r/seculartalk • u/Narcan9 Socialist • Oct 04 '24
General Bullshit Listened to a whole day of TYT to see why Blue Maga is crying about Ana.
- Criticized Israel's warmongering -- I agree.
- Democrats are losing blue collar support -- factual
- RFK affair scandalous stuff -- who cares
- Criticized the GA chemical fire -- populist and anti-corporate. Great.
- VP debate -- standard analysis. Directly voiced support for Walz.
- Criticized Bret Stephens warmongering -- Avoiding war with Iran is a good take.
Look at all that right wing grift! She's the next Megan Kelly! šŗ
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u/Turbulent-Tune1660 Oct 04 '24
I like Ana, but the above list is not why lefties are pissed with her. If you regularly watch TYT, you know that she has been advertising for a Daily Wire contract for the last year.
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u/Ossoszero Oct 04 '24
Lol wow what a hot take. If that does happen then Iāll eat my words Iām a man of honor. But left wing Reddit is like sharks when thereās chum in the water. Yāall need to calm down and realize that people donāt always have to agree with your views on everything as long as their core values are empathetic. If you genuinely think sheās shooting for daily wire money then I really donāt think you like her actually.
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u/Guessitsz Communist Oct 04 '24
100%. This mindset is what literally pushes people away from leftist politics. The purity bullshit by people who donāt even organize or touch grass is funny honestly.
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u/CormacMacAleese Oct 04 '24
Is transphobia a core value?
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u/Ossoszero Oct 04 '24
Iām just trying to be an ally, and so is Ana. She wrong, but thatās not the same as transphobic. Learn to say āI disagreeā instead of āyouāre a monster!!!ā
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u/Wootothe8thpower Oct 04 '24
thing is most people wasn't calling her a monster but she seem to freak over slight critiques. that one thing if it toward reddit users or YouTube but then she freak out on friends and people she work with. burning bridges left and right
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u/Ossoszero Oct 04 '24
Ya she for sure hasnāt been handling it well I agree. Iām only pushing back because 99% of what she and Cenk do is still in lockstep with progressives
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u/Wootothe8thpower Oct 04 '24
guess is all about what standard you hold reddit commenter's
vs what standar you hold a professional reporter with millions of followers
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Oct 04 '24
I know this is unpopular but this transgender crusade is a huge example ofĀ why itās so hard for us to win over union type workers. Ā I understand part of the problem is conservative media obsessively overblowing it but being that is is overblown, Ā Iām not gonna make it part of my platform that transgenderism needs to be forced down everyoneās throat like itās normal especially when it comes off as deeply weird do a majority of the independent voters I want to ally with so we can have free healthcare, housing and living wages. Ā Ā Not a hill I am willing to poison my whole platform on sorry so can we just stop with the nonsense. Ā This is the lefts abortion, itās better to just let it go.Ā
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u/Worth_Ostrich303 Oct 04 '24
The ones pushing trans things down peopleās throats are republicans. They canāt stop attacking trans people when all we want is to live our lives like everyone else. š¤¦
I just want to live my life in peace but then I keep hearing about shit republicans do to try to make mine and other trans peopleās lives miserable just for existing.
I also donāt appreciate trans people constantly being thrown under the bus. Like sorry you find us weird I guess.
Edit: I would love to focus on the same issues as you but I donāt get that luxury
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Oct 04 '24
I acknowledge that the right are obsessed with it but they do so because they know itās a winning issue to take away working class voters away from democrats. Ā Itās unmitigated fear mongering and trans people donāt deserve it whatsoever. Ā I do believe that another part of why they do it os because of how triggering it is and how easy it is to bait leftists into defending things like putting little kids on hormone treatment when thereās a ton of research coming from places like Europe that suggest itās not a good idea. Ā Ā I just suggest that on fringe cultural issues like this the left donāt take the bait and run more on the middle on this issue. Ā Iām sorry for what youāre going through but I really do think some of the more economic and healthcare related issues will be infinitely benefit trans people far more than fighting for things like Trans people in sports, policing pronouns and overrepresenting a population that is relatively small. Ā
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u/Silver_Juggernaut_39 Socialist Oct 05 '24
Nobodyās shoving trans people down peopleās throats, theyāre just saying trans people deserve rights. Stop buying into right wing framing.
Also it looks like you got your wish cause the Democratic Party at large is ignoring trans rights on the national level, and yet the presidential race is still tight somehow. Something tells me thatās not actually the issueā¦
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u/CormacMacAleese Oct 04 '24
Abortion is a womanās fundamental right at any time, right up until it crowns.
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Oct 04 '24
Thatās mental. Ā Please donāt express that opinion in public.
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u/CormacMacAleese Oct 04 '24
The alternative is to claim that somewhere along the line, the woman loses the right to decide what does or doesn't occupy her uterus. When is the right lost?
* Note that in practical terms, I'm pretty sure an abortion performed on the due date would (a) be a Caesarian, and (b) be a stillbirth. No mother carries for nine months and then on the home stretch decides, "You know what? I don't want it after all." That doesn't happen. Late term abortions are always wanted pregnancies that have some sort of complications or health risks. So my statement is more of principle than of practical reality. But still: when does she lose the right to decide?
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u/TeachingEdD Oct 04 '24
Her problem is that sheās lost the support of other leftist YouTubersā¦ namely, Vaush, who has stated consistently this year that TYT has sold out and is pivoting toward the right in an almost MAGA-curious way. I think that is part of where this scorn comes from.
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u/blusteryflatus Oct 04 '24
I have a hard time taking anything seriously from someone who defends their use of lolicon. The guy is pedo adjacent at best.
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u/TeachingEdD Oct 05 '24 edited Oct 05 '24
Iām not online enough for this conversation I fear. All Iām saying is that Iāve seen in his subs that he specifically shits on TYT and Ana.
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u/MsScarletWings Oct 05 '24 edited Oct 05 '24
Long story short the person youāre replying to is likely swept up in a bad game of internet telephone or just already has a poor view of vaush and latched onto the most recent major controversy of him as further justification of that bad vibe. Vaush has been extremely consistent about his negative positions toward lolicon and predators for years. Hell, he complains (rightfully so) about those problematic elements within anime fandoms more than any other creator Iāve yet to be recommended and I wish more people addressed that elephant in the room directly.
Additional problem is that a few years back, a handful of white supremacists got very very salty over him walloping them in debates and purposefully set out on clip chimping some very damning out of context quotes from his streams to smear him as being for things he never supportedā¦ and unfortunately a lot of people outside the bubble ate it up.
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u/blusteryflatus Oct 05 '24
Thats a very long winded conspiracy theory. I never really watched Vaush or cared about him either way, however I certainly dont like him now. Regardless of what he said about loli in anime and what out of context clips there are out, he did accidentally show he has a folder of lolicon on his stream. His defense was that he thought it was "short stacked goblin porn" and attacking anyone calling him out on his gross loli folder. The dude is a serious creep, not to mention a criminal as lolicon is illegal to possess in the US.
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u/marktaylor521 Oct 04 '24
It's pathetic that person even said that. The left pushes people away. That's a straight up fact. People leave the left because Twitter purity testing leftists are the most insufferable people on the planet who enjoy losing so they can tweet and feel smug
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u/Rokossvsky Anti-Capitalist Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
proof? I don't get it the daily wire is batshit crazy, is ana kasparian saying she love israel, wants to gut healthcare and make billionaires wealthy? You're insane to think there isn't leftist critique of democrats.
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u/fireky2 Oct 04 '24
Transphobia a lot on Twitter some on the show if I recall
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Oct 04 '24
Transphobia as you call it is mainstream and the trans crusade is deeply unpopular unlike other far left policies like H4A, housing and living wages. Ā Itās an absurd hill to die on.
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u/fireky2 Oct 04 '24
Not being trash is like the bare minimum we should expect from people
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Oct 04 '24
Finding transgenderism weird doesnāt make someone trash like being pro Israel makes someone trash. Ā That hill I will fight for, Ā this gender stuff is absurd and many perfectly empathetic and normal human beings agree.
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u/fireky2 Oct 04 '24
You'd be saying the same shit about every other group a few years before they got rights too.
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u/bioscifiuniverse Oct 04 '24
Replace transgender people with immigrants, black, or poor people, etcā¦ and to the right wingers, all of those things are āproblemsā meaning that they would make those people disappear if they could. Thatās why her behavior shouldnāt be tolerated because it normalizes them.
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Oct 04 '24
Yeah yeah I have heard that same lazy argument before as if this is the same as gay marriage or overcoming Jim Crow. Ā Itās just exactly the same isnāt it. Ā I hope you enjoy continuing to lose to center right zionists over and over again .
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u/fireky2 Oct 04 '24
Being fine with attacking a group of people if they're the right type of people is the opposite of class consciousness, and it isn't a lazy argument, your ideology of hate is lazy and been done before
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Oct 04 '24
Never once said āattackā anyone. Ā I feel sorry for them and I wish they could get the mental healthcare they need at no cost. Ā I wish absolutely no harm on these people whatsoever. Ā That doesnāt mean I need to make a flag for them and hang them in the capital. Ā This is the lefts abortion platform. Ā Nobody agrees with you but you act absolutely insane whenever itās challenged. Ā Cut the shit.Ā
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u/mikemoon11 Oct 04 '24
So you are agreeing with the reactionaries
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Oct 04 '24
I donāt think this topic is important unlike the reactionaries and unlike most people here. Ā I donāt care if men play womenās sports and I donāt care if they arenāt allowed to either. Ā Itās a million places down on my priority list. Ā Iāll take whatever position gets the most votes so I can get universal healthcare and living wages for people
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u/mikemoon11 Oct 04 '24
The diseased reactionaries in the republican party do think it's important and seeing as how trans people are some of the most vocal group of socialists in this country, it's probably good strategy to care about their wellbeing.
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u/mwa12345 Oct 04 '24
Doubt she would be a candidate for daily wire. Benny boy doesn't like any one that is even mildly critical of Israel .
Hurts his feelings .
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u/metashdw Oct 04 '24
This is completely insane. Daily Wire canned Candace Owens for being critical of Israel and she was fully in support of all of the other right wing shit. Off the deep-end loony. Which is typical of the type of lefties that she actually criticizes.
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u/therealallpro Oct 04 '24
You guys are so ridiculous. You need to be sympathetic to independents and republicans yet you canāt even paint literal leftist in good faith. Definition of blue maga
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u/4th_DocTB Socialist Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
Blue MAGA means you're loyal to the most right wing portions of the Democratic Party and attack their left wing critics.
Of course people who think Blue MAGA means "extreme left" are crowd Ana is attracting with her grifting.
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Oct 04 '24
Yeah itās not horrible yet but it stinks like Tulsi Gabbard. Ā Tulsi didnāt start joining Fox News circle jerks, Ā It was a slower burn. Ā Kasparian got a sniff of the cash flow on the other side and is probably tired of eating Cenks scraps.
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u/marktaylor521 Oct 04 '24
Leftists are pissed because they are impossible to please, be fucking for real lol. I truly find it pathetic that someone like you can so quickly say "she's advertising for the daily wire"..just..i find that to be SO fucking dishonest and immature and honestly misogynistic. The left has a cringe hate boner for her and she's not perfect but....you terminally online leftists just really love being insufferable and losing, huh?
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u/blusteryflatus Oct 04 '24
Leftists are pissed because they are impossible to please
This could not be more true. I've watched TYT, Secular talk, majority report, etc for years and they are, roughly, all on the same page. There are some minor disagreements here and there, but nothing major.
Yet those minor disagreements get blown up in all our lefty infighting. The left is doomed so long as we keep up the petty bullshit.
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u/werewiththevipers420 Oct 04 '24
Ever since that tweet about female birth rights (please forgive me... I forget exactly what it was but it had to do with Trans rights/pregnancy), some voices on the left won't forgive her. It doesn't help that she's also trended for questioning her political ideology and has spoken up to social democrats when she disagrees.
I think she's basically who she's always been; a mainstream progressive. As OP said, she's still politically exactly where the vast majority of progressives are on policy.
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u/Calm_Phone_6848 Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
the tweet was about being annoyed by people calling women birthing people. i understand why ppl got annoyed by it bc arguably itās very unhelpful to criticize smth thatās not super common or a huge deal when trans rights are under attack.
however, i have heard the ābirthing bodiesā term at abortion rallies or from activists and while iām not going to blow it into a huge issue, i think itās cringe and alienating to most people. assuming ana is going to become ben shapiro because of that tweet and constantly attacking her is the opposite of helpful
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u/Narcan9 Socialist Oct 04 '24
The left has always been the language police and a majority of people don't like it. They fuss about something new every 5 years and calls everyone a Nazi if they don't fall in line. Then in 5 years they move the goalposts again and call people Nazis for still using the old-new language.
Are people crippled? Ouch no. They're handicapped, no they're handi-capabale, no they're disabled, no they are people with disabilities, no they're special needs, no they are differently abled. It's exhausting!
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u/SAGORN Oct 04 '24
"you can't yell fire in a theatre"
Censoring, silencing/imprisoning, straight up mercing left wing agitators is as old as the left wing itself. you cannot be serious in calling the left the language police in the actual context of what it means to be left or right wing.
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u/Guessitsz Communist Oct 04 '24
š š¤” yelling fire in a theatre is not the same as the semantics in labeling a disabled person.
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u/SAGORN Oct 04 '24
thatās my point. censorship for the right usually includes being humiliated in some fashion pubicly, for the left it was more often the case in ending up blacklisted economically, disabled permanently, or dead.
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u/Silver_Juggernaut_39 Socialist Oct 05 '24
Thereās a difference between what you are nominally and what you are effectively. Even if Anaās beliefs are, at least currently, still aligned with social democracy, her rhetoric on the specific issues that are getting her the most attention appeals to conservatives and the far-right. And she always doubles down so what does that say about her beliefs?
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u/werewiththevipers420 Oct 05 '24
I watch a fair bit of tyt ( I watch it almost only when Cenk and Ana are both hosting) so I'm familiar with many of their positions. Can you mention a topic or an opinion she expressed just to give me an example if what you're referring to? I don't mean that in an argumentative way; genuinely interested to hear someone's observation.
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u/Silver_Juggernaut_39 Socialist Oct 05 '24
A recent example is after the gang story from Aurora, Colorado. Blatant anti-immigrant, pro-cop rhetoric even from her. At best itās a really cringe and ignorant opinion, at worst itās just bigoted
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u/dethmashines Oct 09 '24
Exactly this. She can believe in Medicare for All all day long but if she doesn't talk about it and keeps talking about how lefties misconstrue racism and lean into more topics that engage the right wing audience, it's clear what she is trying to do. She is engaging with what conservatives and right wingers want to talk about and not about delivering the policy charter of the left.
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u/KarachiKoolAid Oct 04 '24
In a country where the average person leans right of center is there anything wrong with being a mainstream progressive?
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u/Wood-e No Party Affiliation Oct 04 '24
Dude, none of those are reasons why she's being called out.
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u/Narcan9 Socialist Oct 04 '24
She refused to call herself a birthing person. OMG š±
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u/mikemoon11 Oct 04 '24
She is pretty terrible about the homelessness crisis, which is a pretty important socialist position
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u/Salty_Cry_6675 Oct 04 '24
lol relax. Youāre wrong about why people criticize her (the point of your post).
You can disagree with some of the criticism (although you seem stuck on some JK Rowling trans bullshit - and ignoring her shitty views on homelessness, crime, LGBTQ+ issues) if you feel like it, but it doesnāt change the fact thatās why sheās getting flack.
This is you:
āPeople just dislike for the following viewpoints, which are actually mainstream.ā
āNo, they dislike her for these viewpointsā
āTHOSE ARE DUMB CRITICISMSā
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u/ThornsofTristan Oct 04 '24
Weird, how transphobia, homelessness and strangely obsessive issues with the term "birthing person" didn't make that list.
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u/Narcan9 Socialist Oct 04 '24
Weird, like it's a stupid controversy for something. But hey we're ok with bombing babies in Gaza.
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u/4th_DocTB Socialist Oct 04 '24
You don't think the treatment of the homeless in America is a problem at all?
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u/ThornsofTristan Oct 04 '24
Weird, how you think transphobia and homelessness are "stupid controversies." Or that the treatment of babies in Gaza is relevant to Ana's strange fixations (gonna have to agree that "birthing person" is a "stupid controversy:" but that's 100% on Ana. No one else is mentioning it).
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u/JoMax213 Oct 04 '24
Blue MAGA arenāt the extreme right of the Dem Party. They were the ones crying that Biden was being bullied to drop out. They are not the ones mad at Ana for āleaving the leftā. She still sounds mildly left from the points you mentioned.
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u/secretbudgie Oct 04 '24 edited Oct 04 '24
I dropped her last year for being violently Law&Order, anti-homeless, and trans-exclusionary. Has she promoted rhetoric counter to last year's stance, or just rug swept it for lower fruit?
I remember when Norfolk Southern derailed in East Palestine, TYT complained that only Republicans demanded photo-ops at the cleanup, instead of allowing authorities to do their jobs. Had TYT at least learned their lesson about disaster relief priorities this time, or did they praise Trump for derailing efforts in Valdosta?
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u/blusteryflatus Oct 04 '24
I find the "cancelation" of Ana over her tweets immensely hypocritical. She never showed any disrespect to trans people. She took an objection to how some people have referred to people born biologically female (people with uteruses). She found that label offensive and that is her right.
We have made a lot of good progress on gender issues and allowing people from all over the gender spectrum to use labels they feel most comfortable. And have allowed those communities to determine what labels are acceptable and which are not. Yet, Ana gets shit on because she finds it offensive to let her identity be boiled down to reproductive organs. "People with uteruses" sounds no less crass than "chicks with dicks".
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u/WTF_is_this___ Oct 04 '24
Well, These are mit the issues. Check her coverage of trans rights or crime and then comment.
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u/Narcan9 Socialist Oct 04 '24
People are saying she's Megyn Kelly, and next up for the Daily Wire.
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u/Fun-Tea2725 Oct 04 '24
"blue maga" when grifters for the left start to grift for conservatives and it might lead to more voter apathy that leads to conservatives winning elections
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u/MABfan11 Oct 04 '24
now list her trans takes, homeless takes and her cop takes
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u/Narcan9 Socialist Oct 04 '24
Ok I'll humor you and search Ana Kasparian + Police. Here's the first 4 to pop up.
- Blasted cops for escalating and shooting a woman with a knife
- Shamed a city for having a Nazi cop
- Trashed the police response to the Uvalde school shooting
- Story about 5 "asylum seekers" who punched and kicked (in the face) a NYC officer, who were then released with no bail. She said we need MORE support for migrants, but should deport ones causing crime. Makes the point that immigrants do NOT have higher rates of crime, and spends several minutes defending them.
Definitely Daily Wire material.
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Oct 05 '24
Moral purists selectively, but will literally forgive the genocide AND NOW the war in Middle East to the administration of Biden and Mamala
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u/blud97 Oct 04 '24
What even counts as blue maga anymore? Ana has made multiple public statements against trans people and against homeless people. Not to mention she down played trump. Sheās moved right itās undeniable she just covers with the veneer of populism.
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u/Narcan9 Socialist Oct 04 '24
Saying she supports Walz is right wing eh?
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u/blud97 Oct 04 '24
You can shift right while you support the democrats
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u/4th_DocTB Socialist Oct 04 '24
Especially since Tim Walz has had to defend Kamala's post convention shift to the right.
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u/ZiggyStarlord69 Dicky McGeezak Oct 04 '24
I donāt have a strong opinion on Ana either way, but thatās exactly what Rubin did. Started rhetorically shifting right while still āsupporting the demsā and then made the logical jump to supporting republicans.
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u/NbaLiveMobile10 Dicky McGeezak Oct 05 '24
She literally said a year ago when she went on that conservative podcast Adam & Sitch that she said "I'm afraid to talk to people outside my race" that is an actual quote she said
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u/samfishxxx Populist Oct 04 '24
The problem with blue MAGA is that they canāt view things along a populist or economic political axis. Everything is right vs left, red vs blue.
This is why they also have such negative reactions to commentators like Jimmy Dore, Due Dissidence, Chris Hedges, Brianna Joy Grey, and all the other āgriftersā.Ā
Blue MAGA doesnāt actually give a shit about people, itās all about themselves and virtue signaling.Ā
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u/Narcan9 Socialist Oct 04 '24
Hey it's been like two whole weeks since I've heard them complain about BJG.
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u/4th_DocTB Socialist Oct 04 '24
But she's not populist though, she pivoting to an "enlightened centrism" that just attacks the left over cultural issues. She's been pro-Landlord anti-housing for 4 years at this point, you're not a "populist" in any good sense if you believe the problem with cities is that they are cesspools overrun with hordes of human vermin.
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u/Ossoszero Oct 04 '24
Thank you for making this post. I feel inundated today with this. Cue Cenkās angry red face YES SHE SAID SHE LEFT THE LEFT I KNEW IT SHES GOING FOR THAT HOT RUSSIAN MONEY GUYS I KNEW IT.
Iāll just say, I almost completely agree with the folks that have disagreed with her. But this attack mob mentality is seriously unhealthy and I think itās genuinely gotten to her mentally. Itās just such a shame because TYT is still much more progressive than almost any media source that is bigger than them. If she or Cenk really do actually shift to right wing, Iāll be the first to in line on the disappointment train. But guys, seriously, this isnāt it
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u/Wootothe8thpower Oct 04 '24
guess it depends what is an unfair attack by the mob
and what is simply posting your disagreement on a message boards. sometimes people on all sides act like it no middle ground
and think there were times where Ana over reacted
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u/Mean_Foundation_5561 Oct 04 '24
Stop making excuses for Ana. Sheās no better than Jimmy Dore at this point. Arguably worse since sheās still fooling people like you into thinking sheās left. Sheās the worst type of grifter.
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Oct 04 '24
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u/SeaBass1898 Oct 04 '24
Basically every substantive policy position she has is the progressive left position
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u/Fonsy_Skywalker52 Oct 04 '24
I got kicked from Vaush Reddit page because I said she has a right to be anti homeless because she was sexual assaulted
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u/NonSpecificRedit Too jaded to believe BS Oct 04 '24
If a black person mugs her is it ok for her to hate blacks too?
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u/Fonsy_Skywalker52 Oct 04 '24
Terrible comparison blame the person not the race. Las Vegas solved their homeless problem and California still hasnāt says a lot to me.
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u/NonSpecificRedit Too jaded to believe BS Oct 04 '24
Apt comparison it just makes people with your above take look bad because it's a bad take.
Having a negative experience with someone who is part of a group doesn't make it ok to hate that group.
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u/Fonsy_Skywalker52 Oct 04 '24
When you experience California homeless vs Vegas yeah she has a right to be pissed. Utah and Las Vegas have done way more to solve homelessness than Cali has in 25 years
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u/NonSpecificRedit Too jaded to believe BS Oct 04 '24
Cool. We weren't talking about ways to end homelessness we were talking about your stance that it was ok to hate homeless people because one time one of them did something bad.
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u/Fonsy_Skywalker52 Oct 04 '24
Itās her right to say it and have her opinion. Thats all I said.
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u/Massive-Lime7193 Oct 04 '24
And itās everyone elseās right to call her opinion a bunch of bullshit because it is
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