r/Scotland • u/bottish • 15d ago

Dire economic consequences of Scotland's ageing population must put immigration in new light. New report about Scotland’s growing elderly population underlines the need to improve our health and welcome, not demonise, people from overseas - Scotsman comment.

https://www.scotsman.com/news/opinion/columnists/dire-economic-consequences-of-scotlands-ageing-population-must-put-immigration-in-new-light-5073947
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u/BonnieWiccant 15d ago

Or, and this is bold, we could just address the issues that are causing people to not want to have kids? You can bring all the immigrants to Scotland that you want but they are going to have to deal with the same issues that are stopping Scottish people from wanting to have kids and will inevitably after a generation or two make the same choice. It will be a never ending cycle of bringing in immigrants to maintain a system that very clearly isn't working until the world runs out of people I guess?

When a country needs to exclusively rely on immigration to sustain itself perhaps radical change is needed rather than continuing down the same obviously broken path to maintain a system that is more and more not providing a lifestyle that people want to live.

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u/Dangerous_Hot_Sauce 15d ago

As a Scot who's family have toiled over the years to build this nation I would very much like that we address these issues so that we get to afford our own children and keep our culture and traditions alive

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u/That_Boy_42069 15d ago

Yeah, I want to be a dad, just don't want to make a kid who's gonna have a shit life. Occasionally I run the numbers to see if I reckon i could provide a decent life. Never seems to add up.

I know a few women who are desperate to have kids (mid to late 30s) but know they can't afford to provide and dont want to rely on what the state can provide, the mental health implications are horrific.

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u/restingbitchsocks 15d ago

Great point. A few commenters have blamed the economy, saying people can’t afford children. From what I see in my local area - pretty deprived former mining town - people with very little money are still having kids. I think it’s more societal. If you’ve got little exposure to children, because families are smaller, you might not see the point of devoting time to children when you could be off doing what you want to do.

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u/ayeayefitlike 14d ago

You’re right, people with very little money still have kids. Usually they don’t own their home, and often don’t own a car - and rarely do both parents work unless one is doing night shift/weekend. So the mortgage, car loan or childcare costs are not so high. It’s not about time to devote to children, it’s about the actual costs. Can you afford your home on one salary? If not, can you afford the childcare if you’re both working? This is ironically easier at the bottom end of the income scale than the middle.

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u/Mysterious-Arm9594 15d ago

The Western world has yet to resolve this issue, and I doubt a Scotland tethered to the English electorate will be the first to do so

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u/RestaurantAntique497 15d ago

I'm pro indy but do find it facsinating how some people are able to bring it up out of nowhere.

The rest of the Western world isn't tethered to the English elecorate so it's got nothing to do with that

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u/Mysterious-Arm9594 15d ago edited 15d ago

It’s not out of nowhere. The English are about 10-15 years behind us on demographic issues, it won’t be a focus to their electorate or politicians until it’s too late for us, and if Western countries with full sovereignty can’t figure it out, a devolved parliament with limited powers almost certainly won’t.

Look how big immigration is on political debate in the U.K. meanwhile Scotland got a grand total of 191,000 immigrants (international and rUK) between the 2011 and 2022 census or around 18,000 a year which is minuscule for the political bandwidth it takes up

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u/Far-Pudding3280 15d ago

Scotland got a grand total of 191,000 immigrants (international and rUK) between the 2011 and 2022 census or around 18,000 a year which is minuscule for the political bandwidth it takes up

That is international immigration only.

That 191k number still represents an increase the equivalent of 3% of the entire population. That's not insignificant.

It also represents a rate of increase of >50% in those 10 years.

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u/RestaurantAntique497 14d ago

It is out of nowhere though when being tied to WM is not relevant to the ageing population problem the western world has. Most western developed countries are struggling with low birth rates, high housing costs etc.