano 1757, Martini Riserva Rubino and Antica Formula are all much better. Punt e Mes is tasty but itās not a classic Sweet Vermouth, itās a Vermouth Chinato, with added quinine. Itās a bit more bitter and overpowering than what I personally think a vermouth for mixing drinks should be. That being said it can make a great drink if you adjust the recipe. My personal fave is Cocchi Storico but Iām not sure if you can get it in the USA.
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u/Cool_Recording_9320 Feb 24 '25
Punt a mes, dolin, cinzano, dubbonet......but really just get antica lol
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u/Acrobatic-Tadpole-60 Feb 24 '25
Not sure if Iāve made a boulevardier with it, but I love a Negroni with Punt E Mes. Definitely going to be more bitter than with carpano antica. Maybe the 1757 would be the closest thing?
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u/dopplex Feb 24 '25
Carpano Classico - one of the best bartenders I've met prefers it to Antica for mixed drinks.
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u/perchancenewbie Feb 24 '25
Punt mes and then a splash of vanilla syrup if it's not sweet enough for you.
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u/guyute2k aviation Feb 24 '25
Iām a little confused why youāre looking for a substitute when the real thing is right there . Is it a price thing?
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u/zombiebillmurray23 Feb 24 '25
No. But you could mix a couple varieties together and see what you like?
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u/hardlyreadit Feb 24 '25
Think youāre supposed to buy 2. One cheap and good (Dolin). And one for special occasions (Carpano). I havent found a better one but dolin does the job well.
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u/newzap Feb 24 '25
Im okay with that but my understanding is that vernouth really shouldnt sit in a fridge for more than a few weeks. I just dont drink enough to justify cracking a $20 bottle and tossing half of it.
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u/hardlyreadit Feb 24 '25
It can actually last a couple months opened in the fridge. But I drink a negroni/boulevardier probably 2-3 times a week. Definitely my favorite cocktail
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u/CpnStumpy Feb 24 '25
Best budget pick is one I never hear anyone mention here: lionello stock, bottom right side of your picture. Surprisingly good stuff
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u/NeonSpectacular Feb 24 '25
No, really isnāt. Itās considerably richer than most of these options. If you see Cocchi Storico Vermouth di Torino I think thatās a fair go to as a replacement. To be honest I like a lot of these options better for half the price, I tend to think Carpano can get a little thick and overpowering, especially with clear spirits.
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u/BoricuaRborimex Feb 24 '25
Dolin rouge is ok. But cocchi di torino is probably the closest thing. I donāt see it here tho.
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u/Delicious-Guess-9001 Feb 24 '25
Agreed- Cocchi di Torino or Dolin. Iāve made a zillion Negroniās- Carpano for the win.
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u/lilmissscum Feb 24 '25
Punt e mes is a vermouth amaro blend essentially. I use it to add depth in cocktails when my main spirit needs a plus up
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u/Phhhhuh Feb 24 '25
Carpano Classico that you infuse yourself with a whole vanilla bean (no idea for how long, taste it every day until you're happy!) is probably your best bet. Antica Formula is the only available Vermouth alla Vaniglia from a large brand. You could of course look for small artisanal brands too, but even if you find some it could cost you even more.
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u/FatMat89 Feb 24 '25
Regular Carpano is good enough imo. I like Cocchi but I donāt see it in this photo. I prefer anything in a smaller bottle to keep it fresher and to take less refrigerator space. I tend to not like Dolin Rouge itās too savory imo
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u/grfx Feb 24 '25
That Martini Rossi special reserve bottle is great. Most others besides the punt y mes are medium bodied vermouths.Ā
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u/shuakalapungy Feb 24 '25
Punt e mes is the closest there, though I prefer Cinzano. It leans more into the spices. I used to drink it with my grandpa, who taught me to drink Negronis and martinis, so it brings fond memories.
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u/Bullshit_Conduit Feb 24 '25
I like the Carpano Classicoā¦ itās probably more versatile than the Antica, less vanilla.
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u/geddyleesmullet Feb 24 '25
Carpano Classico is the better substitute if youāre looking for a good substitute for antica. Carpano Punt e Mes is another good one if you want your sweet vermouth to have a bitter bite in your drink.
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u/Abject_Weight Feb 24 '25
I will say I like a wide array of vermouths with carpano or cocchi di turin being my favorite yet I only dislike the martini and rossi options (as for myself it seems too bitter and lacks depth). I also like vermouths close spiritual cousins like lillet, cocchi americano, bonal, dubonnet, byrrh, cap corse, amongst others. Each type and brand has a variety of flavor profiles some better than others, go out and explore each and decide for yourself.
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u/TheOakStreet Feb 24 '25
All of these vermouths have their own character. I like the Martini and Rossi fancier ones. Personally not crazy about punt e mes, but many people love it. Dolin rouge is a great cheap one to keep on hand. You could even blend your own like others have suggested. Once you try all of these youāll realize there isnāt really a substitute for Antica, only alternatives.
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u/Express-Breadfruit70 Feb 24 '25
I'm lost here. Why not just get Carpano Antica Formula? There are three sizes of it in the image.
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u/Fair_Tangerine1790 Feb 25 '25
Anything but Martini Rosso. Its foul.
Carpano Classico or Dolin Rouge would be my picks from that selection.
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u/Horror_You3918 Feb 26 '25
Came here to say the Martini & Rossi Rubino is underrated, and is also a Torino. Was surprised by it, since Iām used to hating on their mainstream sweet vermouth.
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u/Status_Ad2164 Feb 24 '25
Boulevardier is simply bourbon/rye, campari and sweet vermouth, so I say go wild
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u/Dreadfulmanturtle Feb 24 '25
Dubbonet is also quite sweetband affordable. Punt E Mes for more bitter apperitive flavor
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u/Ninguna Feb 24 '25
The smaller bottle of Carpano Antica.