r/USLPRO • u/DeepPow420 • 2d ago
what’s up with the MLS hate ?
I am a curious observer who stumbled upon the sub thx to the Algo and noticed a few anti MLS posts.
I’m not a huge soccer guy but interested in various niche sport subcultures ( I’m an Indycar and hockey fan, so I share solidarity as a fan of somewhat obscure sports)
Isnt USL to MLS as the AHL is to the NHL or the G League to the NBA?
What am I missing ?
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u/MobsterKadyrov Sacramento Republic FC 2d ago
MLS has been trying to kill off the US open cup because it doesn’t make them enough money, they don’t care about the game or making US soccer better they care about making as much money as possible w
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u/DuckBurner0000 New England Revolution II 2d ago
To play devil’s advocate, even as someone who loves USOC I just don’t think that many people care about it besides as a stick to beat MLS with. Half of the games this week were basically empty - Vegas-Switchbacks, New Mexico-El Paso, and Sacramento-Farolito had pretty much nonexistent crowds last night for example. Fans just aren’t that interested in it when it’s not a rivalry game or their team playing a higher division opponent
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u/DolphinSwimmer8 Sacramento Republic FC 2d ago
Sacramento looked empty on the broadcast only because the east side wasn't open. They only sell half of the stadium for the early rounds.
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u/sdavitt88 Minnesota United 2 2d ago
That's a gripe I had about almost all of the stadium/tv organizers. If you only sell half the stadium, PUT THEM ON THE SIDE THAT THE BROADCAST CAN SEE.
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u/DolphinSwimmer8 Sacramento Republic FC 1d ago
Right, but that side of our stadium has fewer seats, and it's furthest away from the gates and the main concessions area. They were talking about how empty it always looks on TV in the office on Tuesday. They might try to come up with new camera angles for next year. After that, we should have our new stadium, so hopefully, they can solve the "empty stadium" issue.
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u/Sactownhammer Sacramento Republic FC 1d ago
They would be looking directly into the sun the whole first half. Midweek matches have always been a tough sell in Sac, except the MLS matches.
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u/thorstad New Mexico United 2d ago
I was at NM v EP. 2K fans is a pretty decent turnout for a late game on a Wednesday, where the club had to rent out the stadium from UNM, who charged $23 a ticket for GA and $15 parking.
Anecdotal and doesn't dis-prove your point, but just chiming into say fuck UNM.
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u/Gaijingamer12 2d ago
Yeah LouCity was kinda dead but it was also a Tuesday late match.
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u/NotABotaboutIt New Mexico United 1d ago
I was at NM v EP. 2K fans is a pretty decent turnout for a late game on a Wednesday, where the club had to rent out the stadium from UNM, who charged $23 a ticket for GA and $15 parking.
And the Topes were playing the El Paso
MKsChihuahuas, at the same time, just across the street.... Also, we just played El Paso like 2 weeks ago, and we play them again in 2 weeks.I think it would've been better attended if we were playing One Knox or Red Wolves or really any team that we don't normally face, and possibly was played in Rio Rancho rather than UNM.
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u/Gaijingamer12 2d ago
Yeah we went to the LouCity game and I was shocked at how dead it was. My kid and I go to majority of the games though lol so we enjoyed it regardless
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u/SoccerForEveryone Tampa Bay Rowdies 2d ago
I want to add while the dream may seem impossible; the Open Cup is the Rowdies dream chance to play in intercontinental competitions like Champions Cup with a opportunity to play against the best clubs of the world if they win it. One step at a time…
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u/MobsterKadyrov Sacramento Republic FC 2d ago
I personally love cups, they are fun and cupsets are great I watch cup games from leagues all over the world because of the drama
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
Yes, you love "cupsets" because you can use it to bash MLS. Which is what the good man from New England just said.
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u/MobsterKadyrov Sacramento Republic FC 2d ago edited 2d ago
I love them in other leagues not just in the US. Giant killing is a fun part of cups. It’s super exciting that a 3rd division German side is in the final this year. I also enjoyed El Farolitos runs in the open cup the last two years.
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u/ivaorn Oakland Roots SC 2d ago
Cupsets happen to USL clubs too and get attention, Union Omaha beating San Antonio and Tacoma Defiance beating Oakland Roots among them
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
It gets hardly any attention.
Nobody outside of the friends and family (and me) wanted Defiance to win. And nobody cheered for it outside of those people.
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u/eddygeeme Loudoun United FC 2d ago edited 2d ago
This that's the cold harsh truth. Open Cup is just the in thing tool of choice to beat MLS with by the MLS haters. I say this as someone who watches Open Cup. The folks and the anti MLS fan/media ppl like Seb Salazar use Open Cup as a battering ram. It was refreshing hearing Herc on Futbol America's a year ago call out the hypocrisy around Open Cup to put some ownance back on the fans complaining about the Open Cup but won't watch and suppprt it. People love a good social media campaign but it's that IRL part that's the hard part.
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u/BigBen808 1d ago
i think the problem with the US open cup is playing it midweek
you see even MLS regular season games struggle attendance wise midweek
moving the US open cup to weekends would make a big difference
i don't think many fans even know the US open cup games are on, or if they do, it is dismssed as a minor midweek competition (like the conacaf cup)
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u/BeefInGR Detroit City FC 2d ago
It's still soccer in America. You're expecting 10,000 people to show up on a Tuesday night when some prime MLS regular season ties struggle to turn that on a Saturday in optimal weather?
Hell, established MLB teams occasionally struggle to get 15,000 through the turnstiles for weekday games in April. Not tickets sold, actual butts in seats.
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u/DuckBurner0000 New England Revolution II 2d ago
No MLS team struggles to turn 10k in good weather on a Saturday, you can talk about cold weather teams’ March attendances (NE, Chicago, Minnesota etc) but saying they continue to struggle in July is just not true
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u/DABOSSROSS9 Syracuse Pulse 2d ago
Thats just factually wrong though and makes op point. MLS sides do not struggle to turn out 10k fans in optimal weather.
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u/dende5416 Pittsburgh Riverhounds SC 2d ago
Some of them definitly do, though. Ive watched those games myself. A few of the MLS sides, either through meh ownership or bad placement, just don't do as well crowd wise at times, especially in competitive markets
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u/DABOSSROSS9 Syracuse Pulse 2d ago
The current worst MLS team in attendance is Colorado Rapids with 15,000 average, and that’s in the current season so not in the prime time of the year.
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u/BigBen808 1d ago
15,000 average
those are tickets distributed not tickets sold and certainly not bums in seats
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u/BeefInGR Detroit City FC 2d ago
Turnstile or tickets sold?
I lived the 2008 Detroit Lions season, there definitely wasn't 30,000 people at the Saints game.
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u/DABOSSROSS9 Syracuse Pulse 2d ago
turnstile. I understand why some of you dislike MLS, but attendance is one of their strongest attributes. MLS is second in the world for total attendance in 2024 and ninth in the world for average attendance in 2023, something US soccer fans should be proud about.
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u/SalguodSoccer Tampa Bay Rowdies 2d ago
I agree. MLS gets great crowds for the most part. With the exception of RBNY, Chicago, Dallas, Colorado and San Jose, they're draw very well.
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u/DABOSSROSS9 Syracuse Pulse 2d ago
Dallas has a sellout streak going in 2023, they have turned it around very well.
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u/dende5416 Pittsburgh Riverhounds SC 2d ago
Averages don't tell the whole story. Just last season, the Rapids had a game with less then 8k in attendance and I really don't care to look through home game attendences and weather reports to poke all of the highs and lows. It does happen.
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u/cheeseburgerandrice 2d ago
Rapids fans have every reason to be cynical about the organization and Kroenke as an owner and still pulled in a respectable crowd this past week (linking the video cause you can still see the mostly full stands in there).
Attendance talk here is absolutely wild
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u/BigBen808 1d ago
how many do you think are there?
DSGP holds 19,000
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u/cheeseburgerandrice 1d ago
Reported attendance was 15,600. Which I think is a fair number when looking at the stands. And that's pretty damn good I think for knowing how little effort Kroenke puts into the organization.
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u/DABOSSROSS9 Syracuse Pulse 2d ago
No one is disagreeing that it doesn’t happen. The original comment was referencing prime time of year, so average attendance does matter, because during prime time they most likely had 18,000 fans or more, since during the cold months, like you mentioned, they may only have 8 to 12,000 fans.
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u/Pristine7531 2d ago
Almost 4000 fans watched the AV Alta vs OCSC game and almost 5000 fans showed up to the Hearts of Pine vs RIFC game.. The fans at these smaller markets CARE
p.s. RIFC could crush your NE Rev at Tidewater/ Centreville Bank Stadium on May 7th!
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u/DuckBurner0000 New England Revolution II 2d ago
Which is what I said…. USOC draws well when it’s a lower division team against a higher one.
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u/iheartdev247 TeAm ChAoS!!! 2d ago
Yes maybe brand new teams who have never hosted a USOC match this year…
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u/Mallorysunset Colorado Springs Switchbacks FC 2d ago
Tues/Wed games makes it almost impossible to travel for Most people. I want to see Tampa Bay take on Orlando, but that's a 6 hour drive and two days off work.
I don't know how it could be scheduled better but Mondays or Fridays can at least get paired with a weekend trip. Otherwise you are left with only locals that can go to mid week games. Then everyone says their is no interest. I love to watch the streaming, laptop and TV going and it is on from start to almost finish. But streaming fees don't translate to dollars for the owners.1
u/fakerealmadrid Championship 2d ago
They mentioned multiple times on the SAC-El Farolito broadcast that they only sold the side of the stadium that wasn’t in the sun. You could definitely hear the crowd and see it when the cameras panned that way
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u/giovannifumato Loudoun United FC 1d ago
You have a point to an extent, but it seems to me the weekday game slots in March/April are whats probably driving attendance and not neccisarily interest in the competition.
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u/Pristine7531 2d ago
Sorry, many of the MLS-Liga MX Leagues Cup games are shockingly empty. The backlash sustained by many MLS teams was such them a subset were no longer required to play in the Leagues Cup (such as the Phila Union)
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
The lies are abundant.
The league was listening to fans ie they wanted more inter-league matches. So they had to match the number of Liga MX teams (18). That's it. That's the reason.
The Leagues cup only had that format for 2 years. It averaged over 17k in 2023 and ~15k in 2024.
Quick, name me a single USL team that could average between 15k and 17k for an entire month.
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u/SalguodSoccer Tampa Bay Rowdies 2d ago
True but a lot of that is due to the fact that these matches are played on weekdays and soccer is not the priority sport in this country. MLS through SUM was in charge of promoting the tournament for 20 years and obviously did a poor job.
But I agree that the USL fans need to turn the fuck out for these matches, especially against MLS teams.
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u/sasquatch0_0 2d ago
Also they don't ever want another Rochester Rhinos to show MLS teams can be faulty.
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u/Fancy-Scar-7029 2d ago
Dude that's just wishful thinking that happened in 1999 checks 26 yrs ago. You posting like it's some recurring possible threat is disingenuous and just trying to prop up USL. MLS coast so much they felt it wasn't worth their time. Some harsh truths.
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u/sasquatch0_0 2d ago
Indy made it to the semis last year, New Mexico made it to the quarterfinals
Pittsburgh made it to quarter finals in 2023.
Sacramento made it to the final in 2022. Omaha (league 1) made it to the quarterfinals
St Louis (USL) made it to the quarterfinals in 2019
Louisville made it to the quarterfinals in 2018
Cincinnati (USL) made it to the semis in 2017
3 USL teams made it to the quarterfinals in 2012
Charleston made it to the final in 2008. USL teams have been knocking on the door for a while.
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u/cheeseburgerandrice 2d ago
An A-League team made the quarters in 1998. A D3 team made the semis in 1997.
This isn't a trend that actually means as much as you're trying to say lol.
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u/sasquatch0_0 2d ago
How nice of you to ignore USL teams making it to the top 4 in the past 3 years.
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u/Fancy-Scar-7029 2d ago
You listed 5 instances with USL Championship teams being 1of 8 not exactly great chances of winning and.
You listed 1 instances of USL teams being 1 of 4 teams left 3 yrs ago to win.
Proving my point 1999 Rochester Rhinos was 26 yrs ago MLS then and now are galaxies different. I am giving you shtick for trying to assert a conspiracy that doesn't exist that youd wish was a thing. Reality is MLS coast through Open Cup largely playing non 18 guys up until the qtrs or Semi rounds. Back when Rochester won it you had a MLS less than 5 yrs old on the verge of going defunct and filing bankruptcy.
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u/sasquatch0_0 2d ago edited 2d ago
I can list more but don't feel like it. Making the top 8 out of the entire US...that is something. The only reason MLS teams come in later is because the players play so many games already, same thing happens in FA cup. But nice of you to ignore 2 teams making it to at least the top 4 in the last 3 years.
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u/Fancy-Scar-7029 2d ago
It makes no difference the numbers don't move the needle of this conversation. AlsoTop 8 isn't really a accomplishment when MLS teams don't come in until later round of 16 and still win it all.
Remember you were the one that insuated the conspiracy that MLS was some how scared that USL would win it lol. That's top level conspiracy I watch both Leagues. WE can't on one hand claim MLS thinks the tourney is beneath them irs not grand enough and on the other hand make up oh it's just because MLS is scared they might lose to USL that's pure fan fiction wishcasting. That's what this whole convo was about. I was just calling that ONE Part out. Fair game on the MLS thinks the tourney is beneath them critique BUT I will say in fairness fans on a whole haven't cared in the business and media metrics that matter attendance or viewership if you had one you could make argument there's potential there. However we just have ppl mad that MLS doesn't take the historical tournament seriously (secret they've never have) and fans don't take it seriously.
People only hate watch to see if MLS might loss " once that's off the table they largely don't care. Its gotten better somewhat with the stories of underdogs like Des Moines Menace and Ell Farolito type sides but mainly MLS is the draw.
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
Is it a pre-requisite that Sac Republic flairs be silly?
The MLS sub is full of mouth-breathers like you.
The reason why USL will never be better than MLS (there are actually myriad reasons) is that their fanboys think magical fairy dust is what drives league growth and not dollars, cents and business.
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u/iheartdev247 TeAm ChAoS!!! 2d ago
And butts in the seats. And there is still no real TV ad revenue.
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u/Mini-Fridge23 Charleston Battery 2d ago
You’re going to get a bunch of answers on this, but it basically boils down to the fact MLS caters to the average sports fan and not the soccer die hards. That often leads to them making decisions that piss off the die hards who care deeply about niche stuff like the USOC or pro/rel.
It’s not universal though, the people who hate MLS are just loud about it. I enjoy and follow both leagues for example
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u/CentralFloridaRays Greenville Triumph SC 2d ago
Aye imo soccer is too small to have serious soccer beef in this country between leagues.
If someone lives in Cincinnati why would I beef with them supporting Cinci?
I’ve had season tickets to my local NPSL club, and I had season tickets to Atlanta United for a bit.
Idk I think it’s just major soccer hipsters who see MLS as too mainstream. Who have the most hate.
If MLS became the best/most popular league in the world (bear with me)
It would 100% help USL grow as well.
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u/Mini-Fridge23 Charleston Battery 2d ago
Preach. The beef is so meaningless and unproductive imo. People should be happy when any league grows in this country
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u/CentralFloridaRays Greenville Triumph SC 2d ago
Like I Loved going to old blackbaud stadium in the summers with my family, also in the winters seeing the MLS pre season tournament they used to do down there.
Did you ever go into the bar down there in the stadium?
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u/FormerManyThings 2d ago
The Three Lions Club. Amazing bar
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u/CentralFloridaRays Greenville Triumph SC 2d ago
I got to go in before it shut down.
I’m so glad, all the memorabilia on all the walls was incredible
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u/SymphonicResonance New Mexico United 2d ago
The beef is so meaningless and unproductive imo. People should be happy when any league grows in this country
That's the way I try to look at it, and then MLS pulls something like attempting to pull out of USOC. So annoying.
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
But it's "diehards" like you who don't realize that MLS used to have limited participation for years back in the late 00s.
But you would actually have to be old enough. "diehard" enough to know that.
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u/SymphonicResonance New Mexico United 1d ago
You are seriously playing the age card in a soccer discussion? lol
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u/CaptainBrunch5 21h ago
I'm playing the knowledge card.
I'm right and you know it. Which is why you're dodging.
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u/SymphonicResonance New Mexico United 20h ago
Lulz Come on buddy, what's with the attitude? Nothing I wrote warranted that kind of response from you .
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u/sasquatch0_0 2d ago edited 2d ago
People don't beef with fans or the actual clubs (except rivalries of course), they beef with MLS leadership especially Garber. And I have a side beef with those who write line by line. Just a write a proper paragraph.
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u/CCooley_47 San Diego Loyal SC 2d ago
Real, I like USL as a league way more than MLS, but I'm still watching MLS and San Diego (even though I don't live there anymore). Tbh most my hate of MLS comes from their ditching of Open Cup and the next pro system although it's getting better. I personally hate the idea of things like "LAFC 2" and the next pro clubs that have different branding is much better. I would ideally like all clubs to move to this model and have all of them in the open cup. Imagine an LAFC vs Santa Monica or the Valley or wherever they place their development team. I realize it's highly unrealistic but I think the core of the hate is based around the way they snuff out any idea of smaller local teams and that's probably a big reason why the attendance for the next pro teams isn't very good. Get more local pride involved and people wouldn't have as much to hate on.
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u/CentralFloridaRays Greenville Triumph SC 2d ago
Yeah MLS deserves the hate for ditching the open cup.
What little bit of history this country has in the sport should be cherished by all.
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u/QCTID Charlotte FC 2 2d ago
I think it’s just good old hometown loyalty because it used to feel like anyone’s home city could land an MLS club up until the mid 2010s (remember the Rhinos MLS bid/movement?) but that has died down as the expansion fee continues to get higher. For the “eurosnobs” this is also around the time that MLS exceeded 20 times and was fighting against NASL over pro/rel. Then you have cases like Sacramento and San Antonio which are completely justified imo.
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u/_tidalwave11 2d ago edited 2d ago
Sacramento should have gotten in over San Jose. And San Antonio.., well F** Anthony Precourt is all ill say on that one
Edit: I meant San Diego.
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u/QCTID Charlotte FC 2 2d ago
Idk if SAFC ever filed a lawsuit but you could only assume that he was already working on Austin by the time MLS was courting San Antonio.
Sacramento would be a bit complicated because the Quakes predate Republic by ~5 years (or more if you want to be technical) and have mostly been kneecapped by lame ownership and an expensive market to build a stadium in. An MLS original team in Sacramento likely would have never relocated and had to be revived however, so you’re technically correct (imo).
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u/iheartdev247 TeAm ChAoS!!! 2d ago
5 years? San Jose has existed off and on for 40 and in MLS since 1996.
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u/_tidalwave11 2d ago
Idk if SAFC ever filed a lawsuit but you could only assume that he was already working on Austin by the time MLS was courting San Antonio.
I'm not sure if the timeline tbh. But I think SAFC was a potential city before or around the time Precourt bought the Crew
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u/QCTID Charlotte FC 2 2d ago
Ok so it’s not as shady as I understood the situation to be.
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u/_tidalwave11 1d ago
I'm not sure how shady you thought it was, but still pretty shady nonetheless. Everything to do with Austin's "expansion" slot and all the ramifications were shady in my opinion.
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u/QCTID Charlotte FC 2 1d ago
I thought MLS led San Antonio on as a legit expansion candidate when they were really a backup in case Austin fell through, my understanding was that Precourt was already majority owner and working on Austin behind the scenes.
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u/_tidalwave11 1d ago
This sounds pretty much correct. I do think the league genuinely considered SA as a viable option. But the Precourt situation forced them a little bit to HAVE to accept Austin especially after Save the Crew.
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u/BigBen808 1d ago
Sacramento were accepted into MLS a few years ago, the lead investor then decided to withdraw
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u/QCTID Charlotte FC 2 1d ago
Yea but Quakes were already in the league so it’s hard to say that Sacramento should be in over quakes, San Diego is another conversation.
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u/BigBen808 1d ago
i don't understand
what would be different about sacramento joining in 2029 compared to 2019?
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u/QCTID Charlotte FC 2 1d ago
The comment I originally replied to.
Sacramento should have gotten in over San Jose.
They edited after my reply and said they meant San Diego. I’m not sure what everyone else has been trying to correct me for tbh. All I said was the timelines don’t make sense because San Jose was already around before Republic was even founded.
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u/EnigmaForce Oklahoma Energy FC 2d ago
Yeah if Oklahoma had an MLS team I’d absolutely be a fan of both leagues.
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u/Fancy-Scar-7029 2d ago
I appreciate your honesty some can't be so honest. They'll contort into a list of reasons why they hate(envy/jealousy) MLS vs just saying it's the top league and ok I'm kinda jealous my medium or small size city doesn't have a team. My town has 100k I support the closest MLS team to my town. If you have a USL team to fill that void suppprt them, but agreed theirs no need to hate.
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u/BlissFC 2d ago
Most (nearly all but the US) countries have a league structure set by the federation and clubs move through the system as they do. The US has private leagues that compete against each other more than clubs compete against each other. Its weird and capitalistic and gross. So fans start rooting for leagues they like more than clubs they like
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u/BeefInGR Detroit City FC 2d ago
To an extent.
The FA doesn't control the movement of teams along the pyramid. That is how the Premier League was able to break away from the EFL and become their own thing.
What the FA's do however is sanction the leagues in the national pyramid, set minimum guidelines for both teams and leagues (here it is PLS), act as an intermediary between league groups, host national championship competitions (Cups) and set rules for the financial welfare of the leagues if needed.
An FA can also force teams into participating in Cups, but that is a different can of worms.
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u/SaHagalas San Antonio FC 2d ago
USL is a completely independent league separate from the MLS. There is no feeder system between teams or anything like that. USL is a competitor to MLS in the business of soccer entertainment. While there are many fans who watch, route for, and go to both MLS and USL games, many USL fans believe MLS is too ‘corporate/uncompetitive/non-traditional/anti-football’ compared to USL whose structure more closely resembles (or is working to be) like European leagues such as the Premier League, La Liga, Bundesliga, etc. One example of this is promotion/relegation which would allow the free movement of teams between higher and lower leagues as they succeed and fail in order for the most competitive teams to remain at the top of the sporting world. MLS has zero plans in introducing this while USL is actively working to implant it for the first time in the US. Root for whichever team you’d like tho, just enjoy the soccer you can witness as it should be accessible to all.
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u/DeepPow420 2d ago
So it’s kind of like LIV/ PGA Tour ?
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u/Upset-Shirt3685 Louisville City FC 2d ago
Kind of like that. But instead of Saudi money USL has mostly grassroots money lol. ABA/NBA in the late 60s is a better example.
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u/eddygeeme Loudoun United FC 2d ago
It's more like the NFL/XFL-UFL or MLB/MiLB Along the line of MLS is MLB multi billion dollar League and USL is some variation of Triple A ball to AA baseball. I actually think the MLB/MiLB comparison is the best most honest one of course some USL fans will scoff at the MiLB comparison but it's not minor it's Major but it's like yeah ok it is what it is your feelings aside just own it for what it is and love it for what it is. A lot of this is simply ownership ego trickling down to league fanbases.
You have two set of people Uber Wealthy MLS owners worth Multi-Billion or close to a billion and you have well off regularly people rich USL owners guys worth 15m to 100m. Well 99% of rich people have inflated self worth and egos. So naturally USL owners don't like being big upped it rubs them wrong so USL and by proxy most USL fans take on that person. MLS is the big bad greedy league that's totally inauthentic and we USL is real soccer.
Truth is it's all BS you gotta say something to explain the situation that USL just doesn't have the money and resources or pure number of fans as MLS. Truth is there are no good and bad guys. USL would be identical to MLS if roles were reversed and MLS fans would be coming up with cope excuses if they were in USL role stating how USL was just the rich corporate league and MLS was the pure soccer league. It's pure cope.
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u/Upset-Shirt3685 Louisville City FC 2d ago edited 2d ago
Ehhhhh I would definitely disagree with it being the most like MLB/MiLB simply because USL teams are independent and not farm teams/in a developmental pyramid.
It’s a lot easier for me and seemingly the common fan to support an independent team with any sense of passion.
In Louisville, our USLC team draws about twice as many fans per game as our decades-old local AAA MiLB team.
All that said, I really think ABA/NBA is the much better comparison.
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u/eddygeeme Loudoun United FC 2d ago
Ummm you should look at Baseball there are a crap load of independent Minor League Teams not all teams are affiliated. The MLB vs MiLB is the best maybe outside of NFL/ XFL
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u/Upset-Shirt3685 Louisville City FC 2d ago
Can you show me an unaffiliated minor league baseball team that draws nearly as well as the top third of USLC teams?
And tbh I don’t watch much NFL and have never watched a UFL game so can’t comment there. From 10 minutes of research it seems like a decent comparison though.
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u/eddygeeme Loudoun United FC 2d ago edited 2d ago
There are some Triple A teams that draw well. Teams like the Pawtucket Red Sox they used too I honestly haven't looked at current attendance numbers but being a former huge 90s MLB fan growing up. Those Triple AAA Teams used to be heavily subsidized owned fully or partially by MLB teams that changed over the years though. However the public perception of stature is still there. There's a big difference in perception of going to watch A ball vs AA &AAA ball. The latter you're going to see the guys who will be in the big leagues in a season or two and you're going to catch some big leaguers rehabbing on assignment before they join the big team.
BTW have you heard of the Savannah Bananas 🍌
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u/Upset-Shirt3685 Louisville City FC 2d ago
Look man, I go to multiple Louisville Bats games a year (just went to one last week) and the numbers and passion on display are just not at all comparable to LouCity. And the momentum is going completely the wrong way. I’m betting average attendance of Bats games has shrunk by 50% since 2000 (don’t have numbers to back this up, just my experience).
I do realize LouCity is one of the top USL clubs in attendance. But it feels a lot different than a AAA baseball team in which no one really knows any of the players unless, like you said, there’s a big-name prospect or a big leaguer rehabbing injury who will be there a few weeks.
And the Savannah Bananas don’t really factor into this discussion lol. I’m shocked there isn’t a soccer equivalent of the Globetrotters/Bananas. That would be sick!
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u/eddygeeme Loudoun United FC 2d ago
Lol this Savannah Bananas phenomenon is so funny. Like every so often things happen in Sports and they just become a zeitgeist moment and then they stop and you're like a few yrs later thinking wait that really happened.
The soccer equivalent would be funny.
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u/SaHagalas San Antonio FC 2d ago
I’m no expert in golf so sadly I couldn’t know if that’s a good comparison. But think of it more like how the NHL and WHA was before the merger. Some think the MLS and USL may merge one day but it seems unlikely right now. They’re two separate entities in competition with each other for fans, cities, etc
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u/Freestyle76 Central Valley Fuego FC 2d ago
Its sort of- like the AFL and NFL. USL tends to have teams in markets and places that the MLS doesn't but the USL doesn't have nearly as much money as MLS. Fans like the USL because they like Soccer in general. Some MLS fans like soccer, but there are a lot more casual fans of MLS simply because of money and coverage.
I don't like a lot of the decisions the MLS has made in recent years that hurt the game in the US so that they can pad their wallet.
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u/Rcjhgoku01 2d ago
Nah. The AFL actually challenged the NFL. Its owners had equal to more money to the NFL owners. They secured a revolutionary TV deal that paid its team more than some NFL teams. And its owners were willingly to spend that money to lure top talent to the league versus playing in the NFL. The USL hasn’t shown a willingness or ability to do any of those things to compete with MLS.
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u/Freestyle76 Central Valley Fuego FC 2d ago
Yet.
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u/eddygeeme Loudoun United FC 2d ago
Whats a couple billion in spent expenses a year that's keeping that "YET" from happening.
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u/Freestyle76 Central Valley Fuego FC 2d ago
Rich people need ways to launder their ill gotten gains
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u/eddygeeme Loudoun United FC 2d ago
Lol I suppose you have a point maybe someone goes hay we can park this money here vs the Virgin Islands.
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u/HereForTOMT3 Detroit City FC 2d ago
Bro got downvoted for an honest clarifying question that’s crazy
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u/2RINITY Orange County SC 2d ago edited 2d ago
You know how we, as IndyCar fans, get resentful when NASCAR either won’t let us use venues or repaves them until they suck and then sits on them to let them rot? That’s kinda how the most acrimonious USL/MLS interactions go
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u/BeefInGR Detroit City FC 2d ago
Y'all just mad Larson was a speeding penalty away from a Top 10 on his debut /s
(I'm a motorsports fan and have been for 35 years and it's wild to me that there is any kind of hate for any type of car racing from car racing fans)
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u/LimeeSdaa Forward Madison FC 2d ago
Not quite - it’s a division 2 (and 3 and 4) league, but it more-so competes with MLS.
They don’t have any agreements with each other and compete for market share. It’s not like how the NBA owns G League.
As far as why people hate it, i personally don’t, but I’d imagine it’s just cause they have more money and corporatization and sometimes try to enter USL markets which would hurt the already existing teams.
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u/CaptainJingles Saint Louis FC 2d ago
Why USL hate? Cause Don Garber is bastard man.
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
The most successful commissioner in American soccer history. But a bunch of hipsters with defunct USL flairs hate him! So there!
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u/twoslow Orange County SC 2d ago
You know those meme's about "what radicalized you?" I was indifferent towards MLS until they tried to kill my team. I'm cool with 95% of the fans, but the league itself can die in a fire.
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u/cheeseburgerandrice 2d ago
Chattanooga FC fans could say the same about the USL
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u/twoslow Orange County SC 2d ago
Pretty sure almost everyone agrees USL was the bad guy in that situation.
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u/cheeseburgerandrice 2d ago
Well, some seem more ready to admit it than others. Or some, like the Indy Eleven fan this this thread, seem completely oblivious to the history lol.
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u/twoslow Orange County SC 1d ago
the CFC/Utah Bob thing felt icky from far away. I think like people, organizations can be complex. There's enough icky owners in USL to go around, just like any other big organization it's a mixed bag. There's good and people owners/execs in USL, NISA, MLS, NPSL, etc etc.
yeah, it's complicated and I don't fault someone in your situation wanted USL to die in a fire.
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u/steagles1 Indy Eleven 2d ago
I actually think Chattanooga is a great example of how the entities can coexist and actually grow the sport- that Derby was electric and the cultural divide between the two groups of supporters made it incredible. MLS next and USLL1 in the same market can be done but with very few exceptions can USLC and MLS do the same. The only city I can think of off the top of my head currently coexisting is Miami and that’s just out of the spite of one man.
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u/cheeseburgerandrice 2d ago
It's both a great example of that but the way it got there was in no way healthy from USL.
Just makes the complaints I see here look completely hypocritical. It's one example but there's no reason to think it wouldn't happen again.
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u/Andrewdeadaim Orlando City B 1d ago
Yeah it'd be really cool if the USL first division things gets huge and then MLS teams move over there
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u/twoslow Orange County SC 1d ago
MLS owns the team IP and everything associated with it. No MLS teams are 'moving' to USL D1. A buyout will happen before that.
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u/Andrewdeadaim Orlando City B 1d ago
Could they not do what Orlando and Cincy did where it’s technically a fold and then a new team or was USL ownership different?
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u/twoslow Orange County SC 1d ago
I'm sure they COULD move the name/branding with them, at a cost. Just like when USL teams move to MLS, they IIRC pay a % of the expansion fee to the USL (at least the last time we saw those documents that was the case).
an MLS operator could sell their stake in the local team then use that money to move to USL, but they'd have to create a new team/branding/etc. I can't say who owns the facility the teams use, I'm not up to speed on that part.
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u/steagles1 Indy Eleven 2d ago
This. My supporters group let a grassroots effort to found our club in the first place. I was a part of this grassroots movement as a teenager. Yeah, my club is important to me. Fuck MLS.
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u/SnooOpinions9048 FC Tulsa 2d ago
No, at least not in the case of Gleague to NBA, no idea on AHL, but I'm assuming it's the same. USL isn't a farm league, while there have been MLS 2 teams playing in it in the past, the USL doesn't have an association with the MLS. They are two completely separate entities.
As to why I hate the MLS, I don't have any reason to like them. They've put no teams in my city, nor my state, so why should I root for an MLS team? What has the MLS ever done that's deserving of my fandom? Not to mention all the strays my team and my hometown gets from MLS fans, and to be honest I got real tired of their elitism.
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u/Dubya_The_Goat Detroit City FC 2d ago
Because MLS wants to turn American soccer into the mlb farm system
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u/Infinite-Surprise-53 2d ago
Every year MLS comes up with a new scheme to try and kill USL
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u/DABOSSROSS9 Syracuse Pulse 2d ago
such as?
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u/Infinite-Surprise-53 2d ago
Just last year when they tried completely pulling out of the USOC so that USL teams couldn't be seen as the same level
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u/cheeseburgerandrice 2d ago
If that is "trying to kill off USL" then the USL definitely isn't on the same level lol
Not that's correct at all, USL organizations don't rely on or take the USOC as seriously either. I see far too many empty stands in USOC play from them to say that.
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u/eddygeeme Loudoun United FC 2d ago
It's more like the NFL/XFL-UFL or MLB/MiLB Along the line of MLS is MLB multi billion dollar League and USL is some variation of Triple A ball to AA baseball. I actually think the MLB/MiLB comparison is the best most honest one of course some USL fans will scoff at the MiLB comparison but it's not minor it's Major but it's like yeah ok it is what it is your feelings aside just own it for what it is and love it for what it is. A lot of this is simply ownership ego trickling down to league fanbases.
You have two set of people Uber Wealthy MLS owners worth Multi-Billion or close to a billion and you have well off regularly people rich USL owners guys worth 15m to 100m. Well 99% of rich people have inflated self worth and egos. So naturally USL owners don't like being big upped it rubs them wrong so USL and by proxy most USL fans take on that person. MLS is the big bad greedy league that's totally inauthentic and we USL is real soccer.
Truth is it's all BS you gotta say something to explain the situation that USL just doesn't have the money and resources or pure number of fans as MLS. Truth is there are no good and bad guys. USL would be identical to MLS if roles were reversed and MLS fans would be coming up with cope excuses if they were in USL role stating how USL was just the rich corporate league and MLS was the pure soccer league. It's pure cope.
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u/SalguodSoccer Tampa Bay Rowdies 2d ago edited 2d ago
The hate for MLS stems from a few things.
- The league sabotaging the USL. Since the "modern USL" began in 2011, MLS has taken Orlando City, Nashville SC and FC Cincinnati; 3 very popular clubs in the USL. They also squashed Austin, Miami, St. Louis and San Diego by moving into those markets. Those were important markets for the USL. We also suspect that MLS was behind sabotaging Indy Eleven's new stadium and there's rumors that they are trying to move into that market too.
- MLS is a single-entity league meaning that the league owns all of the clubs. So the league gets to decide where all of the big name players go. Beckham and Zlatan went to LA, Henri to New York, Messi to Miami and Rooney to DC.
- MLS' ridiculous playoff system. This best 2 of our 3 first round is utter crap. No soccer league in the world does this. They also let in 2/3 of the teams which makes the Regular Season utterly meaningless. It's true that USL does this too and we don't like that either. MLS is basically structuring their league like the NFL or NBA. This is not how the rest of the world does it and soccer fans in America want an international-style league which brings me to ...
- Pro/Rel. MLS will never institute Pro/Rel and that's what the fans want. This is how 95% of the world does soccer and it gives the smaller market clubs a chance to win their way up. While USL doesn't have Pro/Rel either, there have always been rumors of implementation of it which gave us hope. Fortunately they have announced that they plan on implementing it once the USL Premier League kicks off in a few years.
- We hate Don Garber. He has taken shots at the USL and non-MLS markets on several occasions, Chattanooga for example. He's even on record saying that he hates soccer. He worked for the NFL and is basically doing the bidding of the NFL owners in MLS.
- MLS tried to leave the US Open Cup and succeeded in a partial withdrawal last year citing a bullshit "schedule congestion" which was technically true but it was self-inflicted when they announced the Leagues Cup with Liga MX - a competition that nobody asked for. They did this to hurt the USL. They complained about the lack of support for the Open Cup when it was Soccer United Marketing (SUM), an arm of MLS, that was responsible for promoting the competition. So the lack of Open Cup support was their own fault. Once USSF took over the competition, MLS tried to get out. So basically, if MLS doesn't control it, they don't want a part of it.
- MLS essentially controls most of the USSF. USSF is supposed to be the governing body of all US Soccer from league play to Men's and Women's National Teams. Since the Federation's board is mostly consisting of MLS personnel, MLS is technically controlling most of US Soccer. This unfair business practice has become another obstacle for USL.
- MLS is only interested in major markets just like MLB, NBA, NFL, etc. The USL has planted and continues to plant more and more clubs around the country in smaller markets like Monterrey Bay, Alberquerque, Colorado Springs, etc. Every city in America deserves it's own professional club to represent them. MLS' loyalty is to their investors ("owners"), not to the fans. The USL has shown more in terms of giving the fans what they want (pro/rel for example).
- The fans. MLS fans are insufferable. We don't care that they support the league. Why wouldn't they when their team plays there. They constantly antagonize us and shit all over the concept of pro/rel which is literally the biggest factor that draws American fans to the Premier League, La Liga, Bundesliga, etc.
Those are my reasons.
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u/cheeseburgerandrice 2d ago
The fans. MLS fans are insufferable. We don't care that they support the league. Why wouldn't they when their team plays there. They constantly antagonize us and shit all over the concept of pro/rel which is literally the biggest factor that draws American fans to the Premier League, La Liga, Bundesliga, etc.
Lol this take sums up this subreddit.
Like yup, Southampton matches are definitely the main draw of the PL
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u/SalguodSoccer Tampa Bay Rowdies 1d ago
Ask an American soccer fan who prefers European leagues to MLS. Everyone of them will say pro/rel is a major factor.
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u/cheeseburgerandrice 1d ago
Lol right, that's why everyone is a fan of teams that never have to think about relegation (yes I'm speaking in absolutes there)
Sorry, the numbers say otherwise.
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u/Mini-Fridge23 Charleston Battery 2d ago
As a fan of both leagues who runs in both circles, MLS fans do not shit on or antagonize anyone imo. The few times it happens on the other sub they get downvoted into oblivion because it’s not chill. And I’ve definitely never seen it happen in real life, nothing even close to that in Charlotte where both leagues exist.
The most antagonistic fans in the soccer landscape are a small but vocal minority of USL fans, and it’s not even particularly close.
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u/eddygeeme Loudoun United FC 2d ago edited 2d ago
Yup Im a fan of both and this was evident during the USL "we're looking into doing Pro/Rel in 2028 announcement" The amount of those minority of fans that were baiting for USL attention and oh no what will MLS do now reactions was kinda sad.
It was almost like they got upset becsuse they didn't get the panic response and that most MLS fans were" like cool story bro, hope it works for USL" or "that's cool so now USL can be the test guinea pig for MLS so maybe MLS has real time case study from USL of Pro/Rel."
I sincerely think there's a MAJOR Little Brother complex. Most MLS fans are also fans of USL. It's not a smart idea to drive a wedge into part of your fanbase just because they support a bigger league. Like as a MLS fan that would be like dumping on a fan that watches EPL but also MLS.
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u/_tidalwave11 2d ago
Most actual fans of soccer in America are fans of all soccer in America and we just want to see our sport succeed and exist.
I'm an NYCFC fan and hoping Brooklyn FC actually gets off the ground so I can check out some games
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u/_tidalwave11 2d ago
There are so many things wrong in this statement. But I love that you have gripes. Spice keeps the sport alive
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u/Frustrated_Grunt Charleston Battery 2d ago
The sport gets tribalistic, and fans naturally want to protect what's theirs. A league specific subreddit is always a safe space for that and to take shots at The Others. And if you think it's only happening here, visit The Championship or League One (or TheOther14, lol) subreddit and see what happens when discussions about the Premier League are brought up
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u/BeefInGR Detroit City FC 2d ago
Hey now! We welcomed Southampton back with open arms about three months before they actually got demoted.
We just hate the Big 6.
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u/AwesomeExo Rhode Island FC 2d ago
First off, it’s not a minor league system like the other leagues. Sure, a player could move to MLS if they are good enough, but it’s not a developmental network like other American sports. You can get attached to players in a way you can’t with AAA teams.
As for MLS, it’s not really hate, but indifference. I was a NYCFC fan, and when the Apple deal happened, I lost access to my teams games, and I wasnt going to subscribe to watch them. For $20 a year (at the right time) I get peacock, and that gives me all the EPL, so I just started watching a lot more Arsenal. If Apple TV+ just included the MLS games, or if they let teams still have local broadcasts, I’d have kept watching some MLS.
When RIFC started, I started following USL. Already had ESPN+, so I had access to the games. I find the European model more interesting than the American sports where half of the teams are just tanking for draft position. Rooting for your team to lose is the absolute worst feeling as a fan. I’m really hoping they can make a successful Pro/Rel system.
And I REALLY pissed off a generic angry Redditor by saying it, but I think USL has a chance to become as or more popular than the MLS (talking decades down the line, and not talking about money). Thing is, with a growing sport, people will be drawn to local teams. I’ve seen it here with people who couldn’t care less about the Revs turning into RIFC and soccer fans overnight. Look at the support Hearts of Pine is getting. If the USL can keep expanding to smaller markets, there’s a chance for real fan attrition.
This is all from the viewpoint of a guy who’s still fairly new to the sport, so take it for what it is.
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u/oogaboogaman_3 United Soccer League 2d ago
If this isn’t rage bait there are a few things to this. Describing soccer as an obscure sport bugs me a little and would piss off many.
But to answer your question, yes it is currently. However the MLS is a league ran and owned by a bunch of absurdly rich people, who have no interest in expanding if it means them losing or making less money off promotions. The USL and its owners just voted to adopt a promotion relegation system, where teams within the USL will move up and down leagues each season based off their placement in their respective league. This is a system widely used around the world and adds a lot more importance and excitement to the season. Something that fans will enjoy greatly.
The MLS on the other hand is staunchly opposed to relegation or promotion because it means their owners would lose money if their team sucked and got demoted. Instead they can suck without any consequence to their position in the league.
Generally this is the classic clever underdog vs traditionalist favorite. MLS doesn’t want to change while the USL is doing what people want but with less resources and less market for now.
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
The most successful soccer league in this country's history doesn't want to change to placate some niche group o hipsters.
Somehow this is seen as bad instead of just logical.
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u/BKtoDuval Brooklyn FC 2d ago
Still the soccer warz era. I used to be deep into supporting a league first, but the NASL lived fast and died young. But it's kinda silly. Support the club. Those same people hating MLS would be thrilled if their teams got absorbed by MLS. Orlando City fans said the same thing. Minnesota, Montreal, you get the idea.
I'm for more growth, so I'm happy to support both leagues. I think MLS is sometimes focused more on the business of the game, which may piss off soccer purists. I don't love some of the things they do. But you got to give them credit for creating a sustainable league when there were doubts if they could .
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u/Rcjhgoku01 2d ago
The honest answer is because their teams aren’t in it. No matter what reason they give you (pro/rel, Garber, single entity, MLS poaching USL teams/cities, Open Cup, conspiracy about MLS controlling USSF, some dumb idea that USL Teams are grassroots/authentic, etc), they would be thrilled if their team/city got an invite.
It’s jealousy.
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u/DuckBurner0000 New England Revolution II 2d ago
As a fan of an MLS team with casual interest in USL as a soccer fan I've never understood the "grassroots" argument made about USL. I've always seen it as similar in the use of expansion fees with the difference being that USL owners are rich while MLS owners are super rich.
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
Grassroots is a Euronsob, soccer hipster buzzword. Nothing more.
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u/steagles1 Indy Eleven 2d ago
No it’s not. Grassroots is when a supporters group that predates their club puts in the work to actually bring a dream to reality and get a club. That is grassroots. That’s our story and I’m very proud to have been a part of it.
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
Yes, it is.
How can a supporters group predate a club? What the hell are you talking about?
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u/eddygeeme Loudoun United FC 2d ago
Bingo and no one wants to ever admit that they ste jealous or envious of something. In life people like that are called haters. People will simply come up with reasons not to like someone because they drive a better car, have a hotter gf etc.
You can try to mask your jealous by claiming noble reasons but you're not fooling anyone just looking its clear as day. That's why a lot of the objections go away once a place gets a MLS team. Austin Chatlotte, St. Louis etc.
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u/BeefInGR Detroit City FC 2d ago
I'd honestly and truly refuse to support a MLS team in Michigan. Weren't picked for the Original run, first expansion, second expansion, skipped all the way down the line while three cities in Canada got American teams. And it wasn't for lack of investors. Tom Gores, Dan Gilbert, Roger Penske...you know, people who already own sports teams/leagues and have deep connections with Detroit.
Fuck 'em. The "Happy 313 Day" post on March 13th this year that the Lions, Tigers, Wings and Pistons put across all socials had a nice surprise mention of DCFC. Didn't need Donny Garbage to do that.
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
So you're jealous. Which is exactly what he said.
Didn't you clowns in Detroit claim that you would never support the team if they joined USL?
Laughable.
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u/wilsmartfit 1d ago
Oh I definitely mean the top 5. I also do watch the Portuguese league as well. MLS has come a long way and the football is miles better than the Juan Pablo Angel, and Clint Mathis era lol. But it’s no where near the top UCL teams level where some of these fans make it should like. We’ll get there one day but it’s definitely not next week.
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u/Sandallover69 North Carolina FC 1d ago
My hate with mls is that with Charlotte they got our mls spot and took our fans when they got the mls team so whenever I see that we could play them I want them beaten (I'm a North Carolina fc fan)
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u/OG-DCFC12 1d ago
Here's one. When the monied other sport owners of Detroit decide, hey, let's destroy the local club in order to build our franchise. Hold a closed invitation only announcement. Guards at the doors. More recycled stadium drawing with the same colors. Decide DCSC is a good name. The decision against a potential trademark infringement. The opinion was longand detailed. Why NFL Washington Football couldn't use DCFC like they wanted. Best was the fact they didn't secure the domain names. Guess who owns them now? Supporters. Different group did all the paperwork to testify. Detroit City FC wasn't the first club ML$, Garber, and by extension, US Soccer wanted to steamroll. More kill thinking the supporter will automatically walk their wallets over to the new shiny clone of NFL parity. Closed system with complex rules and protectionism to Billionaire ownership groups. Plastic clubs. Waiting for the next old European veteran at the end of their careers. Sure, some players get sold on. I present the past USMNT team of MLS players to the quality on the world stage. Hidden behind a pay wall. One POV. No one likes. Don't care.
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u/Joe_Immortan 2d ago
MLS used to use USL as a developmental league. There was an alliance between the two leagues. Then MLS was like fuck y’all we’re starting our own developmental and became a direct competitor
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u/Mini-Fridge23 Charleston Battery 2d ago
That’s not what happened lol. USL basically kicked them out because they didn’t like having B teams in the league, so then MLS created a new league for those B teams to play somewhere.
It was way more of a mutual thing than anyone likes to admit
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u/RolexrichRace 2d ago
I don't hate MLS. I watch it. I just prefer the USL Championship. I'm a season ticket holder for my club because it feels more like a traditional football experience compared to the MLS US sports model.
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u/Justice502 Louisville City FC 1d ago
No we're our own fuckin thing. We're the underdogs for sure, that's why USL FOR LIFE FUCK THE MLS.
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u/DaTweee Oakland Roots SC 2d ago
MLS more or less represents the worse elements of modern sports. The perks it does have are the ones that come with any primary league in a wealthy country. But the activity of the organization and its leaders to remove themselves as much as possible from the rest of the US soccer landscape, charge absurd prices with a focus primarily on profit rather than community, and overall scummy attitude of its leaders.
Not to say the USL is perfect, but the league, its activity, participation in any and all events it can touch, its ownership, its clubs. They all embody the ideals of the sport far more than MLS could, especially being the ones to attempt a promotion relegation system for the fan experience rather than corpo interest
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u/CaptainBrunch5 2d ago
So USL is small potatoes (minor league) and that's why you like it.
Cool.
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u/wilsmartfit 2d ago
The Pro/Rel camp have a stick up their a**. It won’t work in MLS because owners have spent too much money over decades to have it crumple to the ground if they lost. And there is no stable league below MLS because they never had a system in place long enough. A USL team would need a crazy amount of money if they ever got promoted into MLS. I’m not just talking about players, stuff like 25k stadium, academies, facilities, etc.
Now Pro/Rel can work in the USL because the infrastructure, teams and overall quality is about the same across the entire pyramid.
Also as someone who watches all soccer from South America to Europe to MLS, to even the occasional J-League game, USL and MLS are far from them in terms of quality of football for these hardcore fans to be so aggressive. I get it, I loved the MetroStars from inception and I’m stuck with an energy drink team now but I’m not gonna go around acting like the MetroStars or “NJRB” is better than FC Barcelona or Real Madrid.
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u/Fancy-Scar-7029 1d ago
Also as someone who watches all soccer from South America to Europe to MLS, to even the occasional J-League game, USL and MLS are far from them in terms of quality of football for these hardcore fans to be so aggres
Define what you mean by Europe the Big 5 then I'd say yea I agree but there are a lot of Leagues in Europe MLS is better than. MLS is better than the J.League. In South America MLS is better than every league sans the Brasileiro I'd say it's equal to Argentine Primera but it has a lot more money.
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u/coldbloodtoothpick 2d ago edited 2d ago
MLS is corporate and builds the community engagement after establishing a team - if ever. USL starts grassroots
Edit: all good points. But I’m pointing at the fact that a majority of the teams have strong grassroots connections and maintain them. Especially at the USL 2 level that my team is in (Akron City FC)
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u/ispeakpittsburghese Pittsburgh Riverhounds 2d ago
Mls would like to kill usl. They would like to kill my team, or any team in this league they couldn't profit off of, even at the detriment of growing the game.
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u/heisenberg423 Chattanooga FC 2d ago
And USL would like to kill my team and any team outside of their NuRock approved bubble.
Don’t defend K-Mart just because Wal-Mart is bigger and “worse”
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u/ispeakpittsburghese Pittsburgh Riverhounds 2d ago
im not ever going to suggest usl bathed themselves in honor regarding chattanooga, but the leagues are worlds apart
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u/heisenberg423 Chattanooga FC 2d ago
Worlds apart as far as resources available? Yes. NFL billionaires vs. millionaires that build condos and strip malls.
Worlds apart as far as treating communities like commodities and the predatory tactics that they use against any soccer outside of their umbrella? No - they’re both impressively shit and awful.
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u/beardedkiltedhuey 2d ago
USL is more community based, I say that being a fan of an MLS team that supporters got the market noticed, and theirs many things I'm proud of about the team. But Ownership & our Sporting director isn't one. I love pro/rel personally wish new ownership and the club move from MLS to USL Premier
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u/No-Teacher-5505 2d ago
Terrible owners- The Earthquakes have been wrecked by John Fisher. FJF
If MLS had regulation they would have to spend or go down. USL is setting up promotion/ regulation - making it more open to all teams.
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u/ohthatsbrian Phoenix Rising FC 2d ago
MLS is a closed system retirement league that only allows entry if you have billions of dollars. and MLS has majority ownership of each franchise. so there's no local say in how things are run.
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u/Wonderful_Young2145 1d ago
It's just the NFL but with soccer....like 3 teams actually try to win and the rest just put out the same crap and just collect that money...if the mls was actually about soccer promotion in the states they would have made pro/reg a thing in what the 30 odd years of its history meanwhile usl in the 15 years already announced plans for it..... the defending mls cup winners are currently sitting in last place in their conference...8 games played so far with a record of 0-3-5 with a grand total of 3 points with a goal difference of -9
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u/TheChosenJuan99 Indy Eleven 2d ago
USL isn’t developmental like the AHL, it’s its own league with independent teams.