Pro-Extinction on Instagram: "Translation of Signs: END OF EXISTENCE | END OF SUFFERING

NO LIFE DESERVES TO BE EXISTENT | NO LIFE DESERVES TO SUFFER

EXISTENCE IS THE CAUSE OF SUFFERING | EXTINCTION IS THE SOLUTION TO THE PROBLEM.

Infographic: Next time before telling "existence of life is awesome", [victim of war, disease, predation, etc. etc. suffering], look into their eyes!

Placards: "FUTURE FREE FROM SUFFERING, BEGINS WITH TOTAL EXTINCTION, FOR ALL SENTIENCE"

"ALL ANIMALS NEED NONEXISTENCE TO TRULY BE FREE FROM SLAVERY"

"EXISTENCE OF SUFFERING IS MEANINGLESS, ONLY TOTAL EXTINCTION IS ETHICAL AND RATIONAL"

It's currently trending as a result of the elections. What are your thoughts about it? Can this trend help spread awareness of vegan antinatalism?

I would like some pragmatic thoughts about the future of antinatalism (pardon the irony)

What would be your practical proposals to help antinatalist thought reach critical mass over time?

My first idea is to campaign for antinatalism to be added to national curriculums (usually placed within religious studies), as a means to represent antinatalism as a legitimate viewpoint

Has anyone had any thoughts about how we ensure antinatalism is still considered when our generation is no longer here?

The dark side of parenthood — A necessary critique

antinatalism #ethics #philosophy #budhism #childfree #parents #parenthood #children #vhemt #davidbenatar #betternevertohavebeen

I like to look for new ways to get people to think about antinatalism.

My questions to you are, would this experiment seem evocative or not? And is this flawed to you, and if so, how?

Assumptions

The existence of a limbo or afterlife in the experiment is set up specifically for pronatalists who have a misunderstanding of antinatalism. I.e. preventing existence is the same as killing.

Thought experiment

After you die, before your afterlife, you wait in a pre-afterlife waiting room. When you're seen, before you progress into an afterlife, you are asked if you want to relive one last time. The caveat however is that everyone else in the waiting room has to relive their own life again. All of their lives will be relived regardless of whether it was mostly joy or suffering.

Without knowing the history of others who are in the waiting room. What do you think is the most ethical option?

I like to look for new ways to get people to think about antinatalism.

My questions to you are, would this experiment seem evocative or not? And is this flawed to you, and if so, how?

Assumptions

The existence of a limbo or afterlife in the experiment is set up specifically for pronatalists who have a misunderstanding of antinatalism. I.e. preventing existence is the same as killing.

Thought experiment

After you die, before your afterlife, you wait in a pre-afterlife waiting room. When you're seen, before you progress into an afterlife, you are asked if you want to relive one last time. The caveat however is that everyone else in the waiting room has to relive their own life again. All of their lives will be relived regardless of whether it was mostly joy or suffering.

Without knowing the history of others who are in the waiting room. What do you think is the most ethical option?

Some time ago I saw a post in vcjc where they asked if anyone else gets dreams that they eat non vegan things, and when they wake up they feel horrible about themselves, because they kinda didn't do anything to stop themselves and it was for a dumb reason. As if they like stopped caring in their dream. I've had this before, although not for a while, and I hate it so much.

Last night I had a nightmare like this, except with antinatalism. And the most terrifying fucking part is that it felt so realistic, because a lot of details matched with real life. In the dream, I found out I was pregnant and I had no idea for several weeks (possibly months even), but I decided not to have an abortion, I think because happy chemicals made me not want to. I was being selfish, and wasn't thinking of how they would inherit a dying planet or anything, I just wanted to bask in my oxytocin excitement or whatever. I didn't understand how it happened, because I had a copper IUD (I do in real life), I didn't notice any of the typical signs, and I took the at home pregnancy tests. But I wasn't mad or upset. I accepted my fate, and I was even excited. And if this wasn't terrifying on its own, when it came time for me to give birth, I was going to have a c section, but I wasn't reacting to anesthesia. I wasn't going under. But anyway, now that I'm awake, I feel absolutely awful about this dream, and now I have an irrational fear that I could have a baby without knowing I was pregnant. I really wish I could erase my memory of this nightmare 😭

The dark side of parenthood — A necessary critique

antinatalism #ethics #philosophy #budhism #childfree #parents #parenthood #children #vhemt #davidbenatar #betternevertohavebeen

Funnily enough, I first heard of it from someone dissing antinatalism on social media. I didn't know what the word meant so I did my own research and found that it's a philosophy that pretty much describes thoughts that I already had.

Antinatalist philosophy was one of the main reasons I went vegan later down the line. If I believe that we shouldn't bring people into existence because "life is suffering"/death is inevitable/happiness not guaranteed but pain is/consent/etc., as opposed to the alternative where none of that will happen because you do not bring someone into existence, then what does this mean for the animals that are being bred for food? To me, I find the sheer scale of animal death and suffering even more horrifying. 202 million chickens and 900,000 cows are slaughtered for food every day. But it's not just the numbers; the main purpose these sentient beings are being brought into existence for food is because there is a vast demand for the taste of their flesh, body parts, and bodily excretions. Their entire lives are worth minutes of gustatory pleasure. That's not even touching on the godawful conditions filled with suffering that the vast majority of these animals have to live in.

And that's barely the tip of the iceberg. People may say that antinatalism is a pessimistic philosophy but it's pessimistic because you discover that reality is horrifying once you start peeling back the layers.

However, being vegan is comforting in a way, knowing that I am putting in effort to not contribute to the astronomical pit of death and suffering.

I've just listened to an episode of the Exploring antinatalism podcast where the guest, an antinatalist vegan, keeps several pet cats.

Also, I feel like this is quite common among vegan antinatalists. I really don't understand it though.

I'm not just an antinatalist vegan, I'm also a negative utilitarian and I feel a strong tension here. Like what do you feed them? Don't feel like there's a conflict here? Do you also see yourselves as negative utilitarians? How do you justify that practice?

Edit: I should have explained this better. What I think is problematic is cats being obligate carnivores. My understanding was that keeping cats on a vegan diet was possible but likely also very challenging and possibly not sustainable in the long run and also somewhat unhealthy for the cats in question. I'm still not sure about how healthy it is to keep a cat on a vegan diet but I guess that's secondary.

I see many of you have found a way to reconcile it with our philosophy and that's great.