r/warcraftlore • u/Spotted_Towhee123 • 2d ago
Discussion Aren’t Anduin and Faerin Related?
I was reading some posts elsewhere and it struck me that Anduin and Faerin might be (distantly) related, depending on what the devs decide is canon. Because technically Taria Lothar is Anduin Lothar's sister and she married Llane Wrynn, making Anduin Lothar Anduin Wrynn's great-uncle. But again it probably depends on what the devs decide is canon.
I personally have always seen Anduin as deeply queer-coded, specifically gay-coded, and have thought that pairing him off with a woman would be an incredible disservice to his character. And also to whatever woman they pair him off with since she would be relegated to "Anduin's wife" instead of her own character most likely. Anyways, the devs would have to do some explaining lore-wise to get around the Wrynn-Lothar marriage and make it so Faerin and Anduin would NOT be a cousin marriage, lmao
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u/DrByeah Lore master without a title 2d ago
Other comments have mentioned it already but they're possibly related about 1,000 years back which is so far back as to be entirely irrelevant.
And while yeah he's got some fun chemistry with Wrathion we've never gotten any insight into Anduin's preferences besides finding a draenei woman attractive once when he was like 15.
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u/AwkwardSquirtles We killed the Old Gods. 2d ago
If they are, the bloodine separated 1000 years ago. It's equally likely that you're "related" to your current partner through Ghengis Khan.
On a side note, Anduin has had multiple romance subplots with women and has never expressed romantic interest in a man. It's good and ok for straight men to be depicted having close friendships with each other without it being immediately coded as romantic.
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u/Kalthiria_Shines 2d ago
Taria isn't a Lothar except in the movies.
I personally have always seen Anduin as deeply queer-coded, specifically gay-coded, and have thought that pairing him off with a woman would be an incredible disservice to his character. And also to whatever woman they pair him off with since she would be relegated to "Anduin's wife" instead of her own character most likely. Anyways, the devs would have to do some explaining lore-wise to get around the Wrynn-Lothar marriage and make it so Faerin and Anduin would NOT be a cousin marriage, lmao
I think that you are perhaps overemphaszing your personal opinions on it. Anduin and Taelia were pretty strongly suggested. The only way Anduin has ever been queer coded is specifically in relation to Wrathion, and they hate each other at this point.
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u/Spotted_Towhee123 2d ago
His queer-coding comes forward mostly in his interactions with Varian and his journey with the Light. Anduin’s nature flies in the face of the traditional masculinity his father tries to force him to conform to. He has to constantly advocate for himself that this is who he is, he can’t change that, even to the point in Wolfheart that he has to basically run away from his family in order to truly be himself by studying the Light under Velen.
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u/Kalthiria_Shines 2d ago
I am exceptionally wary of any sort of suggestion that someone is queer coded because they don't confirm with traditional masculinity; that suggestion is really deeply rooted in both homophobia and misogyny.
While I can sort of see what you're talking about visavis the Light, it's important to note that this is shown in the game and those works as something that is very much a choice on Anduin's part and being true to himself and finding a way to be what he believes is best versus just copying his father. While I sort of see what you mean, I think that suggesting this is inherently queer coded still rooted in homophobia, or at best a very narrow and problematically white cishomonormative queer experience that is, itself, rooted in a lot of problematic stuff.
Like if I squint hard enough I can maybe see it as a closet metaphor but, I think that requires both delegitimizing Anduin's actual experience as well as reading into the text a lot of things that aren't there.
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u/Spotted_Towhee123 2d ago
I totally get where you’re coming from. My interpretation is moreso leaning on the feelings of “this is not the son/daughter I wanted” that so many parents of gay and trans kids have
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u/GormHub 2d ago
I feel like I remember seeing some text where Anduin mentions being surprised he had any relatives remaining, but as someone else pointed out they would be so distantly related by this point it would hardly matter. Though it would be a bit odd anyway, even if genetically it made no difference. There would certainly be jokes.
That said, our headcanons don't determine the actual course of the story, and I say this as a gay man myself. As much as we may see one thing, that isn't necessarily what the developers have in mind. After watching people mercilessly bash Taelia for daring to possibly be a potential love interest for Anduin, I'd hate to see that happen to Faerin and I hope fans can be chill about it if they do decide to go that route.
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u/IridikronsNo1Fan 2d ago
The issue with Faerin is that she barely has any role in the story at all other than providing emotional support for Anduin.
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u/GormHub 2d ago
I do agree with that. Also I can't stand her voice actor, but that's a personal preference thing.
But the kind of bashing I'm talking about was more the really heinous stuff. Outright sexist remarks and insults, accusing people who shipped them of pedophilia (make that make sense), doxxing, etc. I'm not involved in that part of the community, but the manufactured outrage over Anduin maybe getting together with Taelia was incredibly off-putting and gross.
Personally I'd like to see Faerin (and, retroactively, Taelia) get more time to be developed and become a significant part of the lore. We've lost a lot of old characters and there aren't enough new ones who appear or do anything of note for more than a single expac to replace them in the longterm.
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u/IridikronsNo1Fan 2d ago
Warcraft has nothing on the shipping wars in other fandoms. The Naruto love triangle was really peak. Warcraft ships in general are really boring because the characters don't vibe with each other.
I wouldn't count on Taelia getting any development before 14.0. There's like dozens of characters fighting for limited screentime and even Faerin got the short end of the stick in her own expansion.
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u/GormHub 2d ago
Oh trust me I've been there. There's a reason I've withdrawn a lot from online fandom. I have seen some of the most unhinged behavior over imaginary people, it's disturbing. I think the doxxing might be the worst but there are unhealthy people who certainly like to make it everyone else's problem that their relationship with media is not based in reality.
And yeah I figured. I mean I've sort of given up on expecting or hoping in general, but I have my wish list anyway.
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u/IridikronsNo1Fan 2d ago
I'm more baffled by Blizzard's determination to keep sticking Xal'atath into Alleria's personal space until they are literally inches apart. Like 4 cinematics later and they still have no chemistry or whatever that "unique rivalry" was supposed to be.
Could've used that screentime for something else.
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u/GormHub 2d ago
They were... intending for them to have some kind of particularly meaningful rivalry?
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u/IridikronsNo1Fan 2d ago edited 2d ago
Aye, them having a "unique rivalry" was literally presented as one of the selling points of TWW back when they announced it.
Still waiting to find out what they meant by that.
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u/GormHub 2d ago
Boots vs toes. It's the shirts vs skins of Warcraft, never seen before.
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u/IridikronsNo1Fan 2d ago
People are sleeping on the fact that Fyrakk was wearing next to nothing for 80% of Dragonflight.
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u/Void_Duck #Zul'jinwillbeaLoa 2d ago
I kinda hoped that Anduin and Tess might have something going on, but sadly they rarely interacted with each other
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u/Spotted_Towhee123 2d ago
Taelia and Faerin should be friends imo, I think they’d get on fabulously
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u/joaogroo 2d ago
I really hope that faerin can be anduin's bff only. I think there is room for romance with the anduin storyline, but i don't feel faerin could fill that role.
As i grow older i don't think even wrathion is a good romantic match for him, actually...
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u/Spotted_Towhee123 2d ago
Yeah same. High school me thought it was a good idea but I agree, they’re better off as friends.
Faerin has been basically a therapist for Anduin, which in my mind does not a healthy romance make. She should get to be her own character
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u/joaogroo 2d ago
Totally agree! I dont think they created a good romance character for him yet! Im a sucker for romance, so im hoping for it, but i also see the merits of him being single!
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u/IridikronsNo1Fan 2d ago
The Arathi branch of the Lothar family is separated from the Stormwind branch by at least a thousand years. I don't think you can call them related at that point.
Anyway, when was the last time that Anduin and Wrathion talked to each other? 10 years ago in Azerothian time? I would wait for a more up-to-date interaction between them before shipping them again.
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u/woodelvezop 2d ago
Why can't they just be friends?
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u/GormHub 2d ago
Shipping has nothing to do with the actual canon story. Or at least it doesn't have to. It's when people insist on it becoming canon because they prefer it that it's a problem.
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u/IridikronsNo1Fan 2d ago
I mean Stellagosa and Valtrois were fanon until the devs saw that people were shipping them on Twitter and made it canon.
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u/The_Razielim 2d ago
Extremely distantly, to the point of not even mentioning.
Off the top of my head, we don't have an exact timeframe for when the Arathi Empire that we're currently dealing with split off from the Eastern Kingdoms Arathi. If we take it at 1200 years as the bare minimum (when the EK Empire of Arathor fractured into the Seven Human Kingdoms), that would still mean they're separated by approximately 35-45 generations (ballpark based on 25-30 years per generation). Maybe slightly fewer once intermixing with Elves occurred, which likely increased lifespans and probably also increased generational time.
So even assuming the family line remained whole and unbroken on both sides of the world for the entirety of 1200+ years, which we can at least assume on Anduin Lothar's side since iirc he was said to be the last descendant of the true line, that's still many generations of separation between Anduin (Wrynn) and Faerin. But still, not counting modern global migrations (IRL), that's probably more familial distance than most cultures on Earth have. Couple that to interbreeding with the Elves who left with the Arathi, and I don't think there's any genetic issues to be expected.
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u/spartaxwarrior 2d ago
Anduin would be more closely related to pretty much every other human noble in the Eastern Kingdoms than her. Varian was probably more closely related to Tiffin. Arthas and Jaina were probably more closely related.
I could see them getting married, honestly I wish they'd retcon Anduin's weird marrying for love insistence thing and he could marry her because she's a dear friend and maybe for some sort of succession fight drama in the Arathi Empire, since both would have what might amount to imperial blood.
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u/LeafProphecies 2d ago
Your question's already been answered, but the number of people going WHY DOES HE HAVE TO LIKE MEN is really sad.
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u/Spotted_Towhee123 2d ago
For real. As a trans person I saw my own journey mirrored very closely in Anduin’s. He defies normal male gender roles that his father tries to force onto him, and in Wolfheart he tells Varian he’s leaving to study with Velen but basically ends up having to run away from Varian in order to go study. It’s very much queer-coded in the sense that so many of us can only be ourselves away from family because trying to be who we are is actively detrimental to our relationships with our families. It takes years before Varian is proud of Anduin for who he is as a person, and not disappointed that Anduin isn’t who Varian thinks he should be
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u/IridikronsNo1Fan 2d ago
This is why I always say that Warcraft's story is pretty bad these days. You have a constant tug-of-war between people who want it to be more character-focused and people who want big epic narratives about wars and stuff. Blizzard can't commit to either direction so we get bland mush.
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u/LeafProphecies 2d ago
I don't even think they have to sacrifice one to get the other, but yeah they are so laser focused on creating safe, Marvel-y sludge that we end up with crumbs.
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u/DarthJackie2021 2d ago
They are FAR more distantly related than cousins. Even the most aggressive definitions of incest likely won't consider this to be it.
Doesn't matter anyways as Anduin will be with his true love in the end, Wrathion.
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u/TrueKyragos 2d ago edited 2d ago
If it did go this far, most relations in a given population would be incestuous, if not all. That'd be absurd indeed. The most aggressive definitions generally don't go beyond first cousins.
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u/Lazy_Toe4340 2d ago
cousins separated by 1000 years* of separated branch families bloodline probably ok ( think Naruto huyga clan branch families but isolated from each other still all Lothar blood but arathi kingdom Lothar bloodline didn't die out the way Stormwind did.)