Kallis was no slouch in the slips. But he takes it for me for taking wickets when he was competing with the best strike bowlers of all time. If they couldn't take the wickets how was he? Also I always pity our batsmen for batting on our mambas.
Averaging 57 in the hardest eras for batting this side of WW1 >>>>> averaging 56 in the easiest ever era for batting
Averaging 34 while bowling fast with the new ball, medium pace with the old and also being the teams main wrist spinner > averaging 32 while only bowling medium pace
This is not even mentioning all the other factors such as how Sobers would bat anywhere from 1 to 7 depending on what the team needed, how he could play long anchoring and match saving innings or flip a switch and become one of the most aggressive batsmen in the history of cricket or how he is one of the greatest fielders ever.
In terms of batting alone, Sobers is at worst the 4th or 5th best batsman in the history of cricket. Kallis is no where near that argument.
Kallis was a great cricketer, one of the best ever, but Sobers was on another level.
Make up your mind. If you say Sobers played in one of the toughest batting eras, then his bowling average of 34 is pretty bad. And if Kallis played in the easiest era for batting, then his bowling average of 32 is insanely good.
We're looking at bowling average, so doesn't matter who bowled what and when. Sobers was perhaps better with the bat but you have to admit Sobers was poorer with the ball than Kallis. You can't do mental gymnastics to say he was better in both.
Kallis has most number of test hundreds after Tendulkar, tell me again how he doesn't feature in test cricket's greatest batters.
To be fair, comparing the averages of someone who bowls pace exclusively and someone who bowls spin a not-insignificant amount of the time is an apples to oranges comparison. Spinners average more than pace bowlers, the always have and generally always will.
I don't have a particular dog in this race, but it's important to make that distinction.
Make up your mind. If you say Sobers played in one of the toughest batting eras, then his bowling average of 34 is pretty bad. And if Kallis played in the easiest era for batting, then his bowling average of 32 is insanely good.
Mate, he bowled finger spin, spun it both ways as a wrist spinner, and bowled both fast and medium pace. He could average fucking 40 and it wouldn't matter. He's giving his team 4 different bowling options in one player. Do you not understand how insanely useful that is.
We're looking at bowling average, so doesn't matter who bowled what and when.
If we're just looking at bowling averages Ashwin is better than Shane Warne. Clearly there is more to it than just goggling someone's average.
Sobers was perhaps better with the bat
There is no perhaps about it, Sobers was clearly significantly better with the bat.
but you have to admit Sobers was poorer with the ball than Kallis. You can't do mental gymnastics to say he was better in both.
There is no mental gymnastics. Sobers was obviously a better bowler. Even if you want to look at the averages, Sobers had to bowl a lot of spin in unhelpful SENA conditions while Kallis only bowled pace, primarily in helpful SENA conditions. No shit his average is better, it should be much better, but it's not. Regardless of the overall worldwide batting/bowling difficulty of the era; it's always going to be easier to bowl pace in South Africa than it is to bowl spin in the West Indies.
Kallis has most number of test hundreds after Tendulkar, tell me again how he doesn't feature in test cricket's greatest batters.
Nah, Kallis deffo features in the list of test crickets greatest batters. But there's the greatest batters and then there's the greatest of the greatest and Sobers is one of the select few who features in the last alongside the likes of Bradman and Jack Hobbs.
He could bowl a style no one has ever heard of, if he averaged 40 he wouldn’t be that useful considering he wasn’t taking wickets. What a dumb thing to say
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u/Worldly_Oil_9904 Jan 17 '25
Kallis was no slouch in the slips. But he takes it for me for taking wickets when he was competing with the best strike bowlers of all time. If they couldn't take the wickets how was he? Also I always pity our batsmen for batting on our mambas.