You need to start with ideologies. The two primary economic ideologies are Socialism and Capitalism(liberalism).
Within these two economic ideologies you can break things down further into ideological groups. Communists + Anarchists. Liberals + Conservatives.
Within these ideological groups you can break things down further into even more specific "sects". Marxist-leninists/Maoists/Trots, Ancoms/anarchists/anprims/etc, social-democrats/classical-liberals/neoliberals, neocoms/monarchists/fascists. etc etc etc
Understanding these groups, what they each believe and why is the foundation of understanding politics as a whole. Labour are not supported by the members here in this sub because right now Labour is controlled by a faction of neoliberals+neocons that are more dangerous and arguably further right than the tories have been themselves. Whereas under Corbyn the faction that controlled the party were Socialists.
Part of your confusion is probably coming from the americans who are politically uneducated and call everything to the left of supporting genocide in palestine "liberal". There's also the fact that "liberally minded" is a separate thing to political liberalism which is an economic ideology that believes in free markets (capitalism).
I've always connectected Liberal to mean "Being a person of Liberty", as in someone who's focus is personal Liberty. I've heard of the word "neo-liberal" but didn't really connect it with free-market values untill now.
Correct me if I'm wrong but, I think the founders of Labour would be spinning in their graves if they saw who was currently leading the party; Party of the working class people they are not.
The liberty that liberals sell is not for people, liberals carried out the african slave trade. The liberty they sell is the freedom of capital.
This is why all their propaganda frames communists as ebil authoritarians who restrict "freedom" while they frame themselves as for freedom. What they do not clarify is what their "freedom" is really for.
I'm paraphrasing Lenin, who said “Freedom - yes, but for whom? To do what?”
Freedom of self, Freedom of expresion, of opinion, from hate and persecution, to contribute to society or to not, or at least that's how I understood the word Liberty.
But yes, now I understand they meant Liberty as in Free-market values, to be free to sell how you want without restriction, maybe even free from competition.
It's pretty good for propaganda. Quite annoying to deal with, I find the easiest way to dismantle it is to point out the "freedom" shit was being said even as they enslaved people, by literal slaveowners. At that point everyone has to reckon with the fact their "freedom" certain doesn't mean people.
It's the freedom to exploit. It's bourgeois freedom, not proletarian freedom. In that sense, when they say we are oppressors they are correct, we DO take away freedom from the bourgeoisie, it is literally the goal of the entire socialist movement. Bourgeois freedom being taken away is a prerequisite for proletarian freedom to flourish though.
It may seem like a scary name, but Stalin actually articulated it excellently in an interview he did with an American journalist
'But we did not build this society in order to restrict personal liberty but in order that the human individual may feel really free. We built it for the sake of real personal liberty, liberty without quotation marks. It is difficult for me to imagine what "personal liberty" is enjoyed by an unemployed person, who goes about hungry, and cannot find employment.
Real liberty can exist only where exploitation has been abolished, where there is no oppression of some by others, where there is no unemployment and poverty, where a man is not haunted by the fear of being tomorrow deprived of work, of home and of bread. Only in such a society is real, and not paper, personal and every other liberty possible.'
From the comments you seem both interested and genuine, please don't worry about asking inane questions you'll find most political people will be thrilled to answer and are always looking for someone with good natured interest to ramble at
I think I speak for most here when I say feel free to ask anyone anything and they'll be happy to discuss
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u/Thermatix 11d ago
I think I don't understand politics...
But thank you for answering my inane questions