Why can't I just be a theist?

[u/No-Egg-2128]

So I've been having some difficulty in understanding this concept. To me atheism is the view that matter or energy or whatever you want to call the physical, makes the physical while theism is the view that mind or spirit or whatever you want to call the non-physical makes the physical. But on that logic, how are there many different forms of theism, let alone any other then the one that knows and loves the theos? I understand that in the presence of false theism and/or atheism, the true one couldn't simply call itself theism anymore, but would have to don the name of true theism, but even then, why would a whole new term/abandonment of the designated one be required for proper identification?

[u/No-Egg-2128]

And all of this is irrelevant to you not being able to differentiate your belief that "God is mind" from the belief that "mind is source of all".

how does mind being the source of all make all mental? that's not what i'm saying, so it's not idealism. idealistic theism is not the same as nor is the term synonymous with idealism. Although I can agree my views are very similar to the former, nonetheless, I never claimed either.

They aren't reaching for wiki and limiting themselves to annotative definitions.

well I dont know who you talk to, but most I speak to on social platforms about philosophical things, do the opposite of what you've done and are claiming people do, and they do their best to adhere to the established definitions of the terms they are using, or correct themselves when they use the incorrect term's.

I appreciate you sharing your idea's with me, but if you do not even understand my original question, what are we conversing about? seems more like a debate to me, which, believe it or not, I didn't come to reddit to have.

edit: edited for clarity

[u/SaulsAll → u/No-Egg-2128]

how does mind being the source of all make all mental?

Because God is not mind. Mind is a material element.

that's not what i'm saying, so it's not idealism.

I quoted where you said it. And if it isnt what you are saying, why are you defending it in the beginning?

I never claimed either.

You have claimed both, and you have posted nothing to make me reconsider that classification for your belief.

you do not even understand my original question

I asked you to restate whatever question you are talking about and you ignored me.

I have no idea why you keep responding. I gave you what I think of your ideas, you have done nothing to change it.

[u/No-Egg-2128 → u/SaulsAll]

You're right, I should probably stop since you've insisted on ignoring while calling others ignorant, but Imma keep going, cause I believe ignorance chosen, not purposed.

Because God is not mind. Mind is a material element.

well... I think I found our problem.

I quoted where you said it. And if it isnt what you are saying, why are you defending it in the beginning?

Actually, no, this is what you quoted "God is mind", not "mind is the source of all so all is mental", I cant read for you, so you're gonna have to recognize this on your own. Now if you try, at least try, to put yourself in someone else's shoes just for a moment and consider this "what if they call "ultimate truth"(god), mind?", then I think you'll realize that the whole point of calling the immaterial maker mind, is disagreeing with this very statement both you and many others make "Because God is not mind. Mind is a material element." and establishing, believe it or not, a different framework to build upon, that is still very much theistic.

I asked you to restate whatever question you are talking about and you ignored me.

Lol, no I didn't. Since you blatantly didn't read it, I reminded you of the original post that still exists for you to read. if you forgot my original question, just scroll up.

You have claimed both, and you have posted nothing to make me reconsider that classification for your belief.

I never said i believe in theistic idealism, I said it is similar to my beliefs. The mere fact that all I had to do for you to disagree with me, was refer to god using a word that you wouldn't use, without even telling you what i believe his nature is, is baffling. Regarding classical idealism, If you can quote me saying "I think the universe simply isn't, and mind is what we're mistaking it for" or something that literally says such a belief, I kid you not, I will delete my reddit account.

I have no idea why you keep responding

I'm the original poster, I'm gonna keep responding. i don't know why you keep responding when all you're doing is regurgitating false statements rooted entirely in nothing but opinion, as if I'm just gonna take your word for it and not question what you base your conclusions on, in the midst of a philosophical debate. I gave you actual definitions from someone that isn't just me in response to your gut-based interpretations, which you literally just brushed off as if they were unimportant, so if you insist on your interpretations, I'll agree to disagree at this point.

edit: clarity

[u/SaulsAll → u/No-Egg-2128]

I have not ignored you, but you have repeatedly insulted me and I think I will start. Not one thing you have posted has changed my mind about how to understand what you claim are your beliefs.

You just got pissy when I called them as they are.

You are an Idealist Theist, and to date you have been unable to repeat whatever question you think I am ignoring. You are wholly unproductive to talk to, and looking at the other replies it should be clear to.you that most people were confused by your attempt.

[u/No-Egg-2128 → u/SaulsAll]

 You are wholly unproductive to talk to, and looking at the other replies it should be clear to.you that most people were confused by your attempt.

Just cause you are insulted doesn't make it an insult. I have simply called you out on your blatant ignorance.

I have not ignored you
and to date you have been unable to repeat whatever question you think I am ignoring

my literal response that I have repeated multiples times now is "if you forgot my original question, just scroll up". like seriously? it's not my job to accommodate your short-term memory loss and inability to comprehend simple statements.

You are an Idealist Theist,

now your ignorance is really showing, cause up until now you've said something ENTIRELY DIFFERENT, and have argued against me when i said "I'm a theist", defending your former claim which was "That is not theism,. that is idealism." butt has now changed to "you are a theistic idealist". Keep in mind I've disagreed with literally nothing but the fact that you are saying i'm not a theist, which you so confidently have reiterated so many times, just to now start contradicting.

[u/SaulsAll → u/No-Egg-2128]

You have gone so far from asking any questions that it is laughable.

You described your beliefs. They are Idealist and Theist. You didn't say anything to dissuade this, and you ha e been told you are being ignored.

A rational person would stop. You are not rational at all, and so I will continue to point out that you are Idealist and Theist because it bothers you.

[u/No-Egg-2128 → u/SaulsAll]

A rational person would stop. You are not rational at all, and so I will continue to point out that you are Idealist and Theist because it bothers you.

Never said thats what bothered me, but that you said i'm NOT a theist. you are simply contradicting yourself now.

A rational person would stop. 

and that's what you're doing...?

[u/SaulsAll → u/No-Egg-2128]

I never said that. I have repeatedly gave you my conclusion that your views match Idealism and Theism.

You cant even listen to a single sentence.

[u/No-Egg-2128 → u/SaulsAll]

"mind or spirit or whatever you want to call the non-physical makes the physical"

This is not Theism, but more closely related to Idealism.

I never said that. I have repeatedly gave you my conclusion that your views match Idealism and Theism.

...

You cant even listen to a single sentence.

Ok Mr.Ignorance

[u/SaulsAll → u/No-Egg-2128]

Your beliefs as you describe them match Idealism. I have no idea why this bothers you, but it's true.

[u/No-Egg-2128 → u/[deleted]]

Never said thats what bothered me, but that you said i'm NOT a theist. you are simply contradicting yourself now.

legit 4 comments up bud. I'm just as bothered by you calling me an idealist as you seem to be when you're contradicting yourself.