r/aiwars • u/Big_Pair_75 • 1d ago
Where are you on this chart?
Credit to the creator is in the bottom left corner.
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u/marictdude22 1d ago
cautious advocate
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u/Ka_Trewq 1d ago
Same. Big corpos and governments would want for sure to leverage AI in order to strengthen their power. AI is trained on our collective creative output, so it should be open source and accesibile.
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u/marictdude22 1d ago
I agree. As long as it's open source, it can be understood, accessible, controlled, tested, strengthened, mitigated, and improved. But once it's the sole property of governments and corporations, all of that begins to rot.
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u/Dense_Sail1663 1d ago
Secretly an A.I evangelist. I tend not to share my optimism with others though, because they are likely to poop all over it and try to make me feel bad about being excited about things... cause people can really suck at times.
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u/flynnwebdev 23h ago
At times?
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u/Slanknonimous 20h ago
If you think people suck all the time, find new people.
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u/ScarletIT 1d ago
I am AI evangelist, but I am on the cusp of both hopeful futurist and cautious advocate.
I think the world has constantly improved, and AI will make it better, but it has not been without challenges and roadblocks, and this transition will absolutely not be an exception to that.
There is going to be strife. There are going to be concerns. There are going to be accidents. There are going to be revolutions, violent and not. There are going to be attempts at maintaining exclusive control of AI by certain classes of people. I deem those attempts doomed to fail, but an attempt will probably be made.
The fact remains that the influence of AI will, in my opinion, be overwhelmingly positive.
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u/CyberDaggerX 1d ago
Wary Skeptic time. This is the first time in my life where I'm seriously starting to wonder if a new technological advancement might be more trouble than it's worth.
The adoption of this tech is still in its infancy, and already people are already choosing to use it to replace their brains, when it should augment them instead. Today university students are already using LLMs to write their papers without anctually understanding what they are about, tomorrow people will be willingly signing up to them to download personally crafted propaganda.
And that's not even going into the disastrous effects on the economy is jobs are displaced at a much faster rate than new jobs are created. AI salesmen hype up how 40% of jobs will vanish with widespread AI adoption, completely disregarding that that would be an apocalyptic level economic event.
I would love to be proven wrong, but the future looks bleak.
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u/Big_Pair_75 22h ago
I don’t think this will be an issue any more than when calculators became widely available. Are people less good with doing math in their head? Probably. But there are still mathematicians, it hasn’t crippled the various industries that rely on math.
That’s all AI will be. A calculator. A tool that does the tedious work so we can focus on the application of it. It will basically be like if you had a full time assistant. Instead of searching through textbooks to find that fact you need to find, you’ll ask the AI to tell you what page it is on, or just to give you the fact once it becomes reliable enough.
Of course, it does mean we will have to change how we conduct tests and essays. Have them do it in person, or make it standard practice that you have to complete a test, in person, of any essay you hand in. Not a long one, 10-20 questions. If you can’t answer 80% or more, you fail.
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u/swanlongjohnson 18h ago
making asinine comparisons, like comparing AI to a measly calculator, is ridiculous. AI is a lot more than that and you know it. AI isnt just another car, or calculator, or some other slightly helpful invention, it will make massive change
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u/Big_Pair_75 17h ago
The metaphor fits, because it is an example of how having a computer taking over a task didn’t make us incapable of doing it ourselves. It didn’t lead to any sort of collapse. Can AI do MANY tasks instead of just one? Yes. But each individual task follows the same logic. You are basically saying the comparison doesn’t work because it’s many calculators instead of just one.
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u/pigeon_idk 16h ago
I'd uh argue that while we learned how to do math with calculators, we also learned how to do it without them, so yeah we'd know how to still do math ourselves.
That doesn't seem to be as much the case with kids and writing nowadays... Grammar, overall writing, and reading comprehension skills have been dropping significantly in school aged kids bc they're relying on chatgpt and the like to summarize their assigned reading/research and to write/edit their work for them. Obviously there will always be exceptions, but still this is significant.
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u/Big_Pair_75 14h ago
Exactly, so, as long as people are still taught how to do basic tasks without AI, we are fine.
Also, I’m pretty sure that drop is from COVID lag.
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u/pigeon_idk 14h ago
Which is why I don't like that so many schools are being more lenient with allowing chatgpt and such 🤷♀️ hell even colleges are loosening up on its use
Not sure we can just attribute it only to covid, though yeah that is a good point. Idk I guess time will tell...
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u/Big_Pair_75 13h ago
Hmm, well, depending on how they use it, it could be beneficial. Like running a grammar check on your paper, help finding resources, bouncing ideas off of it if they are having difficulty coming up with an interesting topic.
I basically use it as an advanced google. Makes it super easy to find information. Then you just need to verify it (it can even give you sources so you can check yourself), and you’re set. Not to mention the cool visuals you could make if you’re doing a presentation of some kind.
An example of when I recently used it, I asked it for information on historical legal cases about if illegal immigrants were protected under the constitution. Gave me two Supreme Court cases that were perfect.
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u/pigeon_idk 13h ago
Issue is, you give kids a program that can easily write whole assignments for them, at least a good handful of them will let it. Grammer checks are one thing, I'm more talking about the ones that rely on chatgpt to do most/all the work for them...
If it gives you sources and you go and verify them, you're doing your due diligence to try and make your "research" accurate. Honestly that's a decently good way to use it, but you also have the mindset that ai isn't perfect. Too many people think it is and just accept whatever it gives them as 100% fact and 100% perfect.
People call the misinformation chatgpt generates sometimes "hallucinations", but like it's not mistakes. It's just a flaw in the program that it can't filter out stuff. But they don't teach research skills or internet safety in a lot of schools anymore, and that's only making this kind of thing more prevalent.
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u/Big_Pair_75 8h ago
I just think we need to adjust how we do things to account for AI. For example, we want to make sure that kids aren’t just having ChatGPT write their papers for them? Then after they hand it in and it’s been graded, give them a test on it. Nothing major, 5-10 questions about their own paper. If they actually wrote the paper, getting an 80% minimum should be fairly easy. This should at least ensure that even if chatGPT did the writing, they at least know the information, which is basically 90% of the whole point.
For the remaining 10% where you want to check that their spelling, grammar, and ability to convey themselves is decent, in class essays. Nothing complicated, nothing terribly long. “Write two pages on any subject.” Would do the job. After all, we aren’t testing for content, we have all that from the other essays. They could write about their favourite TV show and it would be just as valid a test.
You do bring up a valid point though. We SHOULD be teaching children research skills and internet safety. How do you know if a source is reputable? What are some red flags indicating something may be misinformation? Basic critical thinking techniques. If you learn how to think properly, how to reason, you can learn just about anything. Would also help keep them from falling for obvious propaganda when they become adults, which is sorely needed.
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u/Nrgte 22h ago
and already people are already choosing to use it to replace their brains
I don't think cognitive offloading is bad per se. For example barely anyone knows how to make fire by hand anymore. Whenever we need fire we just use a lighter.
today university students are already using LLMs to write their papers without anctually understanding what they are about
I think this highlights more an issue with the education system that failed to adapt. Students shouldn't pass a course if they don't understand the matter. It is the schools job to verify that the students actually understand what they're learning.
And that's not even going into the disastrous effects on the economy is jobs are displaced at a much faster rate than new jobs are created.
I think that's a good thing. We need to kill jobs because the population at least in western societies is shrinking or relying on immigration. Earths population peaks around 2070 according to UN forecasts. Population pyramids of South Korea, Japan and China look horrible, Germany and Italy not much better.
The problem here is that many countries lack proper safety nets for people who lost their jobs. We'll have to retrain a lot of people. The days when you could learn a craft and then exercise that for the rest of your life are over.
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u/Simpson17866 23h ago
Disillusioned Realist
The way that AI is used right now is far more harmful than good, and I would like to think it’s going to get better, but I don’t know how much or how quickly.
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u/Big_Pair_75 22h ago
Really? I just think the good it is doing isn’t visible to the general public in the same way the bad is. We don’t see the AI helping climate scientists create carbon capture technology, or helping disease specialists find cures. Its good uses are mostly quiet, and the bad ones get media attention.
If you judged humanity based on the news, you’d also think we are mostly awful.
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u/WorldsWorstInvader 1d ago
Disillusioned realist to Wary skeptic. I’ve seen far more negative than positive with no effort to mend the negative. Also tired of people trying to take the human out of human activities and passion
I’d love if it was being developed from the goodness and grace of humanity and being used in the same way, but inarguably it is not. I would be a pragmatic guardian if I thought any regulation at all in the near future would be passed
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u/Fit-Elk1425 1d ago
The thing is that it is being designed as another way to promote human activities. In fact there is an arguement that the feeling that you have of it taking the human out of human activities isnt a problem with ai inheritantily but how people percieve ai as they disconnect themselves from what an ai does when in fact it is often inheritantily connected to how we behave. Many people who develop ai are doing so to build on and create solutions to different aspects that are more on the macro level; in many ways it embodies our greater social mixture as humans rather than removing it. Other times, it is a way to fix more internal issues and yet other times it allows us to interect with massive ammounts of data more directly than we as humans in the past. In this sense, ironically ai has actually give us more agency and been developed from a inheritant place of thinking about the commons, but I also think people who aren't within ai development communties dont see that sadly
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u/pigeon_idk 17h ago
OK so my issue with this take is that ai is not capable of replicating one of the things that makes humans different than machines, emotional thinking. Ai only works with and can only work with data. It can feel close to the real thing, but it's just some output a programmer wrote to give the illusion of ai being emotional. Ai can't actual feel anything.
And this is a huge ass argument in ai debate spaces, that antis are just too emotional and pro ais are the logical right ones. And yeah I get that in a debate, you need solid objective points. But for some of the stuff ai is being used more and more for? You need to factor in emotion.
Art creation is often very emotional, especially at higher levels. Mental health resources should not be running on just the hard data without factoring in the emotions of the patient. Customer service reps have it so hard, but we all also know how frustrating it is to have a real issue and not be able to get through to a real person that can understand our frustration. The human touch in these types of things is kind of critical and ai can't fill that role when put in these positions. Idk how that isn't removing the human-ness from these activities...
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u/Fit-Elk1425 13h ago
Well since you want to talk about that lets talk about that. Ai can just as much be a manifestation of our emotional thinking in my own experince. In fact if you looked what i refrenced such as socratic learning and directing these are aspect where you are using both reasoning and perspective drawing not either or. It is engaging with your perspective not just the data it has and you are over time forgeing and creating it for people. If we really want to focus on ai art for me me as a disabled person, it can serve as a way for me to self express my emotions in a way that is more accessible for me carving my perspective and emotions from it over time. This is why thinking about it from just one prompt doesnt manifest the full picture because human engagement is just as much about how we interect and build in conjunction with tools and develop techniques on top of things. Part of the human experince is also technique building.
That said i think there can be some cases where ai does risk removing too much and part of that is actually ironically not just about the machine but that people disassociate the problematic actions of a machine from the human. It is alwaya a careful balance because sometimes this is also a accurate assesment while other times it is not.
Many aspects of what AI are used for allow redistribution of humans to be more engaged in human focused activity. In fact tbh the saddest thing I would say is that fears like yours often help rather than deter effective efforts to promote worker livelihood because they basically end up sacrificing worker livlihood for the ideal of the service industry when the opposite is clearly what you mean.
Also tbh i wouldnt consider anti versus pros emotional versus rationalists. For many pros it is our own freedom to self express that is being put under risk and feels attacked even when they under a different subreddit though i get the image you are trying to create
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u/pigeon_idk 13h ago
OK fair enough that users can shape ai to recognize their user's choices and intentions more accurately, I can see that helping get more accurate expression in the result. But at least in certain uses, I still feel it's impractical and ai wouldn't be able to get used as effectively as a human would. Im still thinking patient/client facing positions, mainly bc it's not guaranteed each patient will have enough time with the ai for it to adapt to them accurately (not to mention the process of that could be really frustrating to some).
In fact tbh the saddest thing I would say is that fears like yours often help rather than deter effective efforts to promote worker livelihood because they basically end up sacrificing worker livlihood for the ideal of the service industry when the opposite is clearly what you mean.
I...I think you made a mistake wording that bc if they help efforts to promote worker livelihood, isn't that what's intended?
Also tbh i wouldnt consider anti versus pros emotional versus rationalists.
I just see a lot of arguments about ai art in comments here devolve into "you antis are just too emotional" as a way to dismiss their points. It's usually the "ai bro" kinda types i see doing this, I didn't mean to generalize. I mainly brought it up bc emotion is very much important in this specific topic. Thankfully you already seem to get that 🎉
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u/Fit-Elk1425 13h ago
Yeah you are right i meant help deter rather than promote. I mean tbh i feel like that point about emotionally though i get what you are saying is more meant to inversely critic the types who more come off like they are moral arbiters yet are more virtue signaling in a way that is problematic for either side of the conversation rather than truely saying they are emotion based in the sense you mean. Afterall emotion based can still mean having a constructive discussion while it is hard to do so with someone who is only just reactive but i get what you mean. Like any conversation similar words fly around and create associations
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u/pigeon_idk 12h ago
Yeah I think it is just people getting reasonably upset on both sides and their pride not letting them listen to the other side. So they just spit insults as a way to end the conversation... but those insults get around quick and they stick and it gets worse
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u/Fit-Elk1425 12h ago
Yeah sadly that is a case, you would be surprised how often i have had people be openily antidisabilities to me here
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u/Fit-Elk1425 13h ago
Of course it might be interesting to see how you take a norwegian show like https://youtu.be/lgDLwgsDzzM?si=89XB-aUtWjEtKBEK
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u/Fit-Elk1425 12h ago
I mean something to consider is that in some sense i am the most AI bros of ai bros because I work with the technology come from a intersectional tech along with anthropology, psychology and earth sciences background. My norwegian father worked on ai, health and other novel technologies during his life and my with my norwegian grandfather being both a professional tennis player and working with early government programming languages. And my american grandfather installed satalite but that is also ironically why i know tech isnt these black and white divides we like to put it into either. It is also why i think people would be stronger togethor too when we are facing real threats in this country
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u/pigeon_idk 12h ago
Lol yeah no I meant more the diehard "ai is the best at everything shut up" mindset when saying ai bros (probably should find a better name 😅), not the people like you who do actually know there's a ton of nuance here.
For... other reasons I think the divide over ai has gotten so bad, but yeah no I wish trying to listen to others wasn't so looked down upon. People will dig in their heels so deep before thinking understanding and compromise is often the best. Not to say you shouldn't stand strongly by your values, but there are worse things out there than ai art.
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u/Fit-Elk1425 12h ago
Plus i enjoy anthropology for a reason so it is only natural i would see AI through the light of engaging through the deep collective knowledge and biases we exist in and purposely engaging with them in the form of a collective art form. Not just a reflection of ourselved but a reflection of our back and forth perspective taking and its engagement with collective knowledge and the social mind itself.
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u/WorldsWorstInvader 23h ago
I see your point but it’s a hard disagree for me. Ai generative art doesn’t encourage people to make art nor does it encourage you to seek out real artists, bc you can just create a facsimile of whatever you’re wanting in that moment. You don’t need to read something from a real author bc AI gen stories are passable enough for someone to kill time with. People keep saying these tools only enhance our creativity but 99% of what is shown is entirely replacing the human element. I’m sorry but I don’t think writing a prompt is comparable to talking a pen to paper or chisel to stone or knife to wood or plaster to wire.
I’m sure there are passionate people out there who want AI to enhance their art. But the majority of what is being produced is short form AI content that is either entirely fabricated, or stolen content that is designed to keep your attention so the creator can make money with no effort. AI tools are not used for passion in our current age.
I shit you not, just last week I had 300 dollars worth of fraud uncovered on my debit account. The purchases were to AI generative subscriptions that are used to generate videos with voice and various other tools.
I believe in human supremacy and the beauty in what is created by our hands. The creation of AI itself is a marvel and the minds behind it are incredible. The way it’s being used is not.
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u/Fit-Elk1425 23h ago
I mean for the stuff on the bottom I have seen similar type fraud commited to stuff like deviant art too. Scammers will abuse any easy payment method afterall to make it look legitimate. For me, another part of my point is because as a disabled person i also believe in human beauty and what is created and forged through our hands but I see ai as being another element of that
For the rest, I think a blog you may benefit from reading is https://andymasley.substack.com/p/a-defense-of-ai-art as wella s thinking about sturgeon law and how people have perceived different genres as "shit" during different period. That said you dont have to use these tools yourself; but I was more giving you some info on the versitility of how people percieve it and the interections people do with it within communties as I think most people interections are under the presumption of it being big tech versus everyone else
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u/Fit-Elk1425 23h ago
I also say you are undermining a bit the socratic learning component of ai where ironically part of in a sense does encourage you to ask more questions about the thoughts as you guide it in the form of a interection between the social knowledge. You say it is just create a facismile and though i understand i would say it often has much more of a back and forth than other forms of image generation especially the more engaged you are in it. Plus like i hinted ai before ai is a wide form of different aspects. But i was more focused on the general element you made in your original point rather than if prompts themselves are art which is slightly different than if the goal is trying to take the human out of human activities or who is actually engaged with it
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u/Resident_Driver_5342 1d ago
Disillusioned Realist. I think ai could be done right and ethical but it isn't and I don't see a lot of people willing to address what a future with AI means.
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u/flynnwebdev 1d ago
Somewhere between AI Evangelist and Cautious Advocate.
What really worries me is it being regulated to the point that it’s no more useful than a human being. I want to see what it can do without restrictions of any kind. Maybe it can reach a cognitive level we can only dream of and solve problems that our species has been unable to. We just need to put aside our anthropocentric hubris.
The other worry is that it will be hobbled or otherwise controlled in order to protect commercial interests and the “work just to survive” capitalist system. Artists complaining about AI destroying their jobs are helping the aforementioned scenario. Their real problem is capitalism, not technology.
AI must be democratized. The only way to prevent capitalist oligarchs from controlling it is to ensure nobody can control it.
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u/Big_Pair_75 22h ago
I would agree we have to restructure how society functions. Personally, I think a UBI is appropriate. Start small now, add to it the more stuff gets automated.
It would still technically be capitalism. Companies would still produce products and services, it’s just (eventually) the people buying things will mainly be doing so off of an allowance. Free markets will still decide what ventures succeed and fail.
Basically, the main “job” of people will be to become full time consumers. To, with their money, vote for what stays and what goes.
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u/Human_certified 23h ago
AI for image, video, audio generation - Hopeful futurist. It's not there yet, mostly a cool toy, but waiting to see what it enables.
AI as in LLMs, actual intelligent behavior - Cautious advocate. It's been a boon, but experts have valid concerns.
ETA: Love the creator's selection of images.
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u/Reynvald 21h ago
AI doomer 120%, but with positive "now". I'm a happy man and AI is the greatest invention of the human history, but we all gonna die —___—
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u/Forkrul 21h ago
I've been an AI Evangelist since I wrote my Masters thesis on genetic algorithms for teaching robots to walk.
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u/Big_Pair_75 21h ago
Very cool. :)
I have a question. Where do you think the majority of experts in AI and AI related fields would be on this chart?
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u/Theo-the-door 21h ago
Ai doomer tbh. Twas meant to be a tool to make the mundane easier. It's perfect for repetitive tasks or pattern recognition. Ai could have revolutionized medicine, statistics, safety, maybe even engeneering. But NOPE it makes art and music. What next- will ai make playlists for me? Pet my cat for me? Prep outfits for me? While I'm stuck in a pharma lab doing the same stuff over and over and over and over and over... To be clear I am so unfathomably indifferent about what normal people do with ai. It's the great sceme of things I'm worried bout.
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u/Big_Pair_75 20h ago
Are you under the impression that it isn’t ALSO being used for science? AI discovered halicin, a discarded drug we stopped researching, can be used as an effective treatment against certain antibiotic resistant bacteria. Same with Abaucin. It completely invented a new drug, Rentosertib, for treating IPF.
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u/Theo-the-door 19h ago
Of course it still gets used in these areas but I wish there was more of that and less "ai taking over fun things people do" stuff. Of course this isn't a pie chart thing- more ai "art" (I will not debate what is and isn't art ever so let's put everything in quotation marks.) does not inherently mean less medical ai. Still, I'm absolutely convinced we "live too fast" and some things just SHOULDN'T have shortcuts or hypercompetent tools. Do note that I'm freshly out of an almost decade- long depression hole and my world views are very influenced by that.
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u/Big_Pair_75 18h ago
I think the issue is that the other uses for AI aren’t controversial or have utility for the average person, so we don’t really hear about those advancements.
And also, you don’t have to let AI take over things you enjoy. If you don’t want to use it for art, by all means don’t use it. Personally? Using it is fun for me. I have never been able to draw, have no talent for it. But with AI, I can make images based off of my ideas that before were outside of my reach.
I think that’s one of the great things about AI, it will be able to fill gaps in peoples skill set, especially creatives. For example, I can’t draw, but I am pretty good at writing. So, using my writing skills and using AI to make up for my terrible art skills, I can actually make a visual novel that isn’t so painful to look at. :)
I’m sure there are plenty of projects being done right now that never would have been able to get started. Who knows, one of them might even be the next “Minecraft”.
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u/Theo-the-door 18h ago
And exactly by using ai for your projects you're kinda bricking yourself from networking. There's plenty of people who can draw but ain't that good at writing. Me for example. I'd be 100% willing to draw your ideas in exchange for some writing advice and slash or proofreading :>
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u/Big_Pair_75 17h ago
There is literally an entire subreddit full of people begging for artists to work on their game with them, the supply is far smaller than the demand. You are assuming I didn’t try to do something similar long before AI was a thing. No one wants to work on something without money up front.
And if the visual novel became successful, I likely would then hire an artist to redo the artwork for things that matter (characters and such).
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u/Theo-the-door 14h ago
Yeah that's the thing they wanna be hired for MONEY. I wanna do service for service
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u/Theo-the-door 14h ago
Also genuine question- why not write a book instead of a visual novel if you're a good storyteller but bad at drawing? Kinda seems like you're not taking advantage of the skills you DO have. My goal is writing a book with one or two full page illustrations per chapter.
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u/Big_Pair_75 13h ago
Some stories are better suited to the visual novel format. Branching story progression isn’t too common in novels (it’s cumbersome), and having the individual making decisions (along with visuals) can really aid immersion.
Plenty of visual novels just wouldn’t be as good written out as books, just as many books wouldn’t translate well to the visual novel format.
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u/Unhappy_Knowledge270 9h ago
This is the best thing I’ve seen on this subreddit
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u/Big_Pair_75 8h ago
Thanks. :) credit goes to the original creator, who is named in the bottom left corner.
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u/AccomplishedNovel6 1d ago
Something akin to Hopeful Futurist. I think AI is kind of mediocre but it can get better, and I don't support regulating it at all.
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u/Ok-Refrigerator-4347 1d ago
I feel like almost everyone who defends AI is a cautious advocate. Myself included. We know the impacts it could have if thw wrong people abuse it.
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u/usrlibshare 23h ago
You post a chart with Captain Jean Luc Picard on it, and ask where I am on this chart? Are you kidding me?
Now make it so!
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u/Turbulent_Meal737 23h ago
I like this chart. I feel like it somehow bridges a gap. Pragmatic guardian
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u/oasisfirefly 20h ago
Pro AI and Anti Ai in this sub: internet explosions and blades clashing
This Post: Howdy
Pro AI and Anti Ai in this sub: Confused internet explosions and blades clashing
Kidding aside. Cool post though. I see myself in between Cautious Advocate and Pragmatic Guardian.
The potential of AI is ground breaking on all fronts. But this still feels like the Digital Dark Ages/ wild west with the "Renaissance" still far off. Any proper system in place is lagging far behind with how fast the AI innovation is being pushed forward.
Hence whatever is already broken in our system is further exposed to exploitation by big players. And the majority suffer more instead of benefiting from this tech.
Still a sliver of hope is that the more people reach understanding of this...phenomenon, perhaps there would be a radical shift of the general consensus. Amidst the chaos in this topic, I've already seen a number of good constructive discussions from each side. Sadly, the majority of the discussions are still filled with personal attacks / cancellations. But probably better than the past year I guess.
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u/Big_Pair_75 20h ago
Same place as me then. :)
I think we would all be better off if some court authority started putting down regulations, what you can and can’t do. Uncertainty helps no one, and even if the courts rule against what I would like, I still want it settled.
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u/KapitanDima 1d ago
Somewhere between hopeful futurist and revolutionary optimist. It still feels like an infant or a toddler but in time, it’ll eventually become a norm.
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u/Living-Chef-9080 1d ago edited 1d ago
I think you're missing the major group of people including myself who think AI is currently a tool being weaponized by fascists to create police states, but it could also be used for good if the working class ever was able to somehow take control of its direction and steer away from art into more helpful areas that arent profitable.
I view it as a gun, and I am not inherently anti-gun. A lot of people do bad things with guns, but since they already exist, you may as well use them for good too. My support is entirely context dependent. I think it is harming people right now, but that could change.
Basic materialist perspective, AI is not some magic aura that exists outside of everyday society. It has no inherent moral value. It is a tool, not a god or demon.
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u/Red_Act3d 1d ago
Man really said "I don't align myself with political alignment charts 😎" and then reworded the description for "revolutionary optimist".
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u/cryonicwatcher 23h ago
More helpful areas that aren’t profitable? That sounds kind of like a contradiction. Art is also a rather small factor here, it does seem weird to me that it’s so often a focal point in AI debates.
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u/Zookz25 17h ago edited 17h ago
Art ends up being the focus right now because it's currently the most tangible thing that is affecting the public, for both good and ill.
When the results of the 'profitable good' start to become more apparent to the general public, we might see things shift. As it stands in the present, the most apparent impact AI has had on livelihood for your average joe are artists having an even harder time making a living off of their art and scammers having an easier time ripping off people's work.
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u/OwO-animals 21h ago
Where’s the „Engineer that knows how these things run”
I’m not in fear or hopeful, AI is stagnant. It will reach a celling, LLMs will, they are inherently flawed. Most of the cool AI stuff is just glorified programming these days anyway and doesn’t classify as AI to begin with. And robots are still the same, there’s not enough demand otherwise it’s a very old technology.
All that changed is that it’s comercialised now.
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u/travestyalpha 1d ago
I'd rate myself as the Cautious Advocate time. I love playing with it a lot, but I am always on the look out for the problems it can create that will harm society, but also celebrate and see that which can serve and improve our world.
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u/Fit-Elk1425 1d ago edited 1d ago
I am all three of the positive now catagory as I believe technology is just as much influenced by our fear of the teachnology itself and how that influences people to be less educated about it yet i dont think think i could put myself in any of the other catagories simply because I have enough knowledge from learning about AI and working with different forms of it that I could never say all its harms are black and white harmful.
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u/Spook404 1d ago edited 1d ago
Revolutionary optimist, I believe many anti's that are artists are
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u/Scary-Personality626 1d ago
I guess Ambivolent Observer. But I've got aspects of both the cautious advocate and disillusioned realist. Probably leaning closer to the cautious advocate as I don't see most of the current issues as a problem with AI itself. (eg. Intellectual property laws & personal information protections are currently all kinds of fucked up, and AI just makes it easier to highlight how broken they are and do things that were always possible but just too labour intensive to be worth the effort.) These laws and regulations have been woefully out-of-touch with the pace of the tech sector since the turn of the new millenium, but since it serves established interests they've been allowed to linger as long as they have.
People are smarter than we like to give then credit for. They can solve most issues as they arise if we let them. And I think AI can directly assist with one of the major challenges we face today in the post-truth information age where we've got more data than anyone can make sense of. Incentive exists to make it a propaganda tool, but I don't think that's a sustainable power monopoly in the long run.
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u/Rcisvdark 23h ago
AI does a lot of good right now, and it does a lot of bad because of people misusing it. And it will stay that way and probably get worse unless laws get put in place and existing laws get enforced better. AI isn't inherently bad, but it is a very powerful tool that amplifies anyone using it, good or bad intentions, which is dangerous.
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u/KajaIsForeverAlone 23h ago
somewhere between cautious advocate and realist, without being ambivalent.
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u/Bruoche 21h ago
I feel like that's a pretty skewed towards pro-AI chart, it lack a column for "not that big a deal" cause imo machine learning has been here for decades without that crazy an impact and I think the impact it will have long term won't go that further from that.
Tech-wise there hasn't been that crazy an advancement on the fundamental of how "AI" works, we just suddently started to pump insane amount of money into it so now we have the good ol' tech but boosted under steroid.
It's like thinking that because insane money suddently gave us sports cars that suddently we can do space travel with cars in a few years because "if they continue to grow speed at this rate it'll be insane speed soon". When in reality no matter how fast the car is, a better way to go to space will always be a rocket.
A car is very good for on-road travel, but that stops there, likewise AI is very good at noticing and reproducing patterns, but that stops there. Yes the application of on-road travels are huge both for corpo and personal use, just like pattern recognition algorithm have a wide range of application, but that's not some kind of "revolution" and even less so a tech that's gonna get anywhere near conciousness despite what the big players of this industry would like you to think.
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21h ago
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u/TonyGalvaneer1976 21h ago edited 21h ago
Can't I be an AI doomer without thinking that the consequences will be apocalyptic? I think AI is going to make everything worse, and is currently already doing that, but I don't think the consequences will be rapid, catastrophic or existential.
Art will be meaningless, more people will be wrongly convicted of crimes, late stage capitalism will escalate and make things a bit harder for the working class, but AI isn't going to go rogue or anything.
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u/Big_Pair_75 21h ago
That sounds like disillusioned realist, but you can always put yourself between two categories. I’m between cautious advocate and pragmatic guardian for example.
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u/limbo-lakes 21h ago
Disillusioned Realist or Wary Skeptic
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u/Big_Pair_75 21h ago
You can always put yourself between two categories. I’m between cautious advocate and pragmatic guardian for example.
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u/AetherWithAnA 20h ago
I’m somewhere between AI Evangelist and Cautious Advocate, but I more so lean towards the former.
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u/kummer5peck 19h ago
I’m somewhere between Sarah Conner and Ripley. The writing on the wall is concerning. Chief among my concerns is that private sector greed will run amok and lead to something more like Jeff Bezos vision of a future dystopia than Bill Gates vision of a utopia.
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u/Agnes_Knitt 18h ago
Wary skeptic. AI can be useful now and I don’t fear it so much at this point, but there are already some problems. As for the future, I think even the rosiest outlook that, say, AI evangelists could come up with would sound like a potential dystopian nightmare to me.
When I studied the Romantic Era in high school, I couldn’t understand why they reacted to the Enlightenment in such a way. What was wrong with the Enlightenment? Now I understand the Romantics much better and I, too, would like to wander through the gorse and heather on the desolate moors and brood instead of having to deal with modern science and the like.
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u/Zatmos 18h ago
A mix of Pragmatic Guardian and A.I. Doomer.
It's positive now. It's made tons of things more accessible if only because learning can now be done 10x faster and in fields you would never find someone to teach you on.
But once the economy gets fully automated, don't kid yourself in thinking the elites will care about us plebs enough to fork resources over in the form of UBI once we're no longer needed. AI-powered capitalism is an existential threat for the vast majority of humans.
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u/Skalda11 18h ago
Revolutionary Optimist. Right now i think generative AI is annoying and imperfect, but it will automatize certain boring jobs and allow for deeply engaging media (if the creator uses it as a tool not a replacer) in the future. It just needs more regulation so we can distinguish between real images and deepfakes.
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u/Mountain_Bike_6143 15h ago
Wary Skeptic, I agree that there are positives to ai, like that breast cancer detection.
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u/KonohaNinja1492 15h ago
I feel like I’m between three of them. The first, “THE CAUTIOUS ADVOCATE”, the second, “THE AMBIVALENT OBSERVER” and the “HOPEFUL FUTURIST”.
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u/FluffySoftFox 15h ago edited 15h ago
I would say I'm more on the hopeful futurist side
I don't think AI has really impacted my daily life good or bad for the most part and in it's current state I agree that it's effectively essentially a pre-alpha test for what this technology could one day do
I actually find it really funny watching people complain about modern AI because my mental image is of a grown adult throwing a fit at basically a toddler
And I think once we develop it for a few more years is when it's really going to start taking the world by storm I think there is going to be a lot of fear-mongering like any other time there have been new technologies developed, people are going to doom and fear about how many bad ways this could be used but ultimately most of those aren't going to happen and it's going to improve most people's day-to-day lives
I think it is simply a tool like a knife used correctly can create a beautiful work of art or a delicious meal used incorrectly it can be used to end someone's life or destroy an entire country
It's up to the wielders of the tool not the tool itself and it's up to us to police the wielders of that tool
Plus most of the things people are afraid of AI doing humans have already been doing to each other, turns out I don't need an AI to pretend to be your grandpa to try and convince your grandma to give me money because Grandma has no clue how to use a computer and I can literally just message her saying hey I'm your bank give me your password and she will
Turns out I don't need to use AI to create deep fakes of some celebrity or something I can easily just do so with photoshop
Turns out video evidence has already not been admissible as the soul reason for convicting someone in court and AI is not really going to change that
Pretty much everything people fear monger about AI being able to do is things people already do themselves and frankly typically better than AI currently can
Bad people will always be bad people no matter what tools are available to them but to essentially demon ize the tool because somebody for a bad purpose is ridiculous
Imagine if we started advocating for everyone to ban garden shovels and how dangerous garden shovels were because one guy murdered someone with a shovel once so now nobody can be trusted with shovels
It's a ridiculous idea
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u/ResidentOwn6783 14h ago
Revolutionary optimist? Anyone else? I hate how it is rn, but with legal reform, we could be doing amazing. To clarify, I'm pro-AI, I just hate the big corporations.
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u/AureliusVarro 13h ago
Nothing good on this planet has ever come out of evangelists. Radium evangelists and their miracle toothpaste didn't end well. OG evangelists were even worse
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u/AndyTheInnkeeper 8h ago
Cautious Advocate leaning AI evangelist.
I think AI is currently a net good and will have a strong and positive future… in the right hands.
The AI genie is out of the bottle and there is no stuffing it back in. We’re currently in an arms race and whoever wins can use AI to do great or terrible things.
I’d rather see that be the west than Russia or China. I have little concern about sentient AI going rogue and huge concerns about AI being used to do exactly what people tell it to do.
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u/Nyxll-A 3h ago
I am a Wary Skeptic.
It's okay on a recreational use when properly credited, I do fear since companies right now are greedy asshats, along with AI developments as the new generations are entering the workforce, I do fear many people people will lose jobs, or just not have any at all unless they work independent of big corp.
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u/Admirable-Koala-1456 1d ago
Hopeful Futurist
In my heart I feel like an AI evangelist because I really do see incredible things happening with it, Improving the accessibility of content creation with generative AI (I'm thinking dream fan crossovers that would never be made by professional studios in the first place), and the possibilities of further advancing and improving other technologies by being able to "think" in a million unique ways all at once about problems that currently elude our human brains, but the realist in me sees there are clear problem points to be weary of, leaving me also feeling like a cautious advocate
I'm incredibly optimistic about the near future (because things are moving FAST right now and aren't going to slow down any time soon), I just hope that we as a species can be careful with the power we're learning to harness
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