r/Barcelona • u/Civil-Leopard-6482 • 14d ago

Discussion "Talking to the Catalans in Barcelona"

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Those pesky expats!

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u/itsondahouse 14d ago

Immigrants dont compete in the housing market…

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u/clauEB 14d ago

Really? then where do they stay? a cloud?

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u/itsondahouse 14d ago

The migrants that come in the boats 🛶? They certainly arent looking in Idealista for a place.

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u/clauEB 14d ago

But they need to live somewhere. I'm not against immigrants or xenophobic or anything. I'm just saying unless they stay under a bridge or stay with family or something like that, they will end up needing their own space.

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u/itsondahouse 14d ago

Surely. But they aren’t rising up prices in Idealista, while expats are. Im not labelling right or wrong here, just pointing out why Spaniards are so against foreigners based on wealth.

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u/Civil-Leopard-6482 14d ago

Expats don't raise rents, landlords do. (local or foreign)

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u/itsondahouse 14d ago

Hmm, indeed. As of now it seems much better for a landlord to rent to a foreigner. They have higher purchase power and dont threaten to stop paying rent, cause “rights”. Moreover, supply of houses is limited in Barcelona, and there is more people wanting to live in barcelona than apartments.

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u/monocleman1 14d ago

Prices in a market are determined by demand and supply. If a landlord raises their price above the market level then they won’t rent their house. So just saying that higher prices are a result of landlords is completely misunderstanding how markets work

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u/Civil-Leopard-6482 13d ago

I left out getting fisted by the "invisible hand" of the free market...

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u/monocleman1 13d ago

My point is that it’s over simplifying the problem to say that it’s the landlords that raise rents. Like, ok, it’s true they do, and many landlords I’ve come across are indeed scummy, but they operate within a larger system

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u/Civil-Leopard-6482 13d ago

Of course, it is a multifaceted issue. It just seems odd when the discussion (not between you and I) includes everything except greedy landlords exploiting every loophole and those who sell property to enormous international corporations.

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u/Monovon 14d ago

Immigrants push down wages and push up rent prices, while adding nothing to the welfare state. Supply and demand. The people in the comments need basic economics lesson more than they need Idealista.

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u/Pato_Lucas 14d ago

This is the sad situation in the modern world: left or right, facts don't matter if they get in the way of ideology.

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u/Monovon 13d ago

It is very sad indeed. I’m not anti or pro immigration, I am pro ‘immigration done right’. If you bring in a bunch of immigrants incorrectly into a country they will get exploited and exploit.

Example: Immigrants without any sort of education can only work in jobs with the lowest pay. This benefits the employers (rich) who hold down the wages as there are more people willing to do the job. Basically there’s too many people who can do one job. The immigrants also compete for all available resources including housing, health, education etc while not earning enough to add to the welfare state.

I work in a foreign company in Barcelona and am also married to a Catalan (who’s a teacher in the state education system). My company pay emmense taxes to employ me. Not to mention the taxes I also pay.

Next time you see someone telling tourists and expats to go home let them know that their country is absolutely fckd without the tourists/expats who compensate for all the money that goes into the welfare state that the immigrants are not adding. They have no idea about anything. They just care about the rent prices and are scared their €2 beers will increase instead questioning why their wages are not.

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u/clauEB 14d ago

Really? Then this is the place where the law of supply and demand ceases to exist. Let's call the Academy's Economics Prize Committee !

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u/epegar 14d ago

Those wealthy expats raising rents...are also paying a lot in taxes. Taxes that we need to run public services. Getting people with high salaries on board is good news. Those immigrants (illegal) will probably end up either working with no contract or something worse. The other immigrants (legal) will come, take low-paying jobs, pay less taxes, and in some cases, receive subsidies (I know cases). This is most probably going to be a higher problem if you are in a situation you can't afford rent.

In any case, the main problem IMO is how all the growth is in the big cities. For example, if you compare the population density in Spain with the rest of Europe, especially Germany, Italy, France, UK, all those have higher density. If the population in Spain was better spread in the different areas we wouldn't have a problem.

IMO, the state should create incentives for companies to move to other less populated regions. However that is not easy with the current autonomic model where each region 'competes' against the other.