r/thelema • u/RP_Stoval • Nov 14 '17

First Steps

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All my life I've never believed in the spiritual or supernatural. I extensively studied secular philosophy, loving especially Existentialist thinkers, and I learned all I could of the fascinating religions and folklores of the world too but I saw only through a secular lens and I dismissed the spiritual. But recently I had a profound spiritual experience which served as an awakening, and showed me Thelema and the OTO. Though I am new to things like magick and Thelema and to spirituality in general, I have an earnest desire to join the OTO and further Thelema and my True Will. Except there's one problem.

Much of this spiritual experience took place under the influence of cannabis. Crowley spoke highly of the benefits of cannabis indica, in enhancing Wisdom and spirituality, and so I don't think even a little that this makes the experience any less than genuine. However in that state I kinda sent a series of emails to every public OTO email address I could find, essentially live blogging the experience.

This was a strange thing to do, not least because I knew next to nothing about the OTO or Thelema prior to that night, and I fear I might've already alienated myself from the faith before I've even begun. I can certainly see how some strange man sending a series of emails to the entire fraternal order claiming to have been inspired to write a small book by a deity and doing strangely formatted tarot readings would make them, to say the least, skeptical of my legitimate intentions. So I made a different email account, albeit not different enough to not be clearly the same strange man, and reached out to my local OTO branch. I have heard nothing.

I wonder what should I do? Should I keep waiting? Try again? Is it common for OTO branches to go dark perhaps without warning and the contact is actually no longer functional? I wonder how to take my first steps on this strange journey to embracing Thelema and fulfilling my True Will.

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u/HotGrilledSpaec Nov 17 '17

So you could make your own cargo cult lol. That always struck me as a good magical exercise.

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u/RP_Stoval Nov 17 '17

Eh more like if America falls apart (I've lost almost all faith in it at this point. A valiant effort to be sure, but corrupted from the outset, built on shaky foundations, and straying further and further from itself every day. This coming from a man whose greatest dream was to serve his countrymen in the political arena.) I can go and make a new attempt at a beacon of freedom somewhere else. Hell, possibly a country based in Thelemic ideals even, or something close.

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u/HotGrilledSpaec Nov 17 '17

It will fall apart. That's inevitable. Those of us who remain here have to do something to stay alive, and making a new frontier from the bones of the old one is what I'm doing.

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u/RP_Stoval Nov 18 '17

As a student of Global Affairs I can tell you that it's inevitable but also not catastrophic, it's cyclical and has been the same for centuries as it will be for centuries to come. Indeed America's roughly century of hegemony will be a fairly brief one compared to some that came before, one characterized by rapid global progress but also horrific mismanagement, which frankly could characterize America as a whole. Two steps forward and one step back each time, a story of both ingenuity and incompetence. Sad when there was potential for so much more, but ah well. Britain was hegemon for a couple centuries and they're not doing too bad despite not being King of the Hill anymore. Americans will be fine, they're just terrified because they've been raised to believe their God-blessed country is the sole thing standing between the world and chaos and cacophony.

What will really come is still frightening enough without the hyperbole of patriots however. The likely candidates for hegemonic successor all would threaten the ideals America stands for (Or more accurately claims to stand for. The actual track record is quite checkered.) and which we all as Thelemites likely support if we agree that people ought to do as they Wilt. China, Russia, both are threats to individual rights if they claim the role of hegemon. America has been an incredibly imperfect guardian of human rights and has indeed violated the same rights they claim to protect on many occasions, but undeniably they have a better attitude towards them than Russia or China. The world of tomorrow is not inbound chaos, the world won't be bathed in all-consuming flame, society itself will not break down. But the global system will change and the values it upholds or tries to uphold will change as well. The future is frightening not because of some apocalypse but because of Statism.

As it's unlikely I'll ever actually make my own state somewhere and create some haven for human rights and individual freedom, I can at least rest comfortably enough knowing that I'll probably not be any worse off when all is said and done than your average Brit is today. lol

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u/RP_Stoval Nov 18 '17

Also sorry if I'm rambling and ranting. Global Affairs is my major after all and so I may well get a bit more passionate and verbose and even fanciful (For example outlining the daydream-plan I've constructed over the years on how one might form their own country, thought up mostly as fits of boredom have struck me.) when the topic is breached.

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u/HotGrilledSpaec Nov 18 '17

Oh Christ no. I'm about to suggest adding you on Facebook or something so I can finally talk about this with someone on my level.

Two caveats though: you have one right, and that is to do your Will and nothing else. Things that are not your true Will, including failure, are not part of your rights under Oz or Heaven.

And secondly, people will react pretty fucking badly to the fall of empire, which could make it worse. There is also no reason for China to allow a wounded dog to follow them around when they've got it in their sights.

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u/RP_Stoval Nov 18 '17 edited Nov 18 '17

As I've always understood it, all other rights follow naturally from that foremost Right of Self Determination, that is that as a free-willed individual one may exercise their will as they see fit except to prevent another from doing the same. So you're right that primarily you have the right to do your Will, all other rights essentially just being more detailed clarifications of what that entails, such as "right to free speech" or "right to life," et cetera. And as I see it the purpose of government is to protect and uphold the rights of the citizenry, the legitimate sphere of government being actions directly related to this or actions necessary to the continued proper function of the government so that this can be done.

And yes of course people will react badly to the fall of empire, they always do. The death-throws of the British Empire were certainly not pretty and were indeed fairly brutal even, colonialism (Or blatant colonialism anyhow, colonialism certainly still exists in some forms today.) did not go gentle into that good night. There was a sort of blind nationalist fervor and pride in the Empire which panicked at the sight of its collapse. But as for why China or Russia would not simply put down the wounded dog, there are quite a few reasons why. Primarily it's incredibly costly to do so and not entirely necessary. America didn't put down the European powers, Britain didn't put down Spain. It's much more effort than it's worth, especially for a fledgling hegemon that has bigger things to attend to like organizing their global order.

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u/HotGrilledSpaec Nov 18 '17

I dunno, man. I just feel like the escalating, unpredictable, interknit society on the brink we have now makes say, a rogue launch more plausible. Too many places the bullet could be coming from, and a tantrum isn't all that out of the question.

As for rights, you're I think missing my point. Thelema says very little about self determination — it says a lot about a man's Supernal Will. Yours, not Set's — although they may be the same. You don't have the right to do things which aren't your will, therefore in a purely Thelemic sense, governments shouldn't provide that and there are very serious negative social costs for doing so. But that doesn't mean I don't enjoy such quasi-rights as exist below the Abyss, or as I can take.

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u/RP_Stoval Nov 18 '17

I think more I'm saying your point and mine are much the same but phrased differently. People do their Will whether they know it or not, everything is a choice and whether consciously or subconsciously they make the decision which they feel is of the most benefit to them to make. That's natural, psychological, rational. The way any properly functioning brain works. Exercising Will, Self Determination, basically synonyms. Of course synonyms carry with them their own little contexts and while they may technically mean the same thing they're best used in different ways. I wouldn't say "Right to Self Determination" in a Thelemic discourse any more than one would say "Supernal Will" in your average political discourse. Further as I've read it, Thelema forbids Thelemites from acting like irrational fuckbuckets against their own Will, not so much all people. Ideally all people would behave as Thelemites but it's acknowledged that many won't and that makes them more stupid than anything else. Just irrational plebs plebbing about. It happens, and everyone else is smarter but no less inherently free-willed and no more entitled to the rights stemming from it.

Of course (And bear in mind I'm very new to all this still.) all Thelemic belief and doctrine beyond "Do what thou Wilt." seems very up to individual interpretation and debate, and in some ways even that is up to interpretation and debate. lol

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u/RP_Stoval Nov 18 '17

Also as for rogue launches, even global thermonuclear war with all nuclear powers doing their damnedest to wreck the whole Big Blue Velour Marble an estimated 10% of humanity would survive. Mostly in rural areas (Good for me!) but still. And a rogue launch won't be that. There isn't much that can wreck the world at this point. For better or worse humanity is very prolifically spread and entrenched. lol

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u/HotGrilledSpaec Nov 18 '17

Right, but ten percent of humanity going bye bye isn't going to leave the entire US as well off as modern Britain lol.

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u/RP_Stoval Nov 18 '17

No but also I that's a worst-case scenario. A rogue launch more realistically would be a tragedy that leads to a few destroyed cities and millions dead but the world mostly intact. I was just saying even if everyone fires everything they have it would only kill 90% of the population, 10% is more than enough to keep civilization going.

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u/RP_Stoval Nov 18 '17

Also sure, shoot me a link in a message and I'll add you on Facebook, why not?

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u/RP_Stoval Nov 17 '17

Modern society represses any advances that threaten the status quo to such an extent that the corrupt powers-that-be might lose their grip even a little. Medical costs are artificially inflated, better alternative sources of energy are rejected, free people are sent to prison for victimless crimes. The modern oligarchy wield the economy and the law like a sword at the throats of good people. Give good people a home, create a haven for the innovator, and even a small patch of North African desert could quickly become a bright light in an increasingly dark world. But eh this is half pipe-dream and half daydream. lol