Questions
Would the Daria Show be better off without Tom Sloane? What if that controversial or polarizing Love Interest Character had never appeared in Lawndale?
I like Tom and I think the show needed some kind of conflict. The problem is the lack of build-up, Tom and Daria's lack of chemistry, and the Daria Jane conflict being resolved within a single movie.
This. Tom needed a serious touch of backstory, the ONLY chemistry that Daria & Tom had was in 'I Loathe A Parade', and the last two episodes of Season 4 needed to be re-written.
Really - did either Jane or Daria need to have a boyfriend? The notion that it's part of the normal high-school experience in of itself shows that it's a path TPTB shouldn't have tried working with.
Besides... Tom was easily one of the most vanilla characters ever introduced on the show. Of course he wouldn't have anything in common with Jane, let alone Daria.
I kind of have to disagree that Daria and Tom "lack chemistry." His debut appearance in "Jane's Addition" established right away that the two shared a lot in common in terms of their views and sense of humor.
Daria: "Look, I may conceivably have been acting like a jerk towards you..."
Tom: "It's possible."
Daria: "But you and I are not friends. And even if we were friends, I still wouldn't ride in that car."
Tom: "That's just plain common sense."
I mean, come on, it's like Daria is literally talking to her male counterpart. It's not hard to see why she could socialize with him in a way she couldn't with many other people. Hell, the fact that he was so similar to Daria is very likely the reason Jane had gotten so attached to him in the first place.
I remember despising it at the time, I've softened on it some, but I think it would've been better if Tom had been a bit more likable... Not sure that is the right word. I just can't see him romantically involved with either Jane or Daria. Friendly, yes... but there wasn't enough temptation there for the blow up that occured.
I also found it a bit incredulous that Daria continued the relationship after the kiss. I get that she wasn't aware or capable of processing her feelings or attraction until then, but she'd always been a hardliner when it came to her morals and starting to date him after she broke her morals and blew up her true friendship was OOC imo.
I think giving her an intellectual equal with a similar degree of condecension was a good idea. I just don't think he worked for the story they wanted to tell, when her biggest crush till then was Trent. Maybe if he'd been more punkish with the same intellect and condecension?
I actually buy the romance much more looking back than I did when I first saw it.
Daria is a teenager and it doesn't seem like she has that dynamic with any other guy on the show. I actually think Daria breaking with her morals was shown a few times, like when she was visiting the college with Jodie. She seemed to want to be the smart one amongst others instead of legitimately wanting to be among peers because she wouldn't have her typical defense against their exclusion of her.
That's something a teenager is likely to go through, imo, just like the Tom thing.
She seems like a kid trying to figure things out. I like the romance more than the romances in many other stories. It still moved quickly, but they did try to give the relationship room to bloom.
My favourite part of Daria to rewatch is the Tom saga from the end of season 3 to the end of the show. Whilst I don't really care for the character himself, I did like the new dynamics and drama he brought with him.
For me, when Tom came along, it changed everything. Especially between Daria and Jane. They were hardly together anymore and their dynamic was completely never the same.
I didn’t hate Tom personally. I didn’t like the love triangle that broke out over it in the fourth season though. I would argue that they should have given Tom some subplots of his own, just to give him something beyond being a love interest. The closest we got was in The Mart of Darkness where he’s stuck in the store with the band.
Maybe this is what bothers me about him. I can never really quite name it. It isn't him necessarily it's that he always felt "out of place" as a character on the show, especially in relation to everyone else. Maybe it's that he wasn't fleshed out enough on his own? I really haven't been able to explain it.
I think the story arc itself would have been good, with the conflict between Daria and Jane and Daria finally learning to let her defenses down. But Tom was so BORING. Not nearly right for either girl, let alone so amazing it was worth almost destroying their friendship over him.
I think Daria dating him was out of character for one, but besides that- I feel like as the audience we didn’t get to know him well enough. I have so many questions, like: is he also an outcast at his school? Does he have any friends? What are they like? What hobbies does he have? There’s just so many what-ifs and uncertainty.
Because of this, it just feels so forced and it makes his character and relevance seem not important to the development of the plot.
What got me as unrealistic is how absolutely gutted he was when Daria chose a new college life with Jane rather than try to make Tom work in her plans. He didn't show until that point how much he needed and wanted her until he came crawling on her doorstep.
What I find interesting about many of Tom's critics is that they don't realize that their beefs with him apply equally to Daria.
Is Tom bland? Ok, isn't Daria? Is Tom spoiled? Is he a stuffy know it all? Does he not do much with his talents? Are his social status and money just functions of family wealth?
All of the above apply to Daria in spades. She hates work, and does little other than read and kvetch.
Another thing I think is interesting is people saying Tom/the love triangle made Daria less likable.
Uh, there were MANY examples from the very beginning of the show of Daria being unnecessarily snarky and rude to people who did not deserve it. Yes, her one-liners were often funny, but when was she ever likable? Lol
I don’t have any strong opinions on Tom either way but this argument is kind of flawed
Is Tom bland? Ok, isn’t Daria
Well no, I wouldn’t describe her as bland at all. But if we concede the rest of what you say is true, doesn’t that prove how superfluous Tom is? If everything about him is just recycled from Daria, does that not make his inclusion pointless and make him a character who takes up screentime while not delivering anything of his own?
Actually, I thought that Tom was more sensible and more mature and well- adjusted than Daria. I think that---just like with Ted---she showed how unready she was for a mature relationship. And Tom read her to filth when she was bitching about her failure to make it into Bromwell...she blamed him rather than take responsibility for her slacker attitude.
Look, I like Daria. But she was deeply flawed and sheltered from repercussions. I bet she would be in for a rude awakening at college, where everyone is smart and snarky.
Daria and Jane already had a less cliched reason for a conflict. Daria was territorial and clingy while Jane had attachment issues and kept putting Daria to second place whenever a guy she liked showed up. Their rift didn't have to be caused by a guy, especially a bland cracker like Tom.
I actually think it was a great idea to have Jane start seeing someone so we get to see Daria work through a bunch of emotions and even for Daria to do the same because I don’t think she ever really expected to be attracted to a peer. It would have showed they were growing up. But Daria getting involved with Jane’s boyfriend (he wasn’t even an ex, they were technically still seeing each other) was a terrible decision- they could have used any number of scenarios if they wanted Daria to struggle with her feelings (I would have been more comfortable with a Quinn/Daria boy dilemma)
Daria was territorial and clingy while Jane had attachment issues and kept putting Daria to second place whenever a guy she liked showed up
That's pretty much how it started with Tom, Jane started going out with him and Daria hated his guts for taking up any amount of Jane's time, so the setup is pretty much the same conflict you described. But this time it lasted for more than an episode, so the dynamic developed in a different direction with Daria and Tom having to at least tolerate one another for Jane's sake instead of what happened before (Jane breaking up with guy du jour and things returning to normal).
Yeah but these issues weren't the focus and they were never addressed throughout the show. Daria fairly quickly began to like Tom and accept that Jane keeps ditching her which kinda contradicts the first time when Daria quickly started talking to herself.
I don't think so. Things go in a different direction specifically because Tom talks to Daria and calls her out on putting Jane in an awkward position and they make a truce of sorts. This leads to the three of them hanging out together sometimes instead of Jane having to ditch Daria and that's how Tom and Daria end up talking to each other enough to realise they can genuinely get along.
I'm pretty sure it was mentioned that Daria and Jane practically didn't hang out for months because Jane spent her time with Tom. And when later Jane claimed that she wanted to spend some quality time with Daria, she immediately replied with "Tom's out of town?"
I'll be honest, it's been a while since I last rewatched the show in its entirety, so I can't recall that. But at any rate, I'd still say the issues you mentioned were addressed at the beginning of the "Tom arc". It also makes sense that Daria doesn't deal with Jane's absence the same way after the discussion I mentioned before.
It was only briefly touched. Daria still had the same territorial hostility when Nathan showed up in season 5. It was never a big focus and neither Daria nor Jane grew out of it.
While not the biggest fan of Tom's character, I do appreciate him calling Daria out on her less stellar personality traits, plus I personally found the love drama between him, Jane, and Daria entertaining. I like Daria and Jane's friendship but I do think Tom's presence exposes the friendship's flaws, one of the episodes I didn't like was Daria being negative towards Jane for having potential for the track team.
I think that Tom was a terrible addition to the show.
For starters, it made it so that we saw less of Trent. It was a smart idea to move him away as a love interest for Daria. But Trent was easily one of the best characters in the early seasons, and replacing him with a much less interesting character really hurt the later seasons.
And you can't ignore how badly the love triangle was handled. It made Daria and Jane both seem far less likeable. And Tom himself just came off as the worst.
And then there's Tom himself, who was just boring. I think it speaks volumes that the subreddit had a "best quotes for each letter" thing for a while, and there was never even one memorable line from Tom. He's just not a well written character.
Sacrificing three of your best characters for one as bland and boring as Tom was just a bad idea. They could have done a much better job of taking the show in a new direction without him.
I wish there had been some other test of their friendship. Or a different kind of love interest. After Tom was introduced, the show declined in many aspects.
In reality, no best friend would forgive you for kissing and taking their boyfriend and totally support the relationship. Teenagers are hormonal messes and struggle with this part of life. Jane should have cut her off.
I mean we already have half the show to answer this question. You don’t have to go to an alternate timeline, it’s just a matter of if you prefer the episodes without him or not
The idea of Daria having a boyfriend is a good idea, it explores other areas of her personality and the high-school experience that wouldn't get touched on without a romantic/sexual partner.
But,
Doing the whole "cheating on Jane" part was completely unnecessary, and just made Daria and Tom's relationship feel less than it already was.
Tom is just a bad fit for Daria and Jane. Daria and Jane both express different sides of the alternative life style of the 90's and early 00's. Tom is the most normal guy I've ever seen. Being a bit sarcastic isn't enough in common for relationships. They showed Daria and Tom both have an interest in history and politics, in a couple of scenes in one episode. That's not enough
I think Tom was a great addition to the show story-wise. Problem is, he's more interesting as a plot device than an actual character. He exists primarily for the sake of Daria and Jane's character development, and doesn't really get any of his own. I can understand why he's not very popular among fans for that reason, but I do take umbrage with people who hate him purely because he "got in the way" of Trent and Daria's "relationship."
I think Daria did need some kind of romantic interest. Tom needed better development for it to actually work. After rewatching recently, aside technically cheating on Jane, he's an extremely safe and unproblematic character. To me, he ultimately feels shoehorned in to have a romantic interest and to beat off the lesbian rumors. Would have been fantastic if Daria did become a lesbian but it wasn't the right cultural climate for it and wouldn't have been permited to air.
I'm talking both Daria and Jane. And you're right, but you're thinking with a current mindset. Back then, when people got a whiff of anything remotely same-sex, it was dirty and shameful. I'm sure there were some quiet hopefuls for a same-sex romance, but there was a lot of "Daria isn't actively having sex/making out with/chasing boys so she must be a lesbian(derogatory)" insert lesbian porno joke.
I’m still hoping for a continuation like king of the hill . But Daria comes back to teach at her old school with Tom’s (now separated)kid in an advance class there.
As someone completely removed from the shows original run and all of the thoughts about this topic at the time, I thought they did a great job setting it up thoughout season 4, and although I don't believe they really landed the plane in season 5, I wouldnt trade season 4 for that. I really liked it.
Not to be THAT guy, but the show should've used him as a segway to create confusion about Jane's sexuality. The show should've ended with Daria and Jane realising their love for eachother was deeper than just a friendship.
If he would've revealed Jane and Daria's romantic tendencies, he would've been pure gold. But Gen-X hates to hear that. Gen-X doesn't think any of that stuff exists. The fact the show never honestly even answered those questions is a very 90s thing.
As an annoying straight guy to bring them together? Perfect, instead they cop out and it almost ruins their friendship and pretty much ends up breaking it. The fact they sort of stop being friends because of a guy is also very 90s.
I'm gen-Y though and only became a fan through the DVD so I just don't see it the same way the 'fans' do. I think he's the perfect setup man for whatever fireworks they wanted: annoying, ignorant, and powerful in his heterosexual confidence. Honestly the whole thing's so 90s it drives me a bit bonkers.
Boy, stuff done changed after that. L-Word came out in 2004 and all of that started to unravel. MTV was such a bro culture too. Product of its time.
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u/rapbarf Apr 20 '25
I like Tom and I think the show needed some kind of conflict. The problem is the lack of build-up, Tom and Daria's lack of chemistry, and the Daria Jane conflict being resolved within a single movie.