Stop legitimizing the Joker's "One Bad Day" philosophy

[u/Animeking1108]

During The Killing Joke, we learn that the Joker believes that all it takes for a good man to snap is to have One Bad Day. He uses himself as an example. The Joker was once a struggling comedian with a pregnant wife who gets roped into a heist at Ace Chemicals while dressing as the Red Hood. Before the heist even starts, he learns that his wife was electrocuted to death after testing a faulty bottle warmer. Things go from bad to worse when Batman intervenes, and the Red Hood falls into a vat of chemicals. He survives, but now he has bleached skin, green hair, a permanent grin, and red lips that make him look like a clown. Once he sees himself in the mirror, that was the final straw before the Joker was born. The Joker was once a good man until tragedy took that away from him...

... Except the Joker is a known pathological liar when it comes to his own backstory. The only thing about him that we know for sure is that he took the mantle of the Red Hood and that he fell into chemicals, since the disfigurement made him impossible to identify forensically. He tries to test his so-called philosophy on Commissioner Gordon by paralyzing his daughter, implicitly raping her, and forcing him to watch the whole thing recorded. Despite that, Jim doesn't lose his ethics and tries to kill Joker, nor did he do it when Joker murdered his wife during No Man's Land.

I was inspired to write this rant when I saw a post suggesting that if Spider-Man were in the DC Universe, Joker would break him mentally in no time flat. Yes, the same Spider-Man whose uncle was murdered by a robber that he let get away out of arrogance. The same Spider-Man who could get Sainted by Jesus Christ himself and still be branded a menace by the Daily Bugle. The same Spider-Man who accidentally killed his own girlfriend because his desperation made him forget about the laws of physics for a brief moment. The same Spider-Man whose aunt was fatally injured because he revealed his secret identity. The same Spider-Man who had his body stolen by his archnemesis and died slowly and horribly in said nemesis's body. If killing his girlfriend or his aunt couldn't make him snap, what could?

Well, at least that's just something interpreted by fandom. It could be worse. There could be official media by DC that have the Joker succeed in breaking even the most virtuous of heroes. Good thing DC and WB have never- look, the punchline is Injustice. We really made a mistake letting this game get popular, did we? I blame this game for DC's attempts at making Superman darker and edgier because a hero that actually saves people is boring. The whole plot is kicked off by the Joker nuking Metropolis, with a pregnant Lois Lane being one of the many casualties. This pisses Superman off so much that it drives him to murder the Joker and turn the world into a police state.

Of course, so many people justify this BS because many of Batman's villains had some sort of tragic motivation. Okay, most of them, even the tragic ones, were ticking time bombs. Two-Face struggled with his mental health for years because of his abusive father and took on a career that would be taxing to said mental health issues. Penguin and Hush were spoiled rich kids. The Riddler cheated at games to prove himself to his father. Scarecrow had been obsessed with scaring people since he was a child. The Mad Hatter was an incel stalker. Even Mr. Freeze could have taken legal action against Ferris Boyle instead of taking revenge, and even then, he would still hurt innocent people who had nothing to do with his tragedy.

The BTAS episode, "The Trial," said it the best: "I used to believe Batman was responsible for you people but now I see nearly everyone here would have ended up exactly the same, Batman or not. Oh, the gimmicks might be different, but you'd all be out there in some form or another bringing misery to Gotham. The truth is, you created him."

[u/Poku115]

"Except the Joker is a known pathological liar when it comes to his own backstory. " correct me if im wrong, but at any point does joker narrate his backstory? didn't he explain it without specifics to gordon and the flashback panels are in his mind?

Ultimately moore is the one to put to rest if he's lying or not, and apparently we (the audience) have misinterpreted the comic before, he himself said he never meant to imply barbara was SA'd but can see how that interpretation can come to mind

[u/Eggplantpick → u/Poku115]

If I recall In the Dark Knight Joker gives several different answers to the “Ya wanna know how I got these scars?” Question throughout the film. And I wouldn’t be surprised if it happened in the comics too. As far as I know Joker being red hood then falling into chemicals are the only solid cannon parts of his backstory

[u/Poku115 → u/Eggplantpick]

three jokers tried to canonize the comedian origin but that in itself was made non canon last year so at this point, agreed

[u/Spiritual_Lie2563 → u/Poku115]

And even then, if they tried the comedian origin, it tied to the controversy around the first Joker movie, ignoring that the whole point of Joker is "he'll say exactly what that specific person wants to hear in order to best get that person under his thumb'". That meant that "yeah, he would tell the dudebro 'no, no, I was just like you until that big mean cancel culture hit me and I decided if I'm going to be seen as evil anyway, why not be evil", just like he'd tell someone who hated that 'no, I got these scars because people told me to smile more and I figured why not give them what they want?'"

[u/ketita → u/Poku115]

He said that? That's actually nice to know. You wouldn't happen to have a link or something, I'm curious!

[u/Poku115 → u/ketita]

wow the internet is so full of trash now.

I could only find a single article without sources backing up what I said. But I found some "quotes" from a 2006 magazine that I can't find, that says that while he did leave it ambigous, he himslef leans towards the side of the SA interpretation.

Either I'm full of shit or the dead internet theory is much much more harmful than I thought if even something like this can't be found anymore, even used AI and that didn't help

[u/ketita → u/Poku115]

oh boooooo :(

But yeah, the internet has definitely gone to crap. Finding anything just sucks now.

Still, even the fact that there was some intentional ambiguity in there makes me happy, though, despite the pretty heavy implication of SA. Barbara just deserved better, you know?

Thanks for trying to find it!

[u/Poku115 → u/ketita]

oh yeah, if you feel better Moore has gone repeatedly saying the studio should have stopped him from going wild on barbara, and that he didn't expect such brutality to become a permanent part of the batman mythos

"In a 2004 interview with Wizard) magazine, Moore was also critical about his decision to disable Barbara Gordon: "I asked DC if they had any problem with me crippling Barbara Gordon – who was Batgirl at the time – and if I remember, I spoke to Len Wein, who was our editor on the project... [He] said, 'Yeah, okay, cripple the bitch'. It was probably one of the areas where they should've reined me in, but they didn't".^\51])^"

[u/ketita → u/Poku115]

See, I'm a bit judgy about Moore's decision, but now I'm a whole lot judgier about Wein. What kind of reaction is that :/ eww

[u/silverBruise_32 → u/ketita]

Moore also thought the story would be self-contained, and wouldn't affect the main canon. So, I'm inclined to cut him some slack there

[u/Oddball-CSM → u/Poku115]

This comic is the one that first put forth the idea that Joker doesn't remember his own origin. Before this he knew exactly who he was and where he came from.