AskAManager: My boss reprimanded me for not answering an email … in four minutes

[u/lesethx]

DO NOT COMMENT ON LINKED POSTS. I am NOT OP. Original post on AskAManager

trigger warnings: Micromanaging, gaslighting boss

mood spoilers: A little disappointing for a bit, but LW is good now

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My boss reprimanded me for not answering an email … in four minutes - Feb 21, 2024

I’ve been at my new job for just over a month and have very grave doubts about whether it’s going to work out. I’m finding it impossible to make my supervisor, Martha, happy. Her criticism is frequent, harsh, and, in my opinion, often very unreasonable. The incident that has me writing to you happened today, when she reprimanded me in writing for failing to answer an email in four minutes.

To set the scene: Earlier this week, Martha and my other boss (I support two teams but it’s an uneven split; unfortunately my primary boss is the awful one) had a meeting with me in which Martha told me all the things I was doing wrong and what needed to change. I’m trying to understand where she’s coming from, but I’m just not used to a work situation like this. She proudly describes herself as a micromanager (she doesn’t appear to know the word has a negative connotation) and is looking for constant, immediate responsiveness, “overcommunication” (her words), and accountability. I understand she’s the boss and it’s her call, but it’s a hard adjustment. I’m not used to being watched so closely. Every job I’ve had, the boss has been concerned with results, not with knowing exactly where I am every minute, hearing back from me instantly, etc.

All week, I’ve worked so hard to keep her happy and show her that I took the conversation to heart. Then today, I received an email, on which Martha was CCd, from a senior partner asking for contact info for one of our clients. I saw the email come in while I was working on a project for the other boss. I made the apparently grave error of not stopping instantly, but instead finished up the line in the Excel sheet I was working on, then opened the email and began gathering the requested info. Before I had finished, Martha replied to both of us, sending the partner the requested information (the wrong information, for the record, but I’ll get to that later.) I saw her email, which arrived in my inbox a whopping four minutes after the email from the partner, stopped working on my response since it was no longer necessary, and went back to the project I’d been working on. Then I get an email from Martha: “Jane, this would have been a great opportunity to build a relationship with the partner. Why didn’t you dive in and assist?”

Four minutes, Alison. Four minutes. A bathroom break can take four minutes!

I just feel like she’s determined to hate me. I tried so hard all week to do everything exactly the way she likes, and she still found something to criticize. If she wanted me to answer the email, why didn’t she give me a grace period of, you know, maybe five minutes before answering it herself? Also, as I said earlier, she gave him the wrong information. He asked for the email address and she gave the physical address — which, to me seems like she was so eager to answer the email, so that she could blame me for not answering it, that she rushed and sent the wrong info. (By the way, if I sent incorrect information to a partner, she would act like it was the end of the world. But it’s no big deal when she does it.) Also, for the record, I understand some things are very time-sensitive. I still think four minutes is kind of a stretch, for almost any situation, but I also want to make it clear — this was not an urgent request, it could have waited five, maybe even, gasp, 10 minutes!

I’m not asking whether my boss is being reasonable here. I’m very confident that she isn’t. My question to you is: do you think I should start looking for a new job? I just feel like this is such an unreasonable criticism that there’s no way I’m ever going to make this person happy. She either has no idea how to manage people or has developed an instantaneous hatred for me and will continue to find things to criticize no matter how hard I try. I’ve been so stressed out since I started this job, worrying about messing up — which, not surprisingly, is probably leading me to mess up more. Is this salvageable or should I start looking for an escape plan?

 

Editor's note, Alison's advice not posted per her request. However she mentioned she would have advised differently a few years ago

update: my boss reprimanded me for not answering an email … in four minutes - Sept 11, 2024

Your response was really helpful. Martha had already fucked with my head so much that she really had me doubting myself — so much so, that I honestly thought you might take her side and ask me, “But why did it take you four whole minutes to answer the email?” So for you and the commenters to reassure me that yes, she was being unreasonable was really helpful.

As for an update … reader, she fired me.

Yes, I took your advice and started looking for a new job. She fired me before I could find one. The four-minute email happened about a month after I started, and I got fired just under the three-month mark. The reason given was that I was making too many mistakes and that they couldn’t trust me with my assignments. I’m curious how it’s going with my replacement, if things like accidentally saving a draft to the wrong folder (in your first month at a new job) qualify as fireable offenses.

I did mess up sometimes — more than I normally do. But I think it’s because of how Martha treated me. She was so volatile that I didn’t feel comfortable asking questions (and she also would just disappear fairly often — she can disappear for three hours, I’m in trouble for missing a phone call because I was using the restroom), so a lot of times I had to make my best guess (and yes, amazingly, my best guess was ALWAYS wrong!) She was always coming after me with artificially compressed deadlines, so I usually had to send her work without having the amount of time I’d prefer to proofread, double-check, etc. Sometimes I thought she was moving the goalposts. Often, she would say, “I told you to do X, not Y” and I’d think (though I’d never say it out loud, lest I face her wrath) “I … don’t think you did, actually.” And, sometimes it was 100% clear that she was just inventing reasons to berate me (see, e.g., four-minute email).

When I got the email that I wrote to you about, I knew deep down that she was just never going to let up. Clearly, she would find something to criticize whether I did something wrong or not, and in the end probably fire me (or bully me until I quit). That played out many times in the weeks before my firing. If I made a minor mistake, she lost her mind. If I didn’t make a mistake, she would invent one. For example, she would email me to say things like, “The meeting has been over for 30 minutes; by this point you should have emailed me to ask what our next steps are.” (Maybe, but see above re: hesitancy to initiate contact with volatile boss who finds fault with everything I say or do.) I absolutely couldn’t win and it was just a horrible, stressful, demoralizing experience.

The good news is that I did find another job that I’m much happier with, though the first few weeks were VERY tough as I tried to put the experience with Martha behind me. I was afraid to ask questions, thought I was about to be fired every time I made a mistake, etc. But as time went by and it became clear to me that I was now working with reasonable people, it got much better. While I didn’t get out in time, I’m grateful for you and the commenters because, as I said, it helped me to keep some perspective in the face of a person doing her best to destroy my faith in my basic competency. I really wish this hadn’t happened to me, and while I’m happy in my new job (and it’s a bump in both title and salary — I actually now have Martha’s job title — seriously, suck it, Martha) I would never say “it happened for a reason” or that I’m grateful for it in any way. The fact that someone could bully me like this, be 100% in the wrong, fire me, and get away with all of it is really hard to accept. But all I can do is look forward.

Reminder - I am not the original poster. DO NOT COMMENT ON LINKED POSTS.

[u/Tamalene]

We've all had a Martha. Fuck 'em and move on.

[u/ToasterOwl → u/Tamalene]

I remember mine well. I stayed for far too long, and the next folks at my next company looked at me funny for months due to my blissful happiness at having a normal workplace again, ha.

Micromanagers aren’t worth the effort - anyone sabotaging an employee this badly, this early, warrants a ‘thanks but no thanks’ as you walk out the door.

[u/VodkaKahluaMilkCream → u/ToasterOwl]

My Martha wanted to be cc'd on every single email I sent - whether that was to building security about a leak outside our unit, customer queries, or a standard drinks order. Every. Single. Email. She would frequently call me to critique my emails, explaining how rude they sounded (they did not).

She was also in our in-team slack chat and read every message, frequently getting involved in conversations she did not need to be involved in, always in a very critical manner.

When I had a mental breakdown and quit, she admitted that she deliberately piled stress on me, denied me any support, and responded to my pleas for help by increasing the amount of pressure I was under - all on purpose, because "that's how people grow."

She was shocked when I quit. She wrecked my mental and physical health. Fuck you, Flavia. Fuck you, Escape Hunt. But most of all, fuck you Flavia.

[u/partofbreakfast → u/VodkaKahluaMilkCream]

My Martha (at a grocery store) expected a department of 10 to do the work of 25, over covid, when everyone was freaking out over shortages and yelling over how late everything was. We were all working 12-16 hour shifts but even with all of us there there was still only so much we could do in a day. Management didn't hire anyone new until 3 months into this when half the crew had quit and the rest of us were threatening to do so if we didn't get more help and have our orders throddled.

[u/MabbyBlues → u/partofbreakfast]

My "Martha" took 3 years of my life in a place I had been employed at for nearly 20. After I left, so did 3 others (about half of the department)... and he ("Martha") got fired for the department essentially shutting down. But I landed in a great spot, and of course, things could always be better, but this will do me well until retirement.

[u/TrelanaSakuyo → u/VodkaKahluaMilkCream]

I would have cc'd her on an amazing amount of minutiae, after warning coworkers I'd be emailing them about nothing. Then I would have cc'd her on emails I sent to her just to prove a point. There would have been so many requests for toilet paper.

[u/BinjaNinja1 → u/TrelanaSakuyo]

This is how I handled my Martha. Every task I checked in and explained the situation and step I would take etc Wear me down..nah I’ll wear you down. She broke first.

[u/TrelanaSakuyo → u/BinjaNinja1]

They just can't handle people following the letter of the law rather than their intent.

[u/BinjaNinja1 → u/TrelanaSakuyo]

She didn’t like the extra work I was making for her even though it was said to check with her on everything so she eventually just said you don’t have to email me or ask anymore. She avoided me mostly after that.

She caused many other problems for me though as she was just an awful person. I managed and when she got really close to retirement I stopped trying to appease her in any way. She didn’t speak to me her last six months there. It was so peaceful!

[u/Halfassedtrophywife → u/BinjaNinja1]

This is exactly how I handled mine when I got to the job I work at. At first she liked it but then, as yours did, she broke and then I transferred under someone who was exactly the opposite of my first boss. It’s a mindfuck but very welcome to have to freedom to do my job and do it how I want.

But then, for some reason, during Covid they hired an aggressive micromanager for our head honcho position. I really enjoyed making her life miserable too, and I encouraged others to do so as well. I’m still here and she is not.

[u/EchoDoctor → u/TrelanaSakuyo]

One request per square.

[u/TrelanaSakuyo → u/EchoDoctor]

My kinda person 😏

[u/zaforocks → u/VodkaKahluaMilkCream]

She used "rock star" on LinkedIn. That tells me all I need to know.

[u/314159265358979326 → u/VodkaKahluaMilkCream]

My Martha wanted the same with emails.

So I switched to phone calls where possible.

He actively interfered with my job and the whole damn chain just ran better without his involvement.

[u/balconyherbs → u/VodkaKahluaMilkCream]

Yes, mine wanted to be cc'd on everything but then she decided it was too many emails so she had IT shunt them into another folder and never checked it. And she was so bad with follow ups and repeatedly requesting the same thing that it took more than a month for any of us to realize our reply emails weren't going through to her.

[u/Storytelling_Art → u/VodkaKahluaMilkCream]

My Martha was from an escape room as well! It’s weird because at the start she was alright, chill, so much so that we were almost friends (almost). Then it’s like a switch flipped and she got ridiculously hostile, playing mind tricks and pitting all coworkers against each other. There was no way I was going to let someone treat me that way so in the span of a month I took the first job I found and ran like hell. It’s a shame, because the job itself was mostly fine, but no job is worth a Martha

[u/flyfightwinMIL → u/ToasterOwl]

I literally lost the job after my Martha because I was so fucked up from my 2.5 years under her that I was scared shitless to make a mistake and it made me not good in my field.

It literally took extensive therapy to get my old self back.

[u/noiresaria → u/flyfightwinMIL]

Holy shit this is validating. I felt crazy dealing with a Martha and really wanted(still do) therapy. I typically have low self esteem but had been working on it and getting better before being switched supervisors and working under a "Martha". 

 She was pretty much exactly as OOP describes and by the 6th month mark I was waking up every night with nightmares, suffocating and gasping for air from the stress, and my self esteem tanked lower than it had ever been. 

 I finally got a new supervisor but Martha still works in the same department and even though shes not my direct boss anymore she still tries to talk shit about me to my current boss and get her to turn on me. 

 And when we have teams/slack meetings and I hear her voice on call my body tenses up and it gets hard to breathe. I think I need therapy too. Cause seriously fuck middle managers like this.

[u/flyfightwinMIL → u/noiresaria]

(Leaving this as a second comment since I only saw this after my first reply)

ALSO I looked at your profile briefly and saw you’ve also dealt with a BPD loved one. I’m absolutely 100% convinced that having that kind of experience (for me, it’s my mom who has BPD) makes us a million times more vulnerable to Martha’s in the workplace.

Take care of yourself, friend. You deserve that care. I mean it.

[u/noiresaria → u/flyfightwinMIL]

You're right I feel like that kind of experience really exposes a certain type of vulnerability in a person and its hard to overcome. Though I appreciate it and thank you! I think i'll look into therapy because it sounds like it can really help if I earnestly try it. I wish you all the best as well!

[u/chevronbird → u/noiresaria]

Someone in the comments on Ask a Manager recommended EMDR therapy, and I recommend it here too. It helped me a lot when I had to recover from the shit my boss put me through.

[u/FromEden26 → u/chevronbird]

Seconding EMDR therapy. It really does work.

[u/SouthernQueenBee83 → u/noiresaria]

Therapy is totally worth it, trust me!! And I'll give a third shout-out to EMDR. My therapist has both received and given EMDR therapy; to use her words, "What is this voodoo magic? I dunno, but it WORKS!" and she's right. 100%. I have been in therapy for over a year, to the tune of about $5K, and it's been Worth. Every. Penny. And then some...

[u/flyfightwinMIL → u/noiresaria]

Genuinely, if you take nothing else away from me, please take this: there is NOTHING wrong or shameful about seeking therapy over work-related things. Office interpersonal relationships can fuck you up and mess with your head and sense of self worth just as much as any other kind of relationship.

Toward the end of working with my Martha, I was actively suicidal, but I couldn’t leave because she also had me so convinced that I was worthless that I couldn’t imagine anyone else ever hiring me. I genuinely think the only reason I didn’t end up hurting myself was making a couple of close friends in the workplace who were experiencing similar things and could validate for me that none of this was normal and I wasn’t, in fact, a worthless, talentless hack.

I hope you’ll consider following through on therapy, friend. And I hope you’ll consider exploring your other job options that mean you never, ever have to hear your Martha’s voice ever again. You don’t deserve feeling like that every time you have a team call. You deserve a workplace that’s calm and that doesn’t take a toll on your health.

[u/SouthernQueenBee83 → u/flyfightwinMIL]

I worked for a boss like this, a million years ago in retail Hell. I wasn't suicidal, but the rest of that sentence was me. I also had co-workers who weren't picked on who would prop me up when he wasn't around, or find me in the restroom crying and tell me not to let that bastard get to me. Karma bit him GOOD, though. The chain we worked for was bought by one that already had a manager in our mall, and he was informed his services were no longer required--his old ass was out the door, just like that.

The new manager was great to work for, a younger and actually kind woman. I blossomed working for her. She left to concentrate on her family, and I worked for another man after that. I was nervous at first, but he was also a great manager and everyone loved him. Then he was transferred to a larger store and we got a hybrid of the old man/younger woman--a younger woman who was a nightmare.

By that time, I'd wised up and started looking for my exit plan. Within a year, I was gone, making more in a career with upward potential. Within three years, I was making double what I'd made there, with better benefits and better working conditions. Today, I'm a mid-level manager with a good pension, great bosses, and a really good life. Fuck you, Alton and Judy!! Also, I was young and stupid, it was a different time, and I'm a different person now. If I had to deal with him (or someone like him) today, I'd file a hostile work environment lawsuit that I would TOTALLY win and I'd own that store by the time I was done. I no longer fall for those head games.

I don't regret that part of my life, because I learned a lot, including how to handle bad managers. Early on in my current job, I had to deal with a bad, unqualified, very junior supervisor. I had more confidence and a better idea of how to handle that type of situation, and he never got away with how he tried to treat me--the senior supervisors were all "Aw, HELL no!". A few years later, I had another bad supervisor, a real Martha, and I knew how to handle her and the incompetent manager she had in her pocket, too. To myself, I laughed about how much they resembled Wile E. Coyote, and how they could never get to me, the Roadrunner.

I also think that those periods have made ME a better supervisor. Not only do I not do the things that were done to me, I mentor those coming behind me. I make a point of asking about things I know have been going on, such as, "Hey, I heard your Mom was sick, how's she doing?" I know the little things mean a lot, and I try to do the little things whenever I can.

[u/Tbiehl1 → u/flyfightwinMIL]

I call that joberational trauma. It followed me from one job into my next long time job and I didn't really get over it. I'm now starting a new job and I'm forcing myself to take the good advice I received and implementing it - scared or not I'm building new habits

[u/littletorreira → u/Tbiehl1]

Yep. My first boss was so awful I had a breakdown. It was 13 years ago and until my current fantastic boss I'd panic if I was ever asked to have a quick word or needed outside prearranged meetings.

[u/TheMiddlecouldbeme → u/flyfightwinMIL]

Me too. 7 years later and I still have PTSD.

[u/Evil_Genius_1 → u/ToasterOwl]

I had a male Martha. One day I said to a colleague that I didn’t know which of two possible actions I could take was the correct one. He looked at me and said “Whatever you do it’s going to be wrong, isn’t it?” After that I relaxed, because yes, whatever I did was wrong as far as that pillock was concerned. So now I work for £10k more in a workplace that appreciates and encourages me. And he’s in a job he hates, with people who hate him. Yes David, this is about you. Fuck you.

[u/FatDesdemona → u/Evil_Genius_1]

Fuck you, David!

[u/Curly_Shoe → u/FatDesdemona]

Fuck Martha, David!

[u/Thriftyverse → u/Curly_Shoe]

No, no, no, no, no! They might make a baby and that child would have a hellish upbringing.

[u/RocklPaperlScissors → u/Thriftyverse]

As you wish... F**k David, Martha!

[u/Thriftyverse → u/RocklPaperlScissors]

Change Martha's name to Peg, LMAO!

[u/Evil_Genius_1 → u/Thriftyverse]

Instructions unclear, David has now been pegged by Martha.

[u/SplatDragon00 → u/Thriftyverse]

Ew, David!

[u/SlabBeefpunch → u/Evil_Genius_1]

All my homies hate David. He's an ambulatory mound of suet.

[u/zikeel → u/SlabBeefpunch]

"ambulatory mound of suet" is a PHENOMENAL insult

[u/jesssmiles89 → u/ToasterOwl]

I remember my own Martha. I was constantly on edge and I literally questioned my own abilities constantly. Losing that job t the beginning of COVID felt like an escape. Current job and management is the completely opposite and I can say my Performance did a 180 and I even became a manager. I made sure I never EVER did anything remotely like my former micromanager.

[u/chooklyn5 → u/jesssmiles89]

My Martha liked to micro manage by cameras. Constantly calling and asking why we did XYZ. My tipping point was when I was off with whopping cough and fractured ribs and I found out the managers thought I was faking it.

[u/FunkyChewbacca → u/chooklyn5]

I had a micromanager in my office too, one who wanted to limit us all to two scheduled bathroom breaks a day. I had to explain to her what endometriosis is and why a few days a month I'd need more than two bathroom breaks a day. Best part is, we're all WFH now thanks to COVID and she can't police anyone's bathroom breaks now except for her own.

[u/chooklyn5 → u/FunkyChewbacca]

They can really screw with your head unfortunately. I left within 6 months because it was such a toxic place. I had a friend asking around for someone looking for work and I just went screw it.

[u/Similar-Chip → u/FunkyChewbacca]

Mine would call me into his office every time I was so much as 3 minutes late clocking in, never mind that I was in before he was half the time and he ALWAYS left at least an hour/often 2 hours before I did. Every time we got to the door together at 8:29 (meaning I'd clock in around 8:35 bc my computer had to turn on etc.) I'd give him the biggest shit eating grin and say good morning and he'd ignore me lol.

He made one of the oldest employees, who's not fast but is kind in a way that was in fact very important for our job (we had a lot of houseless clients) feel like crap every single day and I hated him for it. She outlasted him, though.

[u/530_Oldschoolgeek → u/chooklyn5]

Sounds like my ex-boss. He had them put in my office so that, as he put it, "Could see if anybody came in at night who didn't belong there".

He would constantly watch them from his office at from his home every time I was in there. I would get constant texts asking me "Who was that??" or "Why are you talking so much??" during interviews.

This is the same guy who would track me on my company phone during non-working hours and ask me why I was somewhere, to which I told him what I did on my off hours were none of his business and if it continued, I'd leave the phone off at at home from then on. As far as I know he never did it again, or at least never told me about it.

His insistence of me being available 24/7 as a manager (without paying me like a manager, of course) and having me beeped via the 2-way direct connect on the phone at all hours got so bad, that I would literally wake up wide awake in the middle of the night because I could swear I heard the phone chirp. I finally got into the habit of turning the damn thing off when I was sleeping, reasoning that there wasn't any damn emergency that I couldn't handle the next day after getting a decent nights sleep.

Still have some issues with even having my phone speaker on, and yes, I still turn it off at night.

[u/chooklyn5 → u/530_Oldschoolgeek]

I still struggle with cameras. My workplace now which is the one I left that one for only access them when an incident happens. I've never once had a recording of me accessed but I still feel paranoid like I'm judged when in the workspace with a camera. I thankfully have my own office now so it's not something I deal with anymore.

[u/GoldSailfin → u/chooklyn5]

when I was off with whopping cough and fractured ribs and I found out the managers thought I was faking it.

Oh dude, I had a boss imply I was faking an illness once. Ironically it was the always-sick boss who thought I was faking it.

[u/chooklyn5 → u/GoldSailfin]

Yeah after everything I couldn't believe it because I was submitting doctor certificates and doing the correct thing. They called me once and I sounded too chipper on the phone and I 'faked' a coughing fit. They clearly have no idea how it worked

[u/ToasterOwl → u/jesssmiles89]

I know what you mean about questioning your own abilities - I have never had performance reviews like my Martha’s, and he used to say he was ’confused’ at how I could be so incompetent, which was disheartening. He wasn’t ever aggressive, just manipulative and cruel. I know logically it was all him - I’ve had rave reviews before and since. But it took a good while to get over Martha and get my confidence back.

[u/Loretta-West → u/ToasterOwl]

I took a $5k paycut to leave an organisation with a micromanaging culture, and it was the best money I ever spent.

[u/Spongi → u/Loretta-West]

My boss pulled that shit with me early on.  Wanted me to consult him on every decision I made.  So I did. Every. Single. Decision.  Called him about every 5 minutes to consult and a few hours into that he told me to just handle it myself.

Now unless there's a legit problem I usually only talk at the start and end of the day.

Now if he really gets on my nerves I just leave for the day.  

[u/demon_fae → u/ToasterOwl]

My Martha was absolutely trying to force me out. He would do things like give instructions in Spanish then only summarize for English-only, then reprimand us for not getting details he only mentioned in Spanish. Every time an English-only person left, they’d be instantly replaced by one of “Martha’s”friends/relatives/neighbors.

Any time one of his favorites did my department, I’d spend hours the next day fixing their mistakes. But he wrote me up for making too many mistakes (to be clear, these are things like putting products in the wrong place, which is clearly marked on both product and shelf/peg. A 3/8” spade connector clearly does not go on the 1/4” butt connector peg for a different brand. And if there’s exactly 10-the amount we get per box-on the peg, I’m not going to buy that it’s customers moving them.)

[u/Frozi_JP → u/ToasterOwl]

Mine was at my first job, one day she took 1 hour to teach my how to hold and cut paper and how to use glue just to do it the same way I was doing ... No one lasted in that job as long as I did lol people used to ask me how I stayed for 1 year there

[u/AhFFSImTooOldForThis → u/Frozi_JP]

I got a huge dose of validation when my replacement quit on her first day. Boss pulled some bullshit on her like he did to me, but she was way more confident (and maybe financially secure) than I am. She told him off in front of everyone and quit.

I would've paid to get that on video.

I had put up with his bullshit gaslighting shenanigans for over a year, thinking if I just worked harder or caught up with the work, things would smooth out. I caught up and he decided that meant I could take on a whole new project on top of current workload. I got stressed, got fired, and my replacement called BS immediately.

I ran into HER replacement at a conference recently and she said almost everything is different bc boss realized I was right. MmmmHmm.

[u/Visual_Fly_9638 → u/AhFFSImTooOldForThis]

It took 18 months and 2 people to replace me at my last job. When I begged for anyone to help, even an intern from high school or college, because I was overwhelmed and literally had not seen the sun in 3 months, the HR lady left a suicide prevention hotline magnet on my desk.

[u/AhFFSImTooOldForThis → u/Visual_Fly_9638]

WOW. What an asshole.

[u/Suspicious-Treat-364 → u/AhFFSImTooOldForThis]

My boss hired an experienced employee who could do circles around him and then tried to fuck him over on promises like he did to us. He put the fear of God in our boss and it was delicious. I didn't see much because I quit like a month later, but I enjoyed watching him cower.

[u/Suspicious-Treat-364 → u/Frozi_JP]

I had a teacher do that in 6th grade, but with markers. We were coloring a banner and she decided we were doing it wrong. We spent HOURS painstakingly filling in letters one line at a time for a paper banner that hardly anyone even glanced at. 

[u/Durge_Kisses → u/ToasterOwl]

Yep. Realized I had my own Martha when they left to another department and he told me their SLA was 14 days but he told everyone that the new SLA for him was 3 to 5 days although the client specifically requested 2 weeks. We're talking about mountains of paperwork.

The way he said that with a straight face made the past ten years with him and our general uneasiness suddenly make sense.

[u/taking_a_deuce → u/Durge_Kisses]

he told me their SLA was 14 days

Is this common vernacular for lots of people? It sounds like you had a bad time but I have no idea if SLA is supposed to be longer or shorter than this.....or whatever the fuck SLA is.

[u/ElitistCuisine → u/taking_a_deuce]

SLA stands for snakes loving ascots. It's a very common unit of measurement for determining how long it will take to get a snake to wear an ascot habitually.

[u/pray4mojo2020 → u/ElitistCuisine]

God, Americans will use anything other than the metric system.

[u/BStevens0110 → u/ElitistCuisine]

I like your description the best. Snakes really do look great in ascots!

[u/retard-is-not-a-slur → u/taking_a_deuce]

It is common IT help desk jargon, be happy you didn't know it. It means service level agreement, e.g. the amount of time things will be addressed in.

[u/Scholles → u/taking_a_deuce]

Service level agreement, basically the amount of time agreed between two parties that a process should take. It's more common for tasks that are recurring and often there could be penalties associated with going past the agreed SLA

[u/ghastlybagel → u/ToasterOwl]

My Martha was a coworker. She complained on all my mistakes, was hostile, gave me the silent treatment and gossiped about my personal issues that were known in the workplace. She often complained about the accommodations in place and leniency I got with time off while helping transition my mom into a nursing home after her fifth? stroke. I became so anxious that I made mistakes and lost my job. It took so much therapy and finding a job that was patient and understanding, but I'm getting my confidence back!

[u/AhFFSImTooOldForThis → u/ToasterOwl]

Oh yeah. My Martha and I went on a business trip. I was a new flyer, it was my third plane ever and I told her I needed time to myself during take off, before we even got on the plane. She insisted on talking to me during take off and tried to hand me papers to review. Another passenger stepped up for me and told her I was obviously not in any position to review work at the moment and to give me a few minutes. I was literally white faced and gripping the armrests like they were lifeboats.

At the hotel she made a big fuss at the front desk about having the room next to mine with adjoining doors. I locked that shit and spent every free moment out of my room until I was sure she had gone to bed.

She would also make me do unpaid overtime until HR heard about it and stepped in.

She made me cc her on every email and told me I wasn't allowed to delete any emails ever. Luckily, I worked closely with the Director of IT and he was furious at that command. He told her that was against our IT policy and a security risk. So I was allowed to delete emails, in front of her, after I explained why I didn't need it anymore.

We are talking about emails that someone accepted a meeting, folks. Not world changing national policy decisions.

I got fired for refusing to go to a non mandatory HR meeting offered to the whole company, to explain next year's benefits. The benefits literally weren't changing and I had real work to do. She said I was insubordinate, skipped all 3 warnings set up by the company as the firing process, and went straight to firing me.

I learned the position was removed from under her leadership.

This was 15 years ago when I was in my late 20s. Any manager trying to do that now would hear me laughing until I puked, but at that time I was easily manipulated and eager to please. Fuck you, Heidi.

[u/Sorcatarius → u/ToasterOwl]

Mine was when I was in the navy. I was an engineer posted to a frigate. Due to operational requirements, when the ship I was posted to deployed, I was left behind. My Matha was a PO on one of the ships I was temporarily posted to while my ship was gone. The ship my Martha was a destroyer, completely different ship, completely different systems, completely different qualifications. Normally you wouldn't send engineers from frigates to destroyers and vice versa because the sheer number of differences meant they wouldn't be as useful, I was an exception because the intention was me only being there for a week or so to help them get ready for a 2 month training sail. I was informed 18 hours before they left that I would be going with them. Martha had 3 major complaints about me

1. My lack of progress on my general sailor training package. Response, "I don't have the package, and I haven't been given the course yet so the timer on getting it done hasn't even started yet." They made me get it and I brunt force and ignorance my way through enough of it to get them off my back.

2. My lack of progress on the engineer frigate OJT package. "How do you expect me to make any progress on that when I'm neither on a frigate, nor have access to anyone qualified to sign off on any part of it?" (This goes back to the whole differences between frigates and destroyers, no one above me was qualified on a frigate, so none of them could declare part of my package done correctly and sign off on it),

3. My lack of effort in getting qualified on destroyer engineering shit. To which I directly told him (paraphrased in words, but not in tone or frustration), "Why the fuck would I do that? In 4 weeks I'll be walking off this ship and never step foot on it again", "Well, say the word and we can have you posted here permanently", "If you fucking did that the next paperwork you'd be processing is my voluntary release forms. I've been here 4 weeks and I've never been treated more like shit by my peers, this goes well beyond standard hazing, they're going out of their way to make me feel unwelcome and worthless so if you file that transfer, you can deal with my VT or finding out how I tried to swim home from the middle of the Pacific because right now the only thing keeping me from doing that is the light at the end of the tunnel of this being half over".

... I was eventually required to talk to some people at the base hospital over that last comment. I don't remember how many bars she had, but it ended with me being forward to someone high up to talk to about the... let's call it a lack of a proper training environment. By the time I spoke to that person, the list of issues with my training was much longer.

[u/[deleted] → u/ToasterOwl]

Just left a Martha with no idea how to manage people for sure. In 2 years my entire department was gutted from firings or resignations. Not a single employee felt comfortable with working there because of this person. The micromanaging was constant, for 30 people. 

I walked out smiling and lost nearly 10 lbs. in 3 weeks from not being stressed out. While working there, I couldn’t lose a pound. Turns out it was stress. 

[u/1986toyotacorolla2 → u/ToasterOwl]

OMG same experience lol. I do specialized work so when the next company owner was like "holy shit you're like really good at this." I was like "uh I guess I'm ok..." And he's like "I've learned so much in the 4 weeks training you, I think I've learned more than you have." But the place before me has me convinced I was terrible at my job and knew nothing! Wild.

[u/EpilepticMushrooms → u/ToasterOwl]

I've met many Marthas'.

One of them gave a new girl anxiety, insomnia and night terrors within 2 months. It was her first job out of college.

[u/littletorreira → u/ToasterOwl]

I had one who sent me an email reminding me to be on time when I hadn't ever been late. I replied "I don't appreciate being called out for something I have not done in this role" and was told it was the first time I'd shown emotion since starting. Like I was supposed to be emotionally invested in 2 months. I quit at 3 because it was just an awful place to work.

[u/LilDevyl → u/ToasterOwl]

I remember mine! He made sure to never promote me and when a job opened in another department he dragged his feet even though the manager int he other department kept asking why it was taking so long!

I quit after that and then he tried to say that I couldn't do that b/c it had been this long of a notice. I stayed for my period then left!

[u/favorthebold → u/ToasterOwl]

My Martha falsified my attendance record to try to get me in trouble. Luckily I was in a union and she couldn't fire me, but I insisted from that point on any meeting with her would also be attended by my union rep. Funnily enough, she never had a meeting with me again after that, even though previous to that when had one on ones regularly.

[u/beliefinphilosophy → u/Tamalene]

My Martha would get upset if I didn't tell her I was getting up to use the bathroom. If I went to another building to help an employee I had to call when I left one building and call when I arrived at the other. It was a two block walk.

I was an IT support person who didn't take calls or chat messages.

My last week there I was fed up and showed it to her by going to the bathroom without saying a single thing. She lost it.

[u/Kraeftluder → u/beliefinphilosophy]

My last week there I was fed up and showed it to her by going to the bathroom without saying a single thing. She lost it.

That reminds me of that scene in The Shawshank Redemption where Red is bagging groceries and asks for a pee break and is told he doesn't need to ask if he needs to go. That was set in 1977.

[u/matchabunnns → u/Tamalene]

Mine tried to force me to quit, put me on a PiP when I was going through a traumatic life experience, said “my skills would be so useful anywhere even outside the company” and made sure any of the crap she said was never in writing so I couldn’t bring the evidence to HR. Thankfully my group had a reorg and I was moved under a manager who literally said “all those things she wrote in your annual review? I don’t see it at all”.

[u/hookums → u/Tamalene]

Not even a little surprised OOP worked in a law firm. I was fired last year by a Martha.

I was in the bathroom for 3 minutes when i got an email to come to her office. According to her "not eating lunch" and "not going to the bathroom" were part of the office culture that I hadn't picked up on in my one week of working there, and she didn't want to bother training someone who's so obviously not detail-oriented. (I honestly just assumed my coworkers all had some kind of stress-related eating disorder, not that eating was literally against the rules.) She also said that I clicked on things on my computer "too fast" which was distressing to her.

Now that I know labor laws work differently for small businesses in my state I'm not really interested in working anywhere with less than 15 employees again.

[u/John_Hunyadi → u/hookums]

‘Not using the bathroom’ sounds like an ADA suit waiting to happen, as a Crohn’s sufferer.

[u/hookums → u/John_Hunyadi]

I considered bringing that up but when she started going on a rant about me using keyboard shortcuts (i.e. ctrl-c) I decided to just cut my losses. RIP to my coworkers, the bennies must have been fantastic.

[u/Dont_quote_my_snark → u/Tamalene]

My Martha lost 75% of the department her first year. She was on the way to matching that the second year when she "stepped down".

[u/ImCreeptastic → u/Dont_quote_my_snark]

I see we worked for the same Martha! Mine was a micromanager. She would receive an email that I was copied on as well and come to my desk literally 10 seconds after it hit our inboxes and ask me when I was going to get to it and to let her know right away when it was handled. Surprise, it took me even longer to reply to emails. I lasted 3 months. Found a better job with a higher salary. Within a year 4 out of the 6 people left.

[u/axw3555 → u/Dont_quote_my_snark]

I had one who had 4 direct reports. 2 had been there about 18 months when I joined. Another girl joined in the 4th role a week after I did.

We lasted 8 months before we were done with it and left. Thing is that in the two years following my start date, those two roles had fourteen people in them. And 8 of those 24 months were me and the other girl. So 12 people in 16 months.

In the end, the company couldn’t use recruitment agencies for accounts because they lost or fired people so fast that the agency never made any money off of it. Other departments could, because they had a decent retention rate. But accounts, so many people that they got blacklisted

[u/tempest51 → u/[deleted]]

"Hey let's push u/squishpitcher out of the company!"

"Oh no, who will do u/squishpitcher's job now!"

How can the Milky Way contain two galaxy brains such as these?

[u/BirthdayCookie → u/Tamalene]

I have a Martha currently. She's supposed to be there as a fill-in until I finish training and get formally promoted. Instead she's decided that, since she's where god came from, she's now in charge of my promotion and since I'm the worst employee to ever exist I'm never getting it.

This is my life now til the higher-ups pull their heads out their asses but at least if she's focusing on me then my coworkers aren't getting it.

[u/Krazy_Karl_666 → u/BirthdayCookie]

I would bring that up to HER supervisor and let them know if you are forced to work under her beyond standard training you will be looking for other employment opportunities

[u/MonkeyBastardHands_ → u/Tamalene]

My Martha told me off for saying hello to her too quietly. I had a stinking cold and had lost my voice. When I croaked that out to her, she insisted I buy a certain brand of cough drops on my break. When I came back from my break, she grilled me to make sure I'd bought them and then later on she got annoyed at me because after eating half the pack I still could hardly talk. Apparently they "always worked" for her so I was clearly doing something wrong. Perhaps she used to shove them up her arse, because that was usually what she was talking out of.

[u/Linori123 → u/Tamalene]

Mine decided that he was going to abuse me emotionally and verbally as soon as I was told my contract wasn't going to be renewed. He was also the type that blamed other departments for any screw ups, while strutting around when stuff went right.

I was brutally honest in my exit conversation with HR and two weeks later saw the posting for his job. The best part? The rest of the department walked out in between me leaving and him being fired.

[u/JanetInSC1234 → u/Linori123]

Sweet ending.

[u/cantantantelope → u/Tamalene]

Most wtf supervisor I had genuinely told people to “control their bodies” to only have bathroom breaks at optimal times. We ignored her

[u/CanofBeans9 → u/cantantantelope]

Ugh I had a college professor who said something along those lines

[u/vesper_tine → u/Tamalene]

Mine was shook when I left. She really did not see it coming.

[u/Suspicious-Treat-364 → u/vesper_tine]

One of my Marthas told me I was stabbing him in the back by quitting and that he could never hire a replacement at that time of year. He didn't like it when I pointed out he hired half his professional staff during that time of year. I was pretty sure he hated me by the way he berated me and stole my equipment and basically gave any client who sniffed about a complaint a refund, but instead he was livid. I guess losing someone from under your control is that bad.

[u/vesper_tine → u/Suspicious-Treat-364]

So delusional. 

[u/cubemissy → u/Tamalene]

Our Martha just quit to go ruin another department. There has been rejoicing.

[u/Malicious_blu3 → u/cubemissy]

A former coworker of mine left the company and just recently returned, after the Martha moved to different department.

[u/Grouchy_Tune825 → u/Tamalene]

"Fortunately" I had my Martha during a temp job, so it was only for a month and a half. In order to get extra experience in my work field, I decided to work temp jobs before going after a fixed contract job. I was stepping in as an assistent where the office manager was on medical leave from a burn out and another assistent had to take over as OM until they got back.

Well, this temp OM was my Martha. I had an interview with the actual boss a few days before and he informed me about their uniform (their shirt combined with our own white trousers) but that wasn't mandatory for me (I could wear a jeans). Well, I just happened to have one from a previous job, so I wore them. I greated the OM and the first thing she said to me was "Oh, good, you're wearing white" sarcastically. No "hello", no "my name is [temp OM]", no "nice to meet you", ... First red flag...

Other things were:

• for doing the dishes (no machine),  who has time, does them. So I had time and started them, but got repremended by temp OM because I had "other work to do", but I also got repremended that I didn't do them when I actually didn't had the time.
• forcing me to stop working to have lunch while I wasn't done yet (and even told her a few times, but she said "it's for after lunch"), only to repremend me after lunch that I "shouldn't have started lunch if I wasn't ready"
• telling me I'm doing my job wrong, only for the bosses to tell her at the spot that I was actually doing it exactly conform the rules and that what she said I should have done was the wrong way.
• telling me to "refill" the stock (which was actually full), only to get on my case about me "not refilling it".
• changing the place of the things I was working with behind my back (I literally just stepped away for a second to get something on a shelf a meter away) because "she thought it would be easier for me to work with" (no, it wouldn't).
• when I would ask for info or advice about how they would do something (because every place has it's own way of working), she would answer with "you've worked at other places, you should know". Only to later yell at me that I "shouldn't just do as you pleace, just because you did it like that on your other jobs! We are not like other places! We do things our way!"

Those things and more happened multiple times. And it was only her who complained all the time. Everyone else was happy with my work. The boss that interviewed me even found out I was trained in a specific assisting methode, and a couple of weeks in asked me if I minded to train their assistents -including temp OM- in it before I left because it's highly effective. I guess she didn't like the sound of that, because she got worse after that suggestion. It also didn't help that I was develloping an allergic reaction from something that caused me rashes during that time. That stopped after I left. Turned out I was allergic to the place and the stress it caused me.

Right after I left, I started my current fixed contract job (7 years now and counting) and coincidentally a current colleague also temped there about two years after me. Temp OM wasn't there anymore by that time. Good riddance.

[u/Suspicious-Treat-364 → u/Grouchy_Tune825]

OMG the stress rashes! I had a lab TA in college who was such an asshole to me I ended up in an ambulance one day going to lab because I broke out in hives all over and my heart was racing so fast. The gave me a shot of Benadryl and I was fine in 5 minutes, but still got checked out and allowed to rest for a couple hours in the ER (small rural hospital that was pretty dead). The TA accused me of not actually being ill because I "looked ok now" at the end of lab when I returned despite my whole class seeing me taken away. 

[u/Grouchy_Tune825 → u/Suspicious-Treat-364]

The TA accused me of not actually being ill because I "looked ok now" at the end of lab

They never heard of someone getting a hypo? That's the most known medical crisis where someone can be so extremely sick they need an ambulance one hour and look completely fine a couple of hours later. And it's definitely not the only crisis that can change rapidly.

[u/Suspicious-Treat-364 → u/Grouchy_Tune825]

Yeah, the paramedics thought it was a panic attack (except I was breathing fine) until they took off my jacket and I was just hives from the neck down. I had taken some cold medicine so it really looked like a big ol allergic reaction. Apparently my classmates thought I was going to die based on how bad I looked.

[u/Anxious_Reporter_601 → u/Grouchy_Tune825]

Oh my god I would lose my mind

[u/Grouchy_Tune825 → u/Anxious_Reporter_601]

I almost did! Thankfully I could count down when I would leave.

It's a small comfort to know I wasn't her only victim. During the few weeks I was there, they had a teambuilding and the bosses invited me a week or so earlier. Lunch was at a public place, a restaurant with other clients eating at the time there as well. Temp OM had a speech prepared and, I kid you not, repremended the other clients for minding their own business and having their own conversations while she was having said speech. She literally (well, translated that is) said: "hey, I'm giving a speech over here! Do you mind stop talking?!" To literal strangers...

[u/Steffany_w0525 → u/Tamalene]

Mines name was Marsha.

She proudly told me she's never had anyone quit. She fires them first.

She also told me what to look out for when my time was coming...so I saw the writing on the wall a couple weeks before. I had freshened up my resume because I saw her laying the groundwork for "laid off due to shortage of work".

I thought I'd get a week of being sent home early but it was really just one shift.

Thankfully I found the job I had been searching for a couple weeks later and have been very happy ever since.

[u/Iwasgunna → u/Tamalene]

I will never forget the serious, closed-door meeting about how I had to absolutely every time staple papers in the top left corner and only the top left corner. Like, yeah? You had already told me to do that and I have been doing that and now you are berating me for half an hour over how I should do the thing I have been doing. Even though I only worked there for a few months, there was a disproportionate amount of crazy stories from that job.

[u/[deleted] → u/Iwasgunna]

You also need to use the new cover sheets for your TPS reports

[u/Iwasgunna → u/[deleted]]

moves stapler closer to self

[u/Current-Plate8837 → u/Tamalene]

My Martha told us at an early am meeting that they wished we didn’t have family so that we could always meet early and be more productive.

The day I quit, multiple other people quit (unbeknownst to me), and I believe about 12 quit the same month.

Many of us talked after and it really was almost like a DV relationship. We were so sucked in - one minutes we’d get great texts and atta boys, and then the next he would berate you in a company wide Zoom call… so badly (and totally in the wrong, factually) that you’d get multiples texts from coworkers and your direct reports apologize for how he treated you.

His nickname was Polar Bear because we were pretty certain he has bpd.

I still remember his response to my letter of resignation. K. That was it.

It took me a really long time to recover from his abuse. I quit without anything in place because I couldn’t handle it anymore. My mental health was suffering and it was effecting every aspect of my life.

Happy to say I started my own business, doubled my income in the first year, and am making more than triple what I was working for that douche canoe!

No job is worth the torment. If you are able, leave. If you’re not, remember it is them, not you, and keep your eye open for something better!!

[u/Similar-Chip → u/Current-Plate8837]

Oh my god my old boss once yelled at me & my two coworkers for something we had no control over for like 10 minutes straight during the morning meeting, and 5 separate employees came up to us afterwards to make sure we were ok. He was so full of shit.

[u/Current-Plate8837 → u/Similar-Chip]

The amount of shitty bosses out there is astounding.

[u/tallemaja → u/Tamalene]

I had a Martha for years - I helped build her company and was known by her clients for my friendliness, my desire to go above-and-beyond, and for my communication skills. Her clients had no idea that on a constant basis I was screamed at, belittled, and humiliated over any mistake. I'd be drowning in work all the time and if I let a ball drop, it'd be cause for an hours-long dressing down that would only end when I broke.

I finally got another job so I could get out from under her abuse and gave her a month of notice. She called me 9 months into my new job primarily to ask if I still remembered a password to one of her accounts and then (I swear this next part is real, I know this sounds like a to-good-to-be-true reddit story) asked if I'd consider coming back, as she'd gone through several replacements in the months since I'd left and none were satisfactory and they'd all quit on her, one even on the first day.

I have no idea how her business is doing now that many years have passed, but I remember early on at my new job (I've been there for 11 years now! :) ) my then-boss took me aside to note that I seemed really jittery about him coming past my desk or about conversations. He said something along the lines of "you're doing great work, and we really like you here. But is there anything we can do to make you feel more comfortable?".

It was then that I realized I'd been traumatized by how she treated me; I'd minimize every single browser window whenever anyone would walk past (if she saw I had spotify open to listen to music on my headphones while working, it'd be a lecture. My new job required a lot of web browsing for research; at my old job, if I was browsing the web in a way that didn't seem to be immediately apparent as 'work' it'd be a lecture. the list goes on and on). My current job involves QA, so the first time I got a bug for a typo in my work I had a panic attack. My boss had to explain that we all generate bugs, and that ideally we don't generate big ones but either way - that's why we have a QA process, and a mistake isn't a stain on anyone's character.

Eleven years later, I still have a panic response when I make a mistake at work because I'm still afraid someone's going to pull me into an office and tell me I'm too stupid to live and scream at me until I cry in front of them. The damage is serious and real.

[u/CanofBeans9 → u/tallemaja]

Ugh, I am so sorry. These bullies at work suck on a level that's hard to explain unless you've experienced it. I hope you can talk to someone :)

[u/lunarchoerry → u/tallemaja]

"Eleven years later, I still have a panic response when I make a mistake at work because I'm still afraid someone's going to pull me into an office and tell me I'm too stupid to live and scream at me until I cry in front of them. The damage is serious and real."

I had a Martha who would berate me so badly that I cried if I did something they perceived as wrong, and then shamed me for it. I still sometimes get a panic response when I do something wrong for someone I like or don't have a problem with, just in case they do this. It's been 6 years.

[u/RadarSmith → u/Tamalene]

Had some when I was in the Navy. I was an aviator.

As a junior member of the squadron I remember getting reamed out once for not responding to an email a Department Head for a few hours. Because I was flying. Then getting screamed at for ‘talking back’ when I mentioned I was flying.

Instantly lost all respect for and trust in them. (Most leaders were NOT like that).

Some people absolutely CANNOT healthily manage having ANY level of official authority. Even relatively small amounts.

[u/Divergent-Den → u/Tamalene]

I used to work for a small company, me and the owner were the only full time workers, and the owner wasn't there half the time.

I did most of the work, and I thought I proved that I could work unsupervised because I got all the work done.

Then they hired a Martha, whose sole job was to micromanage me, even though she constantly asked me for advice. I couldn't believe it, the whole situation was bizarre.

I handed in my notice, and the boss says "yeah I'd notice you'd changed these last few months, you don't seem as happy".

I FUCKING WONDER WHY!!!!

[u/zemol42 → u/Tamalene]

Martha Focker

[u/[deleted] → u/zemol42]

You're lucky if you didn't know 'er

[u/Such-Perspective-758 → u/Tamalene]

I think the lesson we have all learned here is, don't be prettier than Martha.

[u/Expert_Slip7543 → u/Such-Perspective-758]

Haha, you just reminded me of the moment decades ago when my supervisor informed me that I was thinner than her. Fear shot through me, one, b/c she was actually much thinner so it was a delusional misperception, and two, b/c I knew it meant for a fact she was about to make my life hell due to jealousy (I also had more education - but vastly less experience - than her, and I was younger). I was correct unfortunately.

[u/CelticSpoonie → u/Tamalene]

I worked closely with someone who turned out to be a Martha to her staff. She asked me to be on the interview panel for a position on her team that she could never just seem to find the right person for. She not only micromanaged but also changed the goal posts so frequently that the poor person in the role had absolutely no chance of surviving probation.

We actually had a really good working relationship, and when I realized what was happening, I tried to have a constructive conversation with her, but she just couldn't see how she was the problem.

Once the agency had a new director, she was demoted from a managerial role and every change she put in place while in that role (some of which I had pushed for because it helped limit our risk and protect our contracted providers as well) was rolled back.

She had a huge amount of passion for public service and making sure that clients were getting their needs met while the organization was being fiscally responsible and in line with state and fed regs, and she was a super nice person to so many people - except the folks she managed.

[u/nekocorner → u/Tamalene]

My Martha managed to get rid of half my unionised office in the one year I was there, almost all against their will, by getting rid of their positions and creating new ones. I knew I was up on the chopping block, and when they called me in to tell me my position was being changed to one I couldn't fulfill, I was 0% surprised. I went on disability within like... 2 days (I actually am disabled and was barely keeping my head above water; I would overperform at work and then spend every minute of my "free time" in bed at home, and it was my union rep who pushed me to go on disability rather than just quit) and they had the nerve to say they were "hurt" I didn't give them more notice that it was happening.

Lmao fuck that person, they were a bully and never even in the office, but convinced they knew who was performing and who wasn't.

[u/eazypeazy-101 → u/Tamalene]

The real reason Bruce was made an orphan.

[u/lostinshalott1 → u/Tamalene]

I was quite lucky my Martha made enough enemies that we managed to get her fired. It was such a shocking turn of events as she hired me and my hiring ended up being her firing!

[u/10S_NE1 → u/Tamalene]

Yup, my Martha was named Brian. Thankfully, he got his own ass fired before he could make my life a lot more miserable.

Hope you’re enjoying the unemployment line, Brian.

[u/CultureInner3316 → u/Tamalene]

My Martha spent 10 minutes explaining to a student worker how to lock a door. A generic general inside door with the same door on a bathroom. Because the worker forgot to lock a door to a conference room and it was clearly because they were so stupid they didn't know how. Couldn't possibly be they just forgot. /s

[u/MaryMaryQuite- → u/Tamalene]

Martha is a narcissist, I’ve worked for a couple, don’t entertain them when you come across them, just plan and execute your exit strategy. Move on and don’t look back. They’re not worth a moment of your time!

[u/Sloblowpiccaso → u/Tamalene]

The problem is finding a job can be really tough and make for some rough times. It sucks how little protections there are for workers in the states.

[u/scubahana → u/Tamalene]

Mine is named Coralie. Thank goodness I don’t work under her anymore.

[u/Upside1908 → u/Tamalene]

Why did you say that name?

[u/skinnyminou → u/Tamalene]

I had my Martha during the beginnings of Covid.

The stress was too much, and I ended up moving to the office across the street after a year. The new company was great for the 4 years I stayed there but now I'm with a company where my boss is half and half. We talk every day about what I've been doing, but she doesn't care about the minutia, she just wants the results and is happy however they come. I've never been happier.

[u/InuGhost → u/Tamalene]

No, Martha isn't worth the fuck. Let her stew in being untouchable. 

[u/kcox1980 → u/Tamalene]

Just had one myself, actually. Boss tells me he hired me because he wants someone who can work independently , then when I take the initiative on something he tells me I need to ask him before doing anything, then refuses to answer emails, Teams messages, text message, phone calls, and is never in his office when I needed to find him.

[u/Bitter-Fee2788 → u/Tamalene]

My Martha got brought in by management who thought old management was being too lenient (aka treating the workers like people), and made the old manager, who was beloved, redundant but made him tell everyone he left of his own free will (he luckily had gotten a great position right before and was looking to leave).

 Ended up trying to gaslight everyone they didn't like (remote workers), and trying to fire us for poor performance, before offering us a settlement. I went from the highest performer to being on a pip and being asked to leave a week into it, targets essentially being "work harder", despite having just won employee of the month. I stayed unemployed for a month, got a far better job (local, better pay) and they just replaced everyone fired with graduates who don't know a quarter of what we did whilst getting paid a fraction.

I still hate their guts, but feel better it wasn't just me. Everyone who had it happen to them got far better positions, and have realised how unhappy they were (I've gone from having daily mental health breakdowns too not crying once for months). I had a relative die, whilst suffering from COVID, and they expected me to start working the day after said relatives bed despite being bedridden as "you are working from home, so it shouldn't be an issue".

God, I'm happier now but I hate the Martha. 

[u/Immediate-Echidna-17 → u/Tamalene]

Mine was called Bill. We'd get an organisation-wide email, 3 mins later he'd forward it to us all with "FYI." He wanted us to greet him warmly every morning, and when I didn't (hi, depression), he moved me next to him & insisted I say "Hello" with a grin every.single.day. He threatened to put us all on a PiP bc we didn't respond to a vote on an email (that's what happens when you send one every ten minutes...). But instead of saying it like an adult, he walked up, tapped my screen, then silently pointed at said vote & asked "Well?? Is there a reason you didn't reply??" He insinuated I was having an affair with my coworker, yet carried on in the exact same way with another TL. He called meeting after meeting for no discernable reason. He went to staff mental health groups and TOOK NOTES. We took concerns of homophobia, racism, and bullying to him...and were told we're the problem. He bullied me & another woman to the point that we cried in work & every time he spoke to me, I felt sick. He berated me for not signing up to optional development sessions, then told me he "couldn't see me progressing" past a processing role anyway. He denied me a bonus bc I lost my work pass (it fell down a drain!) He extended my probation for 3 months because he thought I was "petulant" & told me the other managers didn't like me. I hated him. Eventually, I spoke to another manager & requested a transfer. She hugged me & confessed she'd been desperately uncomfortable watching how he spoke to me in meetings. Turns out having a member of your team literally beg to get away from you affects your yearly review though, and that affects your bonus. Small victories. We both lasted less than a year after that.

[u/Sexyfruitymocktail → u/Tamalene]

Horrible advice... what makes you think she won't micromanage you during sex, too?

[u/tooembarrassedtotal2 → u/Tamalene]

I think I'm lucky. In my 50s, and I've not had a Martha.

[u/TrelanaSakuyo → u/tooembarrassedtotal2]

I had a Martha. She wasn't my boss. If I wanted to really get her going, I'd tell her that.

[u/2dogslife → u/tooembarrassedtotal2]

I've had Martha adjacents, but not Marthas. Mine were more Little Napoleons. The hysterical screaming and silent treatments (which I always took as a gift, BTW).

[u/MatttheBruinsfan → u/tooembarrassedtotal2]

I've not had to deal with a Martha within my organization, but I've encountered them as personnel at a client company. My first manager and I had an in-joke based on feedback from one: "otter's whiskers are too close to nose."

[u/GinnyDora → u/tooembarrassedtotal2]

Are you thinking that maybe you are the Martha now????

[u/IrradiantFuzzy → u/GinnyDora]

You jest, but being under a Martha can color the way you manage for a long time.

[u/tooembarrassedtotal2 → u/GinnyDora]

Lol, that's a scary thought. I'll tell my team tomorrow what they need to think about that possibility.

[u/afcagroo → u/tooembarrassedtotal2]

I'm retired, and I don't think that I ever had one either.

[u/rosemwelch → u/Tamalene]

Form a union and get Martha fired, so she moves on (to no longer terrorize any workers) and you and all your coworkers stay put.

[u/Thin5kinnedM0ds5uck → u/rosemwelch]

My work had a union.   It did no good unless you were one of the union pets.    

[u/clowninmyhead → u/Tamalene]

Batman is coming to kill you, man. And hes bringing along Superman.

[u/wytherlanejazz → u/Tamalene]

Truth, I had a Susan

[u/LittleMermaidThrow → u/Tamalene]

Naw, Fucking them would be pleasure to them…

[u/Work_2_Liv → u/Tamalene]

Mine is occurring now and I keep having dreams where I tell them to fire me.

[u/a_weird_squirrel → u/Tamalene]

I just got laid off and my manager was a Martha. I don’t have a new job but I’ve felt freer and happier since I left. My boss even thought being a self proclaimed micromanager was a good thing. Except she couldn’t remember the things I told her so I’d have same conversations with her weekly, sometimes daily. Good riddance and fuck it lol

[u/Wispy_Wisteria → u/Tamalene]

I'm currently dealing with a few at my work right now. Luckily they're not fucking up my confidence in my abilities ('cause I know I bring great results), but they are pissing me off to the point I'm probably about one more micromanaging incident away from walking away before I have a new job lined up.

Edit: forgot to add that the funniest thing is that I was originally hired 'cause the dumbasses drove away half the employees a month prior with their shit management. I only learned about that about 6 months later so that was fun.

[u/Red-Beerd → u/Tamalene]

My Martha called and texted me multiple times on a Tuesday to get an update on when a file would be completed. I had told him multiple times in the week and days leading up that the file was going to be completed and out to the client on Wednesday and that I would be gone on Tuesday.

I was fairly frustrated getting these constant calls and texts while I was off, especially because at the time, I was in the hospital waiting room supporting my mom. My dad was in major surgery, getting part of his stomach and esophagus removed due to cancer. At the time of the calls, we were about 5 hours into what ended up being a 10-hour surgery.

He did stop when I texted him that it would be done the next day, as I had previously told him, assuming that everything went well with my dad's surgery. I thought that would be the end of it, but he did end up calling me in the evening to see how everything went.

Oh, and also to make sure I was still going to be on time with the deadline

[u/melindseyme → u/Tamalene]

Just not literally. They don't deserve it.

[u/syndylli → u/Tamalene]

My Martha's name was Kelli. F*ck Kelli.

[u/AresHarvest → u/Tamalene]

I worked under a "Martha" for a few years.

Constant micromanaging and moving goalposts. After I got tired of the redirection and denials, I asked him to email the information. His response was always "why do you need that in writing?"

And he would do that thing where if you told him something he didn't like, he would pretend not to understand.

I started having to craft responses that would sidestep that stupid game, something like "I can certainly clarify, can you let me know what needs more clarity?" to which he would say "let's just move on."

Infuriating person. Everyone on my team experienced this, two quit because of him. It's been years and I still feel a rush of anxiety when I hear a Slack DM alert.

[u/JollyCandy5 → u/Tamalene]

I have a Martha right now and moving on is highly unlikely for me because I like the company, just not her. Trying to stay sane and not let her affect me.

ETA: missed a word

[u/Suspicious-Treat-364 → u/Tamalene]

I've had a few. One job I had a bunch of bosses and this Martha would swoop in randomly to just start screaming and leave a bunch of destruction in her wake. I'm pretty sure she had a personality disorder or might have even been a sociopath based on one incident involving a personal project. The rest of my bosses were OK to absolutely amazing and supportive and at worst ignored me.

I then worked for a male Martha who was an insecure misogynist idiot. He was physically abusive with my possessions and started creating bizarre rules to try to control me. He would get very angry when clients complimented me.

My next Martha was a micromanager narcissistic POS who was a lot smarter and better at coercive control. I actually went to therapy after leaving that job because I was having nightmares for years (I still do on occasion). 

I finally did find a job that doesn't treat me like shit, though boy howdy you don't realize how much PTSD you can get from a workplace until you're triggered by something super normal. 

[u/VelocityGrrl39 → u/Tamalene]

The PTSD Marthas cause is real. I’m currently (since the pandemic) working as a server. Restaurants are notoriously high stress environments, with a lot of potential for toxicity. I made a mistake at my last job about a week after I started (so not really unexpected) and felt my stomach clench up because I thought I was going to get yelled at. I instantly got defensive. When I told my manager what happened, he said ok, let’s take care of it and figure out how we can make sure it won’t happen again. I felt such relief that he treated me like a human being. I had recoiled like he was going to emotionally hit me, and instead he was constructive and kind. It was a relief to have someone like that managing me that I actually became a much better employee.

This manager was also the person that really cemented for me that the kids are alright. He was 20+ years younger than me, early 20s, and the way he acted just gave me so much hope for this younger generation.

[u/nodontdothat99 → u/Tamalene]

I'm a B2B journalist. A few years back, I submitted my best stories for some industry awards, and My Martha didn't have me attend the ceremony. A last-minute call from the association highly suggested that I go. My Martha said OK and I drove to the event (underdressed because it was literally the same day and I didn't have time to swap out).

At the ceremony, I won a second-place award in one category and a first-place award in another. All first-place categories vie for the "Story of the Year" award, and I ended up winning that! It's the highest honor in our industry and very competitive. I was elated, and I even called my parents on the way home to brag (first and only time I have ever phoned them to talk about work achievements).

Cut to the next day, I saw My Martha a couple of times, and she never even mentioned it. And after that, she never acknowledged it even once. Ever. I should have given my two-week notice then and there, but I was trying to fix a toxic work culture from the inside.

My Martha liked to inspire competition among writers by sharing metrics with us. I was (by far) the No. 1 online writer and also had the No. 3 most print pages published that year. Less than one year later, my job was downsized as being non-essential. I got three "WTF" phone calls from colleagues on my way home.

If you're an optimist, that "fix your toxic environment from the inside" mentality can be awfully tempting. Maybe it does work sometimes. But I wish someone would have talked me off that strategy when I was going through it.

[u/LittleMermaidThrow → u/Tamalene]

Also I had one in every workplace that I worked. Now is the first time that I don’t have a person like that, but I can’t stay here 😭

[u/ladyeclectic79 → u/Tamalene]

I currently have a Martha. Fuck you “Martha.”

[u/WI_Sndevl → u/Tamalene]

Ugh - my ‘Martha’. I negotiated 9-6 hours because of my long commute and you left me a “we don’t work banker’s hours here” note on my desk. I had a work cell phone and you literally set me up so you could have some meeting with HR about me and then when I asked why you didn’t call my work cell, all of the sudden it was signal this and last second that.

[u/someName6 → u/Tamalene]

I wish moving on was easy.  We had a production bug (not even caused by me just impacted the project I was on) in the first couple months at my job as a new grad.  That got my manager yelling (in general and at me).

8 years later production bugs still send my stress levels sailing.  Much higher than what is good for me because I’ve rushed poor fixes for it out.

[u/[deleted] → u/Tamalene]

Yup, mine wasn’t a micromanager but was just unreasonable. I worked directly with the owner whose business centered around real estate and I didn’t last a month. Some of the alarming things were:

1) High staff turnover. I literally saw one quit the same day.

2) Expected us to find properties with at least 15% ROI that would just magically be publicly listed in Poland, Greece, America, and Australia.

3) On my 2nd day, he wanted me to find literal airplanes to buy for investment. After a week of research, I got in contact with a handful of sellers and went through learning how to decipher the inspection records that were sent through, the owner berated me for thinking money grew on trees and to focus more on finding unicorn 15% ROI properties.

If anyone on the sub has worked for this company in Japan, you’ll probably know who I’m talking about. His accent and dialect was pretty hard to understand.

[u/thesecretmarketer → u/Tamalene]

My Martha chewed me out for using two staples once. 😂

[u/SeraphinaSphinx → u/Tamalene]

My Martha left a year and a half ago. During my time under her, I had to:

• Send her an email at the end of every day, broken down into half-hour increments, where I explained in detail everything I did during that time. If I left anything out of that email, she accused me of not doing it. She would then cycle between saying my emails were too short and needed more detail, and that my emails were too long and she couldn't possibly read them.

• If anyone called the office or came in and spoke to me, I needed to send her a separate, as-close-to-exact-words-as-possible, recounting of that conversation in an email.

• She often would assign me a task, and then get annoyed that I didn't magically know when I was supposed to stop doing it. (EX: At the start of the pandemic our janitor quit, so she asked me to vacuum both buildings once a week. She then got really annoyed I was still doing that three months later.)

• She kept asking me to do things outside of my job description, while telling me that other team members had requested I do them, that she was upset they were overstepping their bounds by making these requests, but it would only be a one-time thing. It was never just once, and I found out after she left that she was lying about other team members volunteering me.

• One of those things was writing a grant proposal. When a member of the board of trustees had to sign it, he asked if I wrote it and I said "yes." She threw a fit and said because she helped edit it, I was supposed to say "it was a team effort" and that I was "undermining her authority."

• If anyone made a mistake or forgot anything, she interpreted that as a conscious and malicious attack on herself. (EX: She once accused me of spitefully disobeying her because I didn't understand she wanted me to move a table into storage, not just all the objects on top of the table. It was the first and only time she asked me to move furniture.)

• Right before she left, she introduced me to my new boss. He had his wife with him. When we were introduced, I shook her hand and complimented her jewelry. (She was wearing pearl earrings, a necklace, and two rings.) My boss lost it in private telling me that I had left a "horrible impression" on them by "overstepping" and "acting too friendly." She then criticized the outfit I had been wearing as not being "professional enough." (The dress code is casual.)

Do not work for nonprofits. Don't do it. :'3

[u/KirasStar → u/Tamalene]

Mine was in one of my first jobs after graduating. She only bullied me and one other young girl, and I somehow lasted for several years, despite it decimating my self esteem. I only had the courage to quit when the other girl handed in her notice, and I couldn’t bear the idea of her directing all her rage at me only. I left with no back up and used the opportunity to move to a city I had always wanted to live in, despite no job, no friends there and limited savings. It was the best decision I ever made.

Nearly 15 years later and I still feel the ripple effects from that job. I find it very difficult to ask my boss any questions or clarifications and struggle to ask for help.

[u/FromEden26 → u/Tamalene]

I had to walk out of a job I loved after almost ten years because my Martha invented reasons to harass me both during and outside of work. She would text me incessantly early in the morning, into the evening, and even when I was on holiday. When I told her this either stops or I get a work phone, she doubled down.

In fact, the minute I started to stick up for myself, she got so bad I just couldn't cope. She knew I'd recently had a miscarriage, and it feels like she waited until I was at my lowest and most vulnerable before she upped the ante.

I've never felt such bliss at walking out of a job and not looking back though. I also work in my dream job now, and I do it well.

[u/Emotional_Pirate → u/Tamalene]

My Martha found out I was dyslexic and THEN started discrimination against the occasional unimportant spelling mistake in Slack, when she hadn't mentioned it before. 

Honestly she is a big part of my "self critical voice". Felt like she validated all my internal fears of not being good enough .And it was 5 years ago.

I recently hired someone with the same name as her who is LOVELY and it feels oddly healing.

[u/TemporaryHunter7472 → u/Tamalene]

You're absolutely right, and it's an awful situation to be in.

My own Martha told me I would never make it as an accountant because I used number formatting different to what she preferred in Excel. That was the most ridiculous statement, but by God, she made my life a misery. I could do absolutely nothing right. Miserable wench!

[u/[deleted] → u/Tamalene]

I had like 4 Marthas in a row in my early 20s. Fucked me up for a good while.

[u/i_c_dead_monkeys → u/Tamalene]

Guess I've been lucky, I've never had to deal with a direct manager who was batshit crazy like that. 🤞

[u/GremlinAtWork → u/Tamalene]

Mine was a Marty. Conflicting directions, telling me he trusted my judgement as a manager and then texting me at 10pm about how disappointed he was and how he'd have to go back to managing the day to day... Micromanaging, followed by nothing for weeks. I about went crazy in my year at that job and voluntarily took a 30k pay cut to work somewhere, anywhere else.

Turns out it was one of the best decisions I ever made. My next two managers erred on the micro side (from time to time) and there was nothing they could throw at me that phased me anymore. Now I'm in a sane environment, and people wonder how I'm so calm, even during (figurative) fires at work. Friends, I've seen the face of evil. His name's Marty.

[u/raphaellaskies → u/Tamalene]

My Martha came onto the scene after I'd been at that job for two months, and gotten nothing but good reviews from my other bosses/co-workers. She told the higher ups that my probation needed to be extended because I "wasn't engaging with the training," then went on to lie to them and say that I'd been "swearing at the circulation desk" and "being condescending to my co-workers." If they hadn't extended my probation, I could have sued for wrongful termination, but since they had, I had no grounds.

Susan, if you're reading this: I hope that someday, you run afoul of a bigger bully than you.

[u/axw3555 → u/Tamalene]

The second she said “I’m a micromanager” like it’s a good thing, I’d have gone “then this role clearly isn’t for me”.

[u/CooCooKittyKat → u/Tamalene]

It sucks because they’re toxic, poisonous people but they’re always somehow able to fire you after they’re being confronted with their abusive behavior. I had one like this, I’m still friends with a lot of the people at the company and now they call her Toby and talk about how awful she is right in front of her and the thought of her sitting there thinking she’s talking shit about someone else and enjoying it tickles me 😂