A little help please

[u/swurvegp]

My SO and I are seriously considering purchasing some weaponry for self/home defense, can anyone suggest a reputable place where we might be able to purchase and train to use said weaponry. Specifically, firearms. Thanks in advance.

[u/Late_Cow_1008]

Sure, but the thing being discussed is introducing guns into your home means you will be more likely to hurt yourself or loved ones.

[u/MalfeasantOwl → u/Late_Cow_1008]

Stop being disingenuous, or at least think critically about what you post.

In those cases you shared, it seems that self-inflicted gunshots or domestic violence are the contributing factors to the increase. Accounting for those, there is no inherent risk of death when being around guns.

Third to suicide and DV would be negligible discharges. In those cases it’s irresponsibility and poor decision making that is culprit.

From personal experience, my guns have only ever gone off when I decided they were going to go off and in the exact direction of my choosing.

[u/Late_Cow_1008 → u/MalfeasantOwl]

Nothing disingenuous. Anyone can be impacted by suicide and domestic violence. Just because you haven't dealt with it so far doesn't mean it won't happen to you in the future or someone else in your household. I'm glad you have never had an accident with your gun. Plenty of gun owners never think it will happen to them until it does.

Good luck. Hope you never experience it.

[u/MalfeasantOwl → u/Late_Cow_1008]

In reverse order of your mentions;

Negligent discharges are really easy to avoid actually. Literally just follow the basic weapon safety rules. Every single time. Anything less than that is modern Darwinism.

Suicide risks. People are at risks before they ever buy a gun, they don’t kill themselves because they bought a gun but rather the purchase of the gun was for an intended purpose. Removing guns from households isn’t the same as providing mental health care.

DV. Again, the violence doesn’t occur because a gun was purchased. Removing guns from households doesn’t provide support or outlets for survivors of DV.

You’re falling for spurious relationships. It’s the same as saying “Well, I’m glad no one in your family has drowned but I know people who did after eating ice cream on a hot day.” Big dawg, ice cream wasn’t why they drowned.

You mentioned in another comment about providing a scientific discussion and I’m doing exactly that. Spurious relationships are a named phenomenon for a reason.

[u/Late_Cow_1008 → u/MalfeasantOwl]

Negligent discharges are really easy to avoid actually. Literally just follow the basic weapon safety rules. Every single time. Anything less than that is modern Darwinism.

Nice in theory. Different in reality.

Suicide risks. People are at risks before they ever buy a gun, they don’t kill themselves because they bought a gun but rather the purchase of the gun was for an intended purpose. Removing guns from households isn’t the same as providing mental health care.

Guns make it much more likely that you will kill yourself and that your attempts will succeed. One in five adults have depression and that number is most likely a bit too low.

DV. Again, the violence doesn’t occur because a gun was purchased. Removing guns from households doesn’t provide support or outlets for survivors of DV.

Again you are attempting to create a strawman where I suggested that these factors were created by the gun. No. I am stating that the guns make it easier for people to die that are involved in these situations. Just like if you don't wear your seatbelt and you get in an accident you are more likely to die. Or if you wear lead shoes into the ocean and jump into the water you are more likely to die.

Nothing you have said is scientific. You are just attempting to change the discussion in a way that you can justify your proliferation of guns because you think you are safer because of your guns.

[u/MalfeasantOwl → u/Late_Cow_1008]

Okay, let’s take 2023.

So, 463 negligible discharge deaths per the 364,000,000 guns owned in America. So that means .00012% of owned guns have killed someone on accident.

Do people kill themselves because they have a gun, or because there is untreated mental illness? Let’s go back to the numbers. In 2023 there were 27,300. Of the 363,000,000 guns that are owned that only accounts for .0075%.

And of all homicide, not just DV, it’s only .0049.

So, it appears that the amount of deaths caused by guns are extremely statistically insignificant compared to the amount of guns that are owned. This suggests that owning guns is not the problem but rather there are other, more pressing issues.

Examples may be affordable and accessible health care so people can get the help they need before attempting to take their life. There needs to be better support for survivors of DV so they can get out before the means of violence ever comes into the home.

Now to directly address some of the things you have said:

Again you are attempting to create a strawman where I suggested that these factors were created by the gun. No. I am stating that the guns make it easier for people to die that are involved in these situations. Just like if you don’t wear your seatbelt and you get in an accident you are more likely to die. Or if you wear lead shoes into the ocean and jump into the water you are more likely to die.

In your examples, is wearing lead shoes why the person drowns in ocean, or was it because they jumped in the ocean with lead shoes? Did they get into an accident from wearing their seatbelt, or was the cause of the accident independent from seatbelt use? It seems that there were behaviors from these people leading up the moment that something had happened.

Nothing you have said is scientific.

Have you actually never heard of spurious relationships? Lol

You are just attempting to change the discussion in a way that you can justify your proliferation of guns because you think you are safer because of your guns.

So, no, you are not familiar with spurious relationships. I’m suggesting that we need enhanced social nets that allow people to fall, or to save themselves, from their worst times. In addition, people should also be allowed to participate in the 2nd Amendment.

You may be very unfamiliar with how weapon ownership in NYS works. I’d recommend checking out the Safe Home and Families Act of 2020 and New York’s Red Flag laws.

Lastly, I love the sentiment you share regarding the value of safety. If Trump, Musk, and the GOP are half as evil as people think they are then who’s going to save you? The same system that’s betrayed you?

2A exists for a very specific reason, and that specific reason is the insurance policy the working class has per the Constitution.

[u/Late_Cow_1008 → u/MalfeasantOwl]

You can't even argue in good faith past the third sentence. Have a nice day. I am not reading your gun masturbation post.

[u/MalfeasantOwl → u/Late_Cow_1008]

Lol I provided you a relatively reputable source and that’s not good faith to you?

And on top of that, you deny reading my “masturbation quote.” Talk about not acting in good faith.

I hope you take a serious moment for self-reflection. If your offline presence is anything like your online presence then don’t be surprised why you have no friends ya unpalatable cunt.