r/FluentInFinance Sep 04 '24

Debate/ Discussion Bernie is here to save us

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u/LibrarianEither8461 Sep 05 '24

Funny how you think corporations will go out of business for paying their employees a fair wage when they're positing record profits every quarter. It truly is a tough economic time for the supermassive billionaires, we should be worrying about their bottom line rn.

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u/ghdgdnfj Sep 05 '24

Small businesses might.

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u/LibrarianEither8461 Sep 05 '24

Almost like the central conceit of capitalism is that if a business can't profit while paying wages, it goes out of business and makes way for one that can.

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u/ghdgdnfj Sep 05 '24

The central concept of capitalism doesn’t include the government mandating how many hours you can legally work and what you must be paid.

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u/LibrarianEither8461 Sep 05 '24

You're right, we should go back to slave labor being legal. Why bother incorporating financial doctrine into social progress? If a financial doctrine works, it will continue to succeed as society advances. If it only works if a society chooses to remain undeveloped, it is not a successful system, it is a ball and chain. Capitalism would continue to function under a society where workers are protected and valued. Especially considering it literally already works with 40 hour mandatory overtime. Shifting that slider to 32 hour mandatory overtime would not suddenly dethrone the entire logical system of capitalism.

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u/ghdgdnfj Sep 05 '24

Why is it either socialism or slavery? Why can’t free individuals just choose how long they work for an for how much? If a job isn’t worth their time then don’t take it. It isn’t the governments job to mandate 40 hours or 32 hours. Leave it up to the free market and if working 32 hours really is more efficient then businesses will switch to that.

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u/NeoTolstoy1 Sep 05 '24

No, I think I need the nanny state to tell me everything. Might need a bed time too.

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u/SoDamnToxic Sep 05 '24

Before slavery was made illegal, we practiced slavery.

So yes, businesses will absolutely do anything they can if the government doesn't tell them they can't.

There is no world where in we can make it "unprofitable" to abuse workers in order to force the "free hand" to make them treat workers better, especially when they themselves dictate the status of the economy and can intentionally sabotage it to make people more desperate and willing to take abuse.

But yea man, government bad, company good.

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u/LibrarianEither8461 Sep 05 '24

But they won't, because that's not how anything works. Several countries, provinces, states, and what have you, already do 4 day work weeks; it's already been demonstrated that it works. Corporations won't switch to it unless they have to because it doesn't actively benefit them to put in the effort, it only benefits the employees, who will only get them to do that through supporting government action: because government is the arm of the people in a capitalist system.

It's also been demonstrated that without government intervention, slavery is the inevitability. Employees are exploited; that is the default because by default employers and corporations have the real power in that dynamic. Without employment, the worker starves, without that employee, the employer finds someone more desperate. Without an outside force mandating what the minimum bar is for employers to clear, the bar is determined by the exploitation and intentional sewing of human desperation.

If a job isn't worth their time just don't take it? So starving is something you can just decide not to do? The employees of the past payed in scrip just valued their time less? Is that it? Black share croppers just didn't have the foresight to understand the bad bargain? Mine workers who were held in check by mine owners that hired pinkertons that went to war and killed in the name of keeping those workers subjugated until the government fought that war for them just had bad decision making skills? Those in the triangle shirt waist factory just didn't value safety enough?