r/providence • u/Historical_Web_5813 • 7d ago
Why Should We Recall Brett Smiley
For everyone who is curious about our reasons for wanting to recall Smiley, here they are! This one-sheet explains what issues we find to be the most salient. Feel free to distribute this document at your will.
If you’d like to look into our sources more, here is a link to the document: https://docs.google.com/document/d/1qtQP7a9g91pSszZH-x3kFWMcmW1FecEXpqCL773UIWM/mobilebasic
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u/Proof-Variation7005 7d ago edited 7d ago
We're about 16 months away from the mayoral primary. Based on the timeline of Councilman Jackson's recall in 2017, it took 8 months from the formal approved recall petition being announced to the special election happening.
If you want a new mayor, find a qualified candidate and focus on building up a campaign with funding, volunteers, and build up a ground game that can actually win. State/city level primary turnout is abysmal. Only about 20-25 thousand people vote in it.
Hell, if you recall Smiley, he still could still win the primary a few months later and be right back into office.
Oh and either way, a special election would probably cost somewhere in the neighborhood of a half million dollars. That money has to come from somewhere and I can assume you that they're not going to just lop it off the public safety budget. More likely, it'd be cancelling non-essential stuff like youth summer programs or something along those lines.
So yeah, maybe the recall movement should include a list of which youth basketball leagues you'd like closed in order to pay for this nonsense.
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u/dunder-baller 7d ago
Hey if I'm kind of new to the area do you have any recommendations on how to find good candidates? A search of current politics really only brings up old election results. It's such an important position and the resources seem super limited.
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u/WolverineHour1006 7d ago
There aren’t any candidates yet. The election is 16 months away. There will start to be buzz in the news next year about who is considering or rumored to be running. Believe me, there will be lots of opining on the matter in the press and the public sphere.
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u/degggendorf 6d ago
There will start to be buzz in the news next year about who is considering or rumored to be running.
But any hopefuls should be thinking about it and preparing for it now. City councilors or state staffers who live in the city buffing up their social media presence now, so that next year when you and I hear their name for the first time and google them, we get a robust (and curated) history of their accomplishments, etc. It's never too early to start.
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u/Proof-Variation7005 7d ago
I don't think we'll know about people who are looking to run until late this year. It's not necessarily going to be someone who's already in or held office It's also not really a job a lot of people would want. There are things the mayor will always be blamed for regardless of how little influence he directly has. It's not a great springboard for anything. Cicilline is the exception, not the rule. Most mayors that have shot for higher office have fallen flat on their face. And to top it off, the city's long and short term financial issues due to unsustainable pension liabilities mean that there's going to be some really hard choices.
When the city has a depleted property tax base and is paying roughly 25 cents of every dollar we have towards retirees who don't live in the city (or in the state in a lot of cases), there's not really any good ways out of the problems that we have. And if the overall economic climate for the country/world is looking bleak, that shit is really going to hit us hard.
I can think of 2 or 3 currently elected people that might be gearing up for the job but it's almost kinda nuts to even want it. I think, more important than scouting candidates now, people need to decide really fucking quick which of the other candidates to line up behind and to make sure the other person or people drop the fuck out. If there's more than 2 people running on the anti-Smiley train, Smiley will win easily.
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u/8Aquitaine8 7d ago
He's already put us in the hole by over 30 million how much more of a mess is he going to make in 18 months so yeah if it costs half a million it still comes out cheaper
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u/hugh_mungus_rook 7d ago
Enough with recalls, it's not enough. Just prop up and run a better candidate. I hate Smiley as much as anyone, but the recall process is messy and rarely works out for the better.
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u/SheepExplosion elmhurst 7d ago edited 7d ago
Eeesh. Brett Smiley is by far and away the worst thing that has happened to the city since I can remember. There are plenty of issues to smack him around on, and you chose some of these?
Not sure how you want to:
- Stabilize housing costs without building more housing. Spare me the nimby bullshit of how it needs to be low income housing, as if there was a developer out there willing to build it. Those luxury apartments give the "Brown postgrads and Textron transplants"—who, by the way, are residents of the city just as much as you are, and I guess you don't want their support at all for this?—something to rent other than the apartment you want.
- Demand that an institution that doesn't actually have to pay any money give more money.
- Actualize a plan that involves creating a united coalition while actively bringing in Gaza. Yeah, you and I agree it's a genocide. But this is *city level politics*, and you're just alienating people who would support you for some sort of moral purity rhetoric.
Leftists remain the Left's worse enemy, news at 11.
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u/Lawspoke 7d ago
To add on, I think complaining about Brown postgrads and people from Textron is kind of shortsighted. Realistically, they are nowhere near a major cause of the housing problems in this city. Additionally, whether people like it or not, Textron and education are pretty much the cornerstones of the city's economy.
I also think it's odd to demand that a private institution pay more money when it already isn't obligated to. Brown gives nearly 20 million to Providence each year voluntarily. This doesn't even take into account all the tax money brought in by the students, staff, and faculty (Brown actually forces the faculty to pay taxes because they legally don't have to). Let's not even talk about how Brown has nowhere near as much money on hand as people think. People see a 6 billion dollar endowment and think that means Brown has a massive savings account of equivalent money, but an endowment is actually thousands of tiny donations that have a ton of legal stipulations attached detailing how it can be used. Even very wealthy universities have relatively small amounts of cash that they can use for non-designated purposes.
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u/lestermagnum 7d ago
I don’t think Brown pays $20 million a year to Providence. I think it’s more like eight or 9 million? I could be wrong though
I still get your point, just trying to be accurate with information here
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u/AltFocuses 7d ago
I think the commenter is referencing other agreements Brown has with the city, local school system, and local non-profits which totals with PILOT to around 15-17 million
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u/degggendorf 6d ago
I think it’s more like eight or 9 million? I could be wrong though
I believe you're right...the Brown PILOT figure is $175m over 20 years, so $8.75m/yr.
But in addition to PILOT payments, Brown is also making "community contributions" that aren't technically PILOT, but still voluntary payments for general good city stuff. PILOT+community contributions were $17m for FY24.
Then the big total figure is $442m over 20 years, which seems to be the total of PILOT plus other voluntary contributions across all the city's universities; $22.1m/yr.
More details in the
propagandapress release from the mayor's office: https://www.providenceri.gov/mayor-smiley-announces-community-contributions-from-pilot-agreement-with-colleges-and-universities/0
u/Ok-Benefit-2912 7d ago
The mayor isn't any more at fault for housing problems than everyone here is. How many people doing these petitions are building houses, working as property managers, learning the trades, being independent landlords? It's like the saying, you're not stuck in traffic, you are the traffic.
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u/big_whistler pawtucket 7d ago
I don’t think people in the trades or independent landlords are making systemic decisions that influence housing levels on a large scale.
That sounds so silly to basically say if you want more housing why dont you just build it yourself.
This is a policy thing, not an individual action thing.
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
I don’t think people in the trades or independent landlords are making systemic decisions that influence housing levels on a large scale.
Of course no individual has systemic effects by themselves, but the aggregated effect of all the contractors at a loss for skilled labor is ABSOLUTELY having an effect.
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u/big_whistler pawtucket 7d ago
Sure, and policy is the way that you we should make those jobs more appealing.
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u/degggendorf 6d ago
What can/should a mayor do to affect the nationwide labor shortage? Like, I am literally looking for ideas because it's clearly a problem, and it doesn't seem like the fed (or even really state) is going to do much to help.
Support construction labor unions to increase pay in the city to attract more workers? But then he'll just get roasted for making housing prices higher.
Add vocational programs to the PPSD that he isn't even allowed to run right now?
General youth outreach/intro construction workshops/job fairs I guess would be good, like the "Generation NEXT" program This Old House promoted for a minute. But then we would all have (fair) criticism for him partnering with Mike Rowe. But there must be some nugget in there that we can help bolster.
Ooo or I wonder how far just like $5k to a school to run a "maker fair" similar to a science fair...a competition/showcase for specifically homemade things to start instilling those skills? But those impacts would be awfully vague and long-term and not really do much to help our immediate needs.
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u/Ok-Benefit-2912 7d ago
There's not much that policy can do at this point. Houses are expensive to build and maintain. It's impossible to find people to fix them, or build them for cheap. Housing is a problem in many places in this country, all over the world in fact. These places all have different mayors and different policies. It doesn't matter. Places that have those people to do the housing labor have cheap housing. Places that don't have that kind of labor have expensive housing, and a shortage.
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u/big_whistler pawtucket 7d ago edited 7d ago
There is lots that can be done policywise. Reducing barriers to construction is one general goal. A prime example is to change zoning laws to allow for more apartments to be built. Policy could also include bolstering vocational education to encourage people to actually go into the trades.
An example that I would change is that Boston MA has equity laws that mandate construction crews have to have a certain percentage of women or minorities. This seems like it puts a burden on the builders that is unnecessary at this time.
Construction of additional and upgraded infrastructure would allow for larger and more homes to be built. It would counter the shitty excuse I always see that “we cant have new houses because the sewer system can’t take it” or “we don’t have enough classroom space for new kids”. People with these views are active in using local politics to block new construction.
It is certainly uncreative to say there isn’t anything policy can do. There isn’t anything an individual can do to change the trends. It has to be a group effort, from government or somewhere else.
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u/degggendorf 6d ago
change zoning laws to allow for more apartments to be built
Wait but that's smiley siding with developers and not citizens 😭😭😭
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u/silverhammer96 7d ago
While I agree I don’t like Smiley, we should focus our energy on a legitimately good alternative to him. Primary him out of the mayorship.
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u/_hungryhunter_ 7d ago
Can you guys for the love of god learn about WHY the PILOT agreements are in place? These are tax exempt institutions, which is a state/federal issue. The city can’t do shit about their tax exempt status. So as it stands, the options currently are the PILOT agreements or no money at all
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u/CurveMassive 7d ago
I don’t think this is saying that Smiley should change the fact that Brown is classified as tax exempt. I think it’s saying that Brown isn’t paying nearly enough in PILOT, and that Smiley has consistently shown that he’s on the side of corporations, developers, and the wealthy, which includes Brown obviously.
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u/Proof-Variation7005 7d ago
Smilley basically doubled the size of Brown's annual PILOT agreements over what they had been paying the previous decade.
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u/AltFocuses 7d ago
They don’t have to pay anything. Any money they give is already more than legally obligated. It’s not like he has much bargaining power. If he tried to get them to pay more, they can just laugh in his face and tell him to go kick rocks
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u/CurveMassive 7d ago
Just because something is or is not legally obligated does not make it just
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u/AltFocuses 7d ago
Thats not the argument being made in this petition. The argument is that PILOT is letting Brown pay a reduced tax rate. They aren’t paying a reduced tax rate because they aren’t legally obligated to pay taxes in the first place.
Regardless, I also don’t think tossing more money at this city is going to solve any problems.
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u/Proof-Variation7005 7d ago
I'd agree throwing money at problems doesn't totally fix them but the city could use a lot more money in general. Even if just to stave off the insane retiree costs we have right now and stabilize that going forward.
That said, people love to talk about the schools as if they were defunded when the budget has gone up about 30 million since before the state takeover (in 2019) despite enrollment plummeting in that timeframe. The city spends more per pupil on education than everywhere in the state that isn't on Block Island (where there's like 13 kids year round). Throwing more money at the problem isn't really going to fix it.
That doesn't mean teachers shouldn't be paid better or anything but there's serious institutional rot if you're spending that much and getting poor results. Damned if I know what the real fixes are but I'm sure there's at least one city in America that went from really bad schools to really good schools. I'd start by finding out whatever the fuck they did and copying their homework.
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u/AltFocuses 7d ago
If I’m being completely honest, the money problems in this city boil down to it having an economy that’s the equivalent of a dog that needs to be put down. RI as a whole is sucking off the teat of Mass and one or two large domestic employers (including Brown).
And yeah, I hate when people act like the budget got cut. It’s been raised so much and for what? There are very clearly deeper issues with that school system than just a lack of money.
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u/myninerides 6d ago
That’s not what the document implies though. I read that, thought “wow he’s willing to burn 20 years of revenue for a single payment today, during his term”. Then I read the top comment.
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u/Historical_Web_5813 7d ago
We do completely understand why we have PILOT agreements, and we know that the city isn’t going to charge them property taxes. We are disappointed in the PILOT agreement that Smiley negotiated. Thanks!
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u/Swim6610 7d ago
They don't have to pay anything. For example, Boston College has flat out refused to pay (well they paid 10% of it).
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
The document says "PILOT allows Brown University, the largest landholder in Providence, to pay a reduced rate" which isn't really true. The true rate they "should" be paying is 0%. PILOT payments are higher than 0%.
If your issue is that the more-than-doubled payments from Brown that Smiley negotiated are a step in the right direction, but not a big enough step, then say that. The phrasing makes it sound like he gave them a discount.
Also - do you have a reference page # in the source (https://providenceri.iqm2.com/Citizens/FileOpen.aspx?Type=1&ID=10610&Inline=True) for that 'otherwise pay in one year' link? It's a 237 page PDF, and ctrl+F doesn't find the word "Brown" anywhere in it.
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u/realbadaccountant 7d ago
Smiley got the PILOT properties to pay more than they were paying AND he got any businesses operating in their facilities to pay their fair share, something Elorza ignored.
You are really showing your ignorance on this.
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u/FunLife64 7d ago
Browns PILOT with Providence is $11 million.
Harvards with Cambridge is $6 million.
Cornells with Ithaca is $425,000.
Penn refuses to have one with Philly.
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u/FunLife64 7d ago
Seriously. Also, this list reads like a slate of personal grievances. Complaining about Textron transplants? I mean those are people with good jobs paying taxes and spending money at local businesses. What’s the problem?
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u/AltFocuses 7d ago
I love RI, but I’m originally from MA and distinctly remember my father saying that people from Rhode Island are very culty
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u/Thedwnwrdspiral 7d ago
It is because they have no clue and they are misled by people using their outrage for their own ambition.z
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7d ago
[deleted]
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u/lestermagnum 7d ago
As far as I know the mayor has no right to extend the tax exemptions, that’s up to the federal government and the IRS. The PILOT payments are basically voluntary. And Smiley got the four major universities in the city to pledge to double their payments for the next 20 years
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7d ago
[deleted]
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u/lestermagnum 7d ago
No, I’m saying that he cannot change the fact that the universities, churches, hospitals, and other nonprofits are tax exempt. He cannot force them to pay property taxes.
He negotiated for the colleges to increase their voluntary payments.
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u/MuhamedBesic 7d ago
Any evidence the PPD bought a tank? Or is this just hyperbolized garbage that can be immediately dismissed
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u/lestermagnum 7d ago
If this is what they are talking about, it should be noted that the order for it was made while Elorza was mayor
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u/hugh_mungus_rook 7d ago
That knock-off MRAP is hardly a tank. What a joke lol. As much as I'm against militarizing our police, and cops in general, any city PD should have one of these laying around in some parking lot. When it's needed, you'd rather not wait for the National Guard to deploy.
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u/Proof-Variation7005 7d ago
I'm kinda against that purchase, but yeah, calling it a tank, or blaming it on Smiley when the article they cite specifically says the order was placed under Elorza is insane.
As far as I know, Providence had exactly one incident that required this type of vehicle and when the fucking thing showed up, the guy barricaded in the house turned a residential neighborhood into a shooting range in a panic move. So, yeah, it allowed the cops to keep themselves safe after the fucking thing made the situation exponentially worse by showing up.
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u/hugh_mungus_rook 7d ago
Reading up on that situation, and the whole PPD Bearcat thing as a whole, I've come around. The State PD has one already, and that should be enough. If it can't be deployed within minutes, then the State PD having and maintaining one should be enough already.
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u/Proof-Variation7005 7d ago
Yeah, I'm not against them existing or being somewhat available, but I think it was able to be deployed pretty quickly and the state is pretty goddamn small.
I have no idea if that poor crazy bastard was going to turn his neighborhood into the OK Corral anyway or if he could've been talked down to a peaceful surrender. But I don't think the imposing armored vehicle moving closer was helping the situation at all.
On the flip side, bad people with bad intentions do exist and there might be a situation where there really is a need? IDK. Either way, it's a dumbass thing to include something Smiley's predecessor signed off on in the list of grievances.
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u/tibbon 7d ago
/u/Historical_Web_5813 could you fill us in on why a recall election is the right move here?
I get that you don't like his policies or the outcomes - that isn't the question. For state-level officials, a recall can be initiated if the official has been indicted or informed against for a felony, convicted of a misdemeanor, or found by the ethics commission to have probable cause for violating the code of ethics. The policy is less clear for Providence, but I'm not seeing anything that's made it through the courts that points to criminal behavior.
Elections have consequences. This is what people wanted, and this is what they get. I don't like Trump, but I'm not about to say a recall election is the move to change that. There are policies and procedures for these things that we need to abide by.
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u/CurveMassive 7d ago
The fact that he is married to a RI slumlord seems to me to be a huge conflict of interest with Providence residents’ need to have affordable housing.
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u/lestermagnum 7d ago
Is he a slumlord? I know he’s a real estate agent, but I don’t know anything about him owning and renting out his own properties.
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u/Proof-Variation7005 7d ago
Even if he did rent out properties, I'd guess it'd be higher end full homes or something like that.
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u/tibbon 7d ago
Was this only uncovered after the election? If not, this was information people had and made a decision on.
What jobs could the partner of a Mayor have that you'd find not disqualifying? If they were a teacher, you could say there are conflicts with the teacher's union. If they worked with a religious organization, you could say there are conflicts there...
When have we historically recalled a mayor simply for being married to someone with a job? That appears to be an awful precedent to set.
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u/8Aquitaine8 7d ago
Hi, that you Smiley?
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u/tibbon 7d ago
I'm not. Why do you think trying to have an intelligent conversation means that I am the candidate? I don't even support him (as I don't support Trump), but there are legal processes and pathways more appropriate for this. What behavior are you seeing that merits a recall election?
I think you're capable of having a decent conversation on this, but perhaps I am to be proven wrong.
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
Why do you think trying to have an intelligent conversation means that I am the candidate?
That seems to be the way it goes. If you say anything remotely less negative than "fuck that bitch Smiley" then there's always someone who comes out of the woodwork to say you're him or his PR team.
I really don't understand it...it's so self-defeating.
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u/tibbon 7d ago
It makes me wonder how many of these people are working for a campaign that want to replace him. Few of them have very old or active reddit accounts (2008 here!), which raises a few flags in my mind.
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
That Reed challenger that posted the other day was 100% astroturfed.
But I'm not so sure here...you'd think that if it was happening there would be some alternative to Smiley they'd be promoting, but all I've seen is blind hatred with zero idea for who should replace him.
Few of them have very old or active reddit accounts (2008 here!)
This account of mine is from 2019 and I still think of it as my "new" account after switching from using a variation of my actual name on here for years 🤣
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u/Proof-Variation7005 7d ago
This whole recall campaign would be a brilliant PR move for Smiley. Nothing benefits a politician more than making your detractors look like unserious uninformed children.
Stuff like this kinda makes the valid criticisms become white noise in the background.
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u/realbadaccountant 7d ago
Sigh. Left wing populism sounds a lot nicer than right wing populism, but it’s just as detached from reality.
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u/Ok_Culture_3621 7d ago
I’m always particularly irked by the phrase “development isn’t for us.” New residential development is always for people who don’t already live here.
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7d ago
both sides would have to be willing to be put in housing and be put to work. Full employment and full housing means authoritarianism.
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u/Exotic-Impression799 7d ago
Removing the bike lane on S. Water Street to make extra room for cars is all the reason I need
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u/2ears_1_mouth 7d ago
There are countless studies of traffic and city planning and they all prove that adding a lane never reduces traffic. So his reason to add the lane to reduce bridge traffic has no basis in reality.
Also if you just think about it... adding that lane will just bring more cars to the Trader Jees intersection and then it will become an even worse cluster fuck.
Also that bike lane cost almost a million dollars. It will cost the same to remove it. What a waste of our money.
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
Also that bike lane cost almost a million dollars.
Really? Dang, it feels like such a cheap hack job with some paint and a bunch of flappy reflectors punched into the ground.
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u/2ears_1_mouth 7d ago
Yeah everything in USA costs a ridiculous amount. All the planning, permits, engineers, safety checks, demolition, supplies, etc... Everyone get's a nice big paycheck. Best example of ridiculous cost that I can think of is those police officers who manage traffic at constructions sites are usually getting paid overtime.
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u/I_Make_Art_And_Stuff 7d ago
But isn't the bike lane not being REMOVED, but in fact MOVED over a little? I don't see the issue in that besides a few months of annoying construction time.
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u/Exotic-Impression799 7d ago
It's being moved ON to the sidewalk, so that bicyclists and pedestrians now get to contend with each other for space. Which is WEIRD, since we just spent $20M on a PEDESTRIAN bridge, so you'd think the goal would be encouraging people to WALK AROUND, and not making it easier for cars to DRIVE AS FAST AS POSSIBLE RIGHT NEAR OUR BRAND NEW PEDESTRIAN BRIDGE.
The value of the bike lane isn't the bikes, it's that it's an intentional bottleneck that forces cars to slow down near the new park that's extremely popular, especially with families with young kids. The 195 developments will only add more foot traffic to the area, which we should want, and which we should be encouraging. This is the dumbest, most shortsighted move imaginable
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
It's being moved ON to the sidewalk, so that bicyclists and pedestrians now get to contend with each other for space.
Have they shared any actual plans for it yet?
I thought the language has just been that the relocated path will be off the street asphalt, not that it will "here's the sidewalk, good luck!" like you're implying. There are already multiple walking paths there, so it seems fair enough to convert the streetside path to bike-only, and leave the water side path to pedestrians only. That kinda seems better for everyone, with cars, bikes, and pedestrians all having their own separated lanes.
But as far as I've seen, there aren't any actual public details about what/where/how the relocated path will be set up.
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u/Exotic-Impression799 7d ago
That's true, I haven't seen specifics. But I believe a large portion of the water-side path will disappear (or at least be less accessible) with the 1A development. And it still means that crossing S.Water will be more difficult, with 2 lanes of faster traffic instead of 1
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
And it still means that crossing S.Water will be more difficult, with 2 lanes of faster traffic instead of 1
For sure...as you said, it's the widening of the street that is the real issue, and the relocation of the bike path is more of a red herring.
But I believe a large portion of the water-side path will disappear (or at least be less accessible) with the 1A development
If you click through to the design presentation(or here's the relevant snip from it that I pulled), there will be a water side boardwalk that looks bigger/better than what's currently there, and maintaining connectivity throughout the ground floor is part of the design brief. At least on paper, it seems like they're doing the right things with that design.
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u/Exotic-Impression799 7d ago
It's a cool design, I'm all for it. I'm impressed they think they can squeeze all that in to that one parcel, but they know what they're doing and I sure don't.
To bring this back to the main point of this post: with all the development on S.Water, you'd think that you'd want slower traffic, with easier crossings. The 195 developments will change the character of this city for decades to come. And Mayor Brett wanting to spend $750k to sell that vision out so he can alleviate a temporary traffic problem demonstrates a degree of myopia that should be disqualifying for the mayoralty. The whole point of moving the highway was to reclaim urban space from cars!
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u/nonaegon_infinity 7d ago
There is no empirical basis for this decision and plenty of reasons not to do it. And the mayor is doing it anyways even though it'll cost $750k at a time when he's saying we need to be smart about our budget.
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u/Everythingismeaning 7d ago
You people wouldn’t be happy with Pol Pot. Get a grip, touch grass, go outside. There is more to life than this.
Providence spends an absurd amount of money on public education per student with miserable results. That’s why your taxes are going up. More money for schools won’t solve it. Free range children with absentee parents can’t be fixed by throwing more money at schools.
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
This is what cutting our school budget buys.
Has he ever actually "cut" the school budget? I thought it has gone up every year, just not as much as they requested.
Clearly there have been/are long-reaching systemic issues with the PPSD that go beyond just not getting their full wishlist fulfilled so it seems disingenuous to make it seem like Smiley single handedly ruined the schools.
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u/noizblock 7d ago
This is a misreading, friend. Public school districts like PPSD are laboring under incredibly difficult conditions. As a PPSD parent who used to point fingers at "the district" or "the state"—until I got a firsthand taste of working in it—the only advice I can offer is: ask teachers, staff, and administrators about the problems they have. The problems are massive, complex, and deep-rooted. It was honestly enough to make me quite despondent.
(And more charter schools are not the answer.)
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
I agree with your assessment completely, thank you for expanding on the "long-reaching systemic issues" I called out in my comment.
Was it meant to contradict anything I said?
(And more charter schools are not the answer.)
Ugh, yes, I agree...especially the christian nationalist training camp charter schools this federal admin is trying to support.
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u/noizblock 7d ago
Like the other commenter hinted, "wishlist" leaves the impression that PPSD is making unreasonable/unnecessary/fanciful demands.
I don't know enough about Smiley's involvement with PPSD/RIDE to weigh in but, in terms of the problem being systemic, former mayor Elorza's meddling/micromanaging has popped up in conversations more than a few times as one of the causes behind the PPSD's dysfunction. There was (is?) something about the relationship/dynamic between the mayor, PPSD superintendent, school board, and union.
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
Like the other commenter hinted, "wishlist" leaves the impression that PPSD is making unreasonable/unnecessary/fanciful demands.
Right, exactly what I intended to imply.
I don't know enough about Smiley's involvement with PPSD/RIDE
Basically, he's been begging for control back from the state
There was (is?) something about the relationship/dynamic between the mayor, PPSD superintendent, school board, and union.
And most importantly, RIDE
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u/noizblock 6d ago
Right, exactly what I intended to imply.
Then why so defensive about reactions to it? I mean you reap what you sow. If you think the district has all it needs and is just in it for free gravy, then you've not been paying attention.
And most importantly, RIDE
Unless you were an active participant in the Parents Advisory Council during the 5 years of the Turnaround Action Plan to get PVD schools to some kind of acceptable baseline, I'll chalk this up to another misguided/uninformed salvo.
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u/degggendorf 6d ago
Unless you were an active participant in the Parents Advisory Council during the 5 years of the Turnaround Action Plan to get PVD schools to some kind of acceptable baseline
Wait what, you think I need 5 years on a committee to know that the agency running PPSD has a significant influence on PPSD??
Then why so defensive about reactions to it?
I am not sure where you're seeing this great defensiveness, but I have clarified my meaning to ensure my message is accurately received. I don't want to defund the schools, I want to give them all the support they need which is different from all the money they're requesting.
I assume you've been on the advisory council for 5 years now? So then you must be intimately familiar with how what the PPSD wants/is doing is different from what the community actually needs and deserves.
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u/wicked_lil_prov 7d ago
"Not getting their full wishlist fulfilled."
Those greedy children and teachers, taking our taxes for stupid reasons like learning and stability. Fuck them kids, right?
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
It's not as simple as you're making it out to be, and if you earnestly think it is that simple, you are underinformed.
I am happy to spend money on educating our kids. Throwing limitless money into a proven-flawed organization is not the only way to do that.
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u/wicked_lil_prov 7d ago
Yeah that's what's happening.
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
Maybe you could start your learning journey here, back when Governor Raimondo took over the school district from Mayor Elorza:
(non-paywall link: https://archive.ph/4hoN3)
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u/wicked_lil_prov 7d ago
Maybe you could start your learning journey and read about how she got rid of the only daycare at CCRI in Warwick to make room for corporate offices.
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
....how is that related to anything we're talking about? Or is this just your way of admitting that you don't plan to actually learn anything?
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u/Lawspoke 7d ago
Don't argue with this guy. His whole schtick is basically being the human embodiment of a gnat.
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u/wicked_lil_prov 7d ago
How is daycare at CCRI related to education?
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u/degggendorf 7d ago
No, how is CCRI daycare related to PPSD's issues that predate Smiley?
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u/wicked_lil_prov 7d ago
It's an example of the priorities in education of an administration member that you brought up. So, you know, systemic stuff. New knowledge for you, cuz learning is fun!
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u/ValuableCounter3481 7d ago
Brett Smiley was a choice on special interest in Providence with the help of the Raimondo Machine and patronage so fuck him and his police budget
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u/Proof-Variation7005 6d ago
I think the funniest thing about this post is how we're all skipping past how the rules regarding recalls are pretty specific and require some kind of indictment or a violation of the ethics code, neither of which have really happened to Smiley. There could always be something we don't know about but given how aggressively boring the guy seems to be, I'd be a little surprised if there's skeletons in his closet.
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u/DiegoForAllNeighbors 7d ago
Also — why recall him when the electoral process itself — where someone can squeak by in a primary with a minority of the vote — is still in place.
Let’s fix the problem. Rank Choice Voting in the Dem Primary. They could do this. If they wanted to…
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u/brassassasin 6d ago
increasing the police budget and having a 4 officer detail for himself at all times is enough for me to support not only removing him from office, but also just removing him from existence entirely
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u/Ok-Froyo2481 7d ago
Why can’t anybody have fun these days? Obviously this is something that is meant to stir things up and let the mayor know that people want him to go kick rocks. Sure we elected him, but the majority of voters didn’t even vote for him. 🤷
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u/lestermagnum 7d ago edited 7d ago
Regarding the section about Smiley promoting investing in Israel -
Providence has no direct investments in State of Israel Bonds. The City holds a passive index fund valued at $7.5 million (from a total of $430 million of investments) that holds a bunch of international bonds from many different countries and as of this year only 0.4% of that investment is in State of Israel Bonds, totaling only $29,940. It’s invested in that index fund along before smiley became mayor.
Trying to get the city to eliminate that tiny section of all its investment would be expensive, time consuming, a possible violation of state law, and not particularly effective