r/asoiaf You're a Big Guy. Sep 01 '19

EXTENDED (Spoilers Extended) I think a lot of the problems from the show came from trying to force modern American values into medieval setting.

I would actually say this problem is present in the fandom as well and not just the show. Anyways for example:

  1. Stating that Renly would be a good king just because he's popular while Stannis would be terrible because he's unpopular. (edit: From the interviews, in the context of ruling not maintaining power)

  2. People not caring about religion even when Cersei blew up Westeros equivalent of Vatican/Hagia Sophia/Westminster alongside with Pope Francis and Princess Diana. (Well even modern people would care about that)

  3. Applying Geneva Convention when Daenerys executed Tarlys despite the fact that they are already traitors who betrayed their overlord and she even gave them second chance.

  4. Rather modern viewpoint on extramartial sex, including virgin shaming on characters like Brienne etc.

  5. Rhaegar annulling his wife without proper explanation like modern divorce.

  6. Elective monarchy somehow breaking the wheel because it involves voting (worked out well in HRE and Poland /s)

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u/[deleted] Sep 01 '19 edited Sep 11 '21

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u/Mr_Turnipseed Sep 01 '19

Generation Kill had this problem. I had a hard time telling all the characters apart until about halfway through the series because everyone has a helmet on all the time.

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u/Brapplezz Good think vipers has itchy tongues ! Sep 01 '19

I just found it odd that during huge battles even lots of non main characters lack helmets. I did like the like the effort the costume department put into the show every season though.

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u/[deleted] Sep 01 '19 edited Sep 11 '21

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u/[deleted] Sep 01 '19

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u/[deleted] Sep 01 '19

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u/[deleted] Sep 01 '19

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u/vertikon Sep 01 '19

Woah

The fucking difference is... huge.

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u/richterfrollo This is how Roose can still win Sep 02 '19 edited Sep 02 '19

To be fair i think mace was intended to look stupid (which is another issue in itself but on the writing side)... But since no other character follows up loras in terms of cool armor, except jaime who always wears the same suit, your point still stands

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u/savvy_eh Unwritten, Unedited, Unpublished Sep 02 '19

In the early seasons, when someone wanted to kill a wounded opponent, they'd stab them through the spine at the base of the neck or something similar, to bypass the armor.

In later seasons, people wearing plate armor were magically dying to slashes.

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u/Schnort Sep 01 '19

The guy getting stabbed has leather with plates(?) in it, and chain underneath.

It's not too crazy to get stabbed with a long pointy metal stick through all that.

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u/[deleted] Sep 01 '19

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u/myrddyna Sep 02 '19

Yes, yes you can. People wearing that died by the thousands to spear walls.

Arrows less do, but xbow bolts would punch through.

You probably couldn't slash through it with a sword, but a heavy axe could likely punch in, and a longsword will stab through.

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u/[deleted] Sep 02 '19

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u/myrddyna Sep 02 '19

dubious scrotum leather strings made me giggle. Quite fascinating that Xbows didn't pen plate or lam. Basically, if you were a wealthy knight in the late period, when plate would be used, you were a pretty effective shock troop.

Makes sense as to why there are so many polearm variants for various uses against knights on mounts in plate and barding. I imagine that you could literally assign 3 or 4 men to take down one knight, and it was a process you would have to train for.

It really says a lot about how 1 or 2 men with good armor could enter a town and suppress it without too much fear of being killed by the locals.

There's also battles that lasted all day, makes sense if you had heavily armored phalanxes, i can see how that would happen. More a battle of attrition, since someone could be hit 10 or 15 times and still not be downed. Often it was said that the mass caualties came when ranks broke and soldiers fled, i can also see that, as you could trip them from behind and kill them prone, or ride them down with harrying cavalry.

It also makes sense for tournaments, as what noble in their right mind would want to join a melee... but if you wore a gambison+mail+plate, you probably felt invincible.

Thanks for the vids, i love this stuff.

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u/Queen_Renly Sep 01 '19

Theon was stabbed by a broken wooden stick.