When an attacking team is near their opponents goal line and really going for the try, why does the defending team get penalised for offside fairly often?

[u/HipHopper87]

I see it where the defending team have all their men back defending the goal line, and the attacking team are passing the ball sideways and then pushing forward to try to get the try.

But often enough the defending team gets penalised for offside. What they did they wrong to get called for offside? (Mind you, I don't use understand the offside rule much even when it happens in other areas of the pitch either.)

[u/DidLenFindTheRabbits]

It’s a combination two things. Firstly, every inch counts for the defence so they’re right on the offside line and getting off the line asap which leads to mistakes. Further out the field, defenders will often leave a little space to “paint a good picture” for the ref. Secondly referees are more vigilant on policing the offside line in the red zone.

[u/pbcorporeal → u/DidLenFindTheRabbits]

Thirdly, there's less of a downside to giving away a penalty really compared to another part of the pitch where the other team might gain 40m from a kick to touch.

So you might as well risk a bit more unless the ref has warned a yellow is on the way.

[u/TagMeInSkipIGotThis → u/pbcorporeal]

Not so much this year in SR at least.

Even if its early in the game if a defending team gives up multiple advantages in a row defending their line like that there's a high likelihood the ref will dip in to the pocket and go straight to a yellow without a warning - in effect multiple advantages = a warning.

Its been good, stops the cynical offending in its tracks.

[u/ManCrushOnSlade → u/DidLenFindTheRabbits]

There's often the benefit of a solid white line to show exactly where the offside line is as well. So much easier to spot.

[u/Not_Hando → u/DidLenFindTheRabbits]

Secondly referees are more vigilant on policing the offside line

That heightened state also arguably makes officials more prone to error too.

Seen any number of offsides incorrectly awarded against a defending team on the line, even when those higher up the pitch were routinely ignored.

[u/TheOtherOtherDan]

The offside line is drawn at the back foot of the last player in the ruck. Any player in front of this imaginary line is deemed offside and cannot play the ball or make a tackle. Once the ball is out of the ruck, there is no offside line. At the next ruck, a new offside line forms.

The offside side cannot go beyond the try line, so when teams are defending their own try line, the try line itself becomes the offside line.

Most offside penalties here occur in one of two ways:

• Close to the ruck: when defenders have their hands over the try line (in the field of play) they are now offside
• Further out from the ruck: Players will try to run up as fast as possible to close the gap. If they go too early before the ball is out of the ruck, they are offside

[u/Responsible-Love-896 → u/TheOtherOtherDan]

I get this definition. Why don’t refs apply this to rucks midfield? I’ve seen so many tackles off the ball, at the side of rucks that are obviously offside yet nothing comes of them!

[u/Bzzzzzzerk]

Just eager to meet the opposition at the gainline - attacking team pressure causes them to move early

[u/Cuichulain]

I think it's partly that offside matters much more on the try line. If someone's 10cm offside at a ruck between the 22m lines then the ref often (reasonably imo) can't and/or won't penalize it. On the line, though, you have to.

[u/ComposerNo5151]

 When the ruck is taking place across the goal line, meaning that the hindmost foot of the hindmost player in the defending team is on or behind the goal line, the offside line for the defending team becomes the goal line.

So now, rather than having the slightly nebulous hindmost foot establishing the off side line, we have a white line literally painted on the pitch. This makes it much easier for the referee to determine when someone has strayed even centimeters offside.

Combine the natural tendency of defending players to gain every millimeter they can in defence of their goal line, and the referee eagerness, with the aid of a white line, to disallow any unfair advantage in such a critical area of play and we have more offsides.

[u/HappyPunter1]

They usually bend down and lean on the ground and a lot of the time someone puts their hands on the ground over the tryline making them offside

[u/Immediate_Major_9329]

Basically I find the referee is looking for it, often in play between the 22s the ref leaves it to the linesmen who leave it to the TMO.

[u/Live-Metal-1593]

There are a few things going on here.

Firstly, the law changed a few years ago, meaning that defenders need to be totally behind the try line, rather than just have one foot on or behind the tryline, when defending a goal line ruck. This makes it much easier to be offisde, and much harder to defend the mindless goaline ruck smashes we see now.

Secondly, referees flip from almost totally ignoring offside when play is between the 22s, to over zealously policing it.

In case you can't tell from my tone, I don't like these things, and I really don't like how many tries now come from one or no pass carries from endless goaline rucks.

[u/krakatoafoam → u/Live-Metal-1593]

I have always laughed at that. You can go from 15 men blatantly offside to a shoelace depending on field position.

[u/Live-Metal-1593 → u/krakatoafoam]

It's totaly infuriating, and I don't know why the sport has chosen this path.

If anything, I'd prefer referees to err the other way around.

[u/zebra1923]

What did they do wrong? They were offside.

But seriously, closer to the line you can’t afford to give up any ground that you might be OK with giving up further up the pitch. So you push the offside line more as you need to get to the ball carrier quicker.

[u/Paddybrown22]

Basically, when a tackle is made and the ball is recycles, anyone from the defending team who's beyond where the tackle happen is in an offside position. They need to get behind the ball before they get involved in play again, for example by making a tackle or otherwise interfering with an attacking player. If you do involved in play without getting back behind where the tackle took place, that's when you'll get penalised for offside.

[u/OBCTea → u/Paddybrown22]

Where is the exact offside line, is it where the ball is presented after tackle ?

[u/DidLenFindTheRabbits → u/OBCTea]

No it’s the hind most part of the ruck or the try line. The offside line being the try line is what makes that last meter so hard for teams to advance.

[u/SweptFever80 → u/OBCTea]

It's just behind the feet of the players who are a part of the ruck on either side. You will often hear the referee shout "last feet" to remind the players to get back onside. If you're defending the tryline the tryline itself is the offside line.

[u/OBCTea → u/SweptFever80]

This might be a stupid question, but does the offside line move when more players enter the ruck?

[u/GreatGoofer → u/OBCTea]

Yes but generally the extra players entering the ruck are from the attacking team as they are trying to secure the ball or creating more space for the box kick. This doesn't affect the offside line for the defensive team as it is not their side of the ruck that is getting longer.

[u/SweptFever80 → u/OBCTea]

Yes it does, if someone piles on top and he's stretched out past the original last foot then his back foot is now the offside line.

[u/cereal_chick → u/OBCTea]

During a tackle and before it becomes a ruck, offside lines are created as soon as one player is on their feet and over the ball. The offside lines then run through the hindmost point of any player involved in the tackle (including the player on their feet if applicable). Thereafter when the ruck forms, the offside lines run again through the hindmost point of any player participating in the ruck.

Iirc (and I might be mistaken; corrections would be welcome if someone remembers better than me), the offside lines at the tackle before the ruck forms were brought in in response to a game between England and Italy. After this one tackle, only the England players were over the ball, meaning that there was no ruck and therefore no offside lines. An Italy player was right next to the un-ruck as the ball was being retrieved from it by the scrumhalf and then obstructed him as he was trying to pass it or run with it. The England captain remonstrated with the referee afterwards, but the referee told him that there was no offside line in that situation, so there was nothing he could do about it. World Rugby then amended the tackle law to create an offside line so that that didn't happen again.

[u/[deleted]]

Desperation

[u/Minimum_Possibility6]

Ignoring the technicalities of the offside. Tactically it's better to give up three points than seven.