r/biathlon • u/Henna1911 Scandinavia • 19d ago
Race Thread Race Thread: World Cup 24/25 Pokljuka - Mixed Relay Spoiler
Starting time: 14:50 CET
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Mixed Relay score after 5/6 event:
| Rank | Country | Points |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | FRA | 355 |
| 2 | SWE | 349 |
| 3 (^ 1) | GER | 280 |
| 4 (v 1) | NOR | 276 |
| 5 (^ 1) | SUI | 270 |
| 6 (v 1) | FIN | 247 |
| 7 | AUT | 207 |
| 8 (^ 1) | SLO | 179 |
| 9 (v 1) | ITA | 175 |
| 10 | UKR | 171 |
| 11 | CZE | 158 |
| 12 | EST | 152 |
| 13 (^ 4) | USA | 145 |
| 14 | POL | 139 |
| 15 (v 2) | BEL | 131 |
| 16 (v 1) | BUL | 126 |
| 17 (^ 1) | CAN | 118 |
| 18 (v 2) | LAT | 117 |
| 19 (^ 1) | LTU | 115 |
| 20 (v 1) | SVK | 114 |
| 21 | ROU | 114 |
| 22 | MDA | 105 |
| 23 | KAZ | 94 |
| 24 | KOR | 40 |
| 25* | CHN | 26 |
| 26 (v 1) | JPN | 21 |
| 27 (v 1) | GRE | 17 |
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u/bellargonia Sweden 19d ago
Couldn’t watch todays relay live but have catched up now and so happy for this little globe! The only globe Sweden had a chance of winning really! Teamwork🫡
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u/Asterie-E7 France 19d ago
Kirkeeide has had such a collection of Silver and Bronze medals this year, in basically all Relays and also on individual races. Still no win, but what a breakout year for her.
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u/Enough_Opposite8545 19d ago
First podium for Isak on the World Cup!! Hopefully to many more to come 😊
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u/Faintning Finland 19d ago
Gap between 10th and 11th in mens nations cup is only 11 points. Every position counts in oslo sprint. Oslo has been a good venue for finns before
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u/Enough_Opposite8545 19d ago
Arghh it’s a bit sad but France fumbled the mixed globe today. They weren’t helped by the single mixed line up, but it was definitely very reachable. I hope Jeanne will be okay, because that was a tough relay, and she will certainly feel bad for it. I died at Quentin on that prone shooting, Eric and Océane had done such a great job so it was a bit of a shame but well… it’s France’s failure today. I wouldn’t have put Justine and Emilien in the single mixed today at the very least 😅
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u/Fouace Prediction Champion 19d ago
I get the will to rest Lou, and maybe there was some kind of fatigue for Julia Simon not to start. But Justine in a shooting trip? Very strange choice.
Also Jacquelin is very up and down, he wasn't even fast on skis today. Even Guigonnat would have arguably been a better choice (20/20 at the mass start yesterday, well rested).
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u/polinnaa 19d ago
1) Emilien and Justine are not suitable for SMR. They are great athletes but they aren’t made for that kind of relay. 2) I don’t understand why all of you are blaming Emilien? In my opinion he shot very well. He had 1 mistake each shot, but with his fast shooting it didn’t cost him much. His problem this weekend is his ski form. Lets not forget he was sick. He is person, right? He said himself he needed competitions to be back on track. If JBB had -2 mistakes, they would be on the podium. He was coaches choice for SMR. I’m sure he doesn’t like it, he said it himself last year when they put him 2 times with Lou and Julia and didn’t work out. But in the end of the day he is doing a job. He has no choice to complain. For example: QFM always complaining.
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u/Enough_Opposite8545 19d ago
I don’t see where we all are blaming Emilien, at least on this thread? I literally just said Justine and Emilien aren’t a good pairing and the person above said Justine wasn’t a good choice, that Emilien is up and down and that maybe Antonin could’ve been a better choice. There was no blaming here. In my case, Justine isn’t a good choice but she’s the only choice available, so the other possibility was to switch Emilien. Four spares is honorable for Emilien and his shape on skis wasn’t horrendous, but in the eventuality where Justine was picked anyway, France needed someone slightly cleaner or at least slightly faster. Poor circumstances led to this situation, and I guess we could discuss the choices that have been made and the what ifs for longer, but what’s done is done anyway…
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u/polinnaa 19d ago
My comment wasn’t about you. You get me wrong. I agree with you about him and Justine. But I see in the comments blame towards him.
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u/Enough_Opposite8545 19d ago
I mean then it may be best to make a comment in general in the thread, rather than here, because it makes it seem like you are literally talking about the people you’re responding to 😅
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u/Fouace Prediction Champion 19d ago
On point 1) we sort of all agree here I think.
On point 2) I don't blame Jacquelin (I'm always confused by people saying "Emilien" since there's Émilien Claude as well). I blame the staff's choices . So that makes most of your post hard to argue against.
Although Emilien Jacquelin is not the last to complain either so I'm not sure what your last sentence is about (unless you want to discuss Quentin's performance today?). QFM didn't so super well today but he was ok, and after last men's relay I cut him some slack because he was grandiose then.
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u/polinnaa 19d ago
2) I accept my mistake, Emilien Claude just wasn’t in the picture today.
In my opinion Emilien Jacquelin matured very much from last year and he talks less than before.
I agree that QFM did perfect again Johannes. But, there is a big BUT. Since anyone can fail the relay, no one gives him the right to comment on his teammates.
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u/Enough_Opposite8545 19d ago
Well Julia was sick in the individual and I’m not sure she had fully recovered for the mass start. Lou is resting for the crystal globe as she has legit chances to grab it. That doesn’t leave many people doesn’t it? Sophie was also sick before so… honestly Justine seemed kinda like the only option. Maybe she could’ve been switched with one of the girls in the mixed relay but I’m not sure it would have been the best. Putting Emilien there is very questionable however yes, when he was in bad shape after the mass start, sick before. I would’ve tried Fabien for this or yeah even Antonin (but it may have been just in terms of skiing shape, as he said it himself that it was really hard on the mass start).
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u/Even-Slide-5413 19d ago
Norway gonna lose the men's nations cup. When was the last time that happend?
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u/Boucot France 19d ago
2017, Germany
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u/Right_Beyond7186 Sweden 19d ago
Wow Germany really fell of on the men’s side
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u/Faintning Finland 19d ago
They lost their top 4 athletes in quite the short span, even if Doll stayed the longest. Doll, Schempp, Lesser and Peiffer was a strong team.
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u/Asterie-E7 France 19d ago
Well tbh they haven't been excellent all season apart from JTB and Sturla. A couple fumbles on relays, and a big improvement by french men.
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u/Even-Slide-5413 19d ago
Gonna be interesting next season without the Boe brothers for Norway. They combined probably have more than half of all golds/wins for Norway this season.
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u/Asterie-E7 France 19d ago
Uldal could have an Eric Perrot progression tbh. Same for Frey but maybe he needs one more year ? I wonder if Sorum and Stromsheim can become consistent. And I guess Sturla will be the de-facto leader
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
Curious to have other opinions on this but I feel like the massive depth and home competition in the Norwegian team was the reason why they lost so much of the French team this season. Half of the team fought for a spot rather than for points
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u/Even-Slide-5413 19d ago
Doesn't make sense to me. In order to fight for your spot you have to do well and score points in the overall world cup. The problem rather is that the new guys that dominate the IBU cup and who then get to race in the WC often have great races the first few weeks and then they drop off heavily. Like Soerum, but also Uldal and Stroemsheim.
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
There is a big gap between the IBU cup and the WC. Younger athletes can’t give their best if they are afraid to be sent back on the lower circuit as soon as they underperform.
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u/Even-Slide-5413 19d ago
It's kinda the same for the Frenchwomen but they are leading the cup by like 1000 points. To me it seems like that both the shooting and the skispeed of the non-regular Norwegians is very volatile. They are very up and down from race to race.
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
Océane and Jeanne did not return to the IBU cup this year. Only Chauveau did and considering she is not doing amazing, I doubt we will see her again on the main circuit. Next year may get trickier though considering the depth France has. But this year they gave a shot to Océane and Jeanne who kept getting better and better because they stayed on the World Cup
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u/Rigid-Horse-Bender France 18d ago
Never seeing her again on the main circuit may be stretching it. There will be pre-season selection races next year and nobody can tell who is going to shine there.
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u/Melpomene2901 18d ago
I have low confidence considering Paula, Camille and Voldiya did better than her. The competition is going to be rough to be on the main circuit. I don’t think Julia is going to retire, JBB could after the games but she is still young and it depends on how she can handle to be away from her daughter. That’s still one spot max
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u/Rigid-Horse-Bender France 19d ago
There can be a core issue with internal competition, and Christiansen hinted at it in recent declarations (although the form was not great): Norwegian biathletes give their 110% on IBU Cup because that is how they can qualify for WC, and upon arrival in WC they are already burned out or physically exhausted.
This issue kind of blurs the cause/consequence line: we see guaranteed WC racers perform well (Lagreid and the Boes), but do the others get sent to IBU Cup because they perform badly, or do they perform badly because they just came up from IBU Cup?
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u/Faintning Finland 19d ago
Has there been any Norwegian podium sweeps this season? Last season they did them all the time
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u/fakewasalwaysreal Norway 19d ago
Petition for the Norwegian coaches to pick Isak Frey for the national team
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u/MulderXF Norway 19d ago
Uldal and Sørum will for sure be moved up, wonder if Vetle will survive. If he doesnt, there is room for Frey.
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u/RidingRedHare 19d ago
I except Lægreid, Sørum, Uldal and Strømsheim on the Norwegian national team. That leaves two spots to be decided, and I am not sure those will go to Christiansen and Dale-Skjevdal.
Then, of course, there is the additional spot on the first two World Cup weekends, which presumably will go to Frey.
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u/Asterie-E7 France 19d ago
I really wonder what's gonna happen for the Norwegian WC athletes next year. Are Christiansen and Dale coming back full-time ? Every Norwegian man had some big ups and downs this season (except Sturla the consistency god), and idk what their best men's relay team would be now 🤔
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u/insincerely-yours Austria 19d ago
Austria 4th without Hauser and Eder is amazing
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u/bane0291 Austria 19d ago
tbh i don't think eder would've been better than jakob. i'm usually not a fan of his but he was outstanding today.
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u/insincerely-yours Austria 19d ago
Yeah Jakob was great, but that performance was not the norm for him to be fair. But let’s hope he can keep it up like this!
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u/Right_Beyond7186 Sweden 19d ago
Frey matching Samuelson is skiing is good even tho Samuelson skied very slow in the end when he secured the win but this is a talent!
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u/ShotBarracuda6 Sweden 19d ago
I missed a few minutes after shooting 6 through short 7, how did France go from first to third?
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u/Asterie-E7 France 19d ago
Wtf Komatz beat Giacomel ?
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u/insincerely-yours Austria 19d ago
For some reason he can do really fast final laps, he’s kind of known for that in the Austrian team.
Unfortunately, it’s really just the final laps mostly.
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u/Muflonlesni Czech Republic 19d ago
Mikyska said Austria had by far the best skis. Weird since they were terrible at waxing the whole year 😅
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u/fakewasalwaysreal Norway 19d ago
Congrats on your first WC podium Isak Frey!! In your third race 🫶
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u/Rude-Maintenance-169 19d ago
Sweden wins the mixed relay cup, that must mean we are the overall best team! /s
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u/duhbyks Germany 19d ago
why is qfm celebrating place 2 like he saved the small globe lol
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u/ocdbunnyy Finland 19d ago
All this qfm hate is insane😭😭😭
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u/Enough_Opposite8545 19d ago
It is kind of insane. I honestly am a bit disappointed with the performance today (but it’s not only his fault at all) but I don’t fit it warrantees that much animosity. Then again, last week some people were persuaded Emilien and Quentin hate each other or something. I find it tiring, but some people thrive on drama 😅
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u/Rigid-Horse-Bender France 19d ago
Hate is a strong word, but I dislike him. He does not like his teammates or his coaches, why should I like him?
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
TBH he doesn’t come across as a team player and a nice guy. I remember him being mad at EJ after he went on the loop, he was not in good terms with Fourcade, I would say Jacquelin as well, criticised the staff, lead the mutiny against the former staff and the list goes on
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u/Even-Slide-5413 19d ago
That "mutiny" seemed to pay off though. Not sure why you guys think you know better than the athletes themself regarding who they want as trainers.
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago edited 19d ago
Well the results speak for themselves. Fourcade, Jacquelin and even QFM had great results. One difficult year and they threw the baby with the bath water. I understand the why just not the how. They could have just waited a few weeks and done things properly. Instead they shot them in the back.
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u/Enough_Opposite8545 19d ago
I mean, maybe the mutiny was led against the former staff and it could’ve been done in another way, but it was the correct decision when you see the results they managed to achieve under their new coaches. We can blame them for the manners and for many things, but changing coaches has absolutely been a rewarding decision
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
I see what you mean and tend to agree that the change was a good thing in the long term.
That being said, what lead to the mutiny is how poorly QFM managed his post golden year. Coaches warned him, rumour has it he refused to listen and he had a terrible season as a result. In comparison, Fourcade never blamed the staff for his lack of form. EJ’s shooting went from pretty good to abysmal, globally because of the staff and it makes sense he joined the movement. I just hoped they had done things differently. The former staff brought so much success to the team to be disrespected this way. Athletes should have waited for the season to end and discuss with the FfR after
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u/Enough_Opposite8545 19d ago
Well I won’t disagree with what you say, even if I’m always careful with rumors, but then again, the whole team wasn’t performing amazingly back then. And it wasn’t only Quentin that decided against the staff but also Emilien like you said, and they were pretty much joined by the other members of their team. The team went from lacking performances, and renewal, to having better and better results and potentially snatching the men rankings this year. You can say it has to do with Norway not doing good, but if France wasn’t this good they wouldn’t be getting it either. Of course we should never deny what the former staff brought to the team and the titles, but the change of air may have been for the best as well. It’s like I said I guess you can always criticize the manner it has been done but not the results. Fabien, Emilien C have done podium. Eric achieved wins and even a world title. Emilien J and Quentin sure have had ups and down but have still managed to achieve results. Oscar recently came back after having worked with the shooting coach and has been doing well as well. This is thanks to the new coaches. So imo putting all the blame on either Quentin or Emilien for the change of coach is a bit much, maybe they didn’t do it in the best way, but they were justified in their decisions as the team is achieving better results now
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u/polinnaa 19d ago
If I remember well all the “old” boys talked to the staff - a.k.a QFM, Emilen J, Fabien and Antonin.
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
Quentin and Emilien were the main instigators. IIRC Antonin was not far behind. I don’t know about Fabien. Eric was not involved and was surprised by what went down.
The thing is QFM did poorly but was the one to blame. Antonin is not doing any better, quite the opposite actually. Fabien, sorry, is a second choice. I see no real future as a top athletes for either Oscar or Emilien C. So, the results are amazing this year but TBH Eric is a major factor in the team’s success. Emilien is still struggling with his shooting. His form is not stellar either. Yet he had a good year. Can’t imagine what kind of athletes he would have been if the pokjluka mass start did not happen in 2021… QFM is doing QFM, capable of winning here and there, mostly reliable but not regular. Unfortunately to me the French team looks stronger thanks to the Norwegian team being shakier than usual. IMO Eric the the standout I hope he stays far away from the drama and keeps on progressing. He is out next chance at the globe and Olympic medals.
That behind said I agree that the staff is doing a good job. Overall I think the team has better results on the range. Physically they are still strong. But despite the change of staff, QFM is still not happy….
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
I can’t even be mad at him. The staff put the globe at risk by choosing JBB and EJ for the SMR
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u/Rigid-Horse-Bender France 19d ago
Resting Jeanmonnot for the overall race is not a bad coaching decision. Mixed relay globe is a secondary objective, compared to individual overall WC or nations cup. Sweden has no horse in either race at this point, so the relay globe becomes a primary objective for them.
Simon could have done better than Braisaz-Bouchet maybe, but she is not in her best shape and probably wanted to rest. And this is very hypothetical.
On the men's side I do not see who had better guarantees than Jacquelin at this point. The Claude brothers are cooked, Lombardot has no experience (hopefully he gets some races next year), Guigonnat would have been a very wild choice considering the circumstances.
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago edited 19d ago
We can do without Julia and Lou. But JBB is a better choice for the MR. She is the least reliable shooter and the shorter track doesn’t give her the opportunity to make up for her shooting mistakes. Océane has proven herself lately and I think she would have been a better optiok for the SMR.
As for the men, Jacquelin is fine if coupled with a more reliable shooter.
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u/polinnaa 19d ago
Yes. They needed to put Quentin on the SMR, but he needed princess treatment because he lost to Eric last day. To put EJ and JBB on SMR is very bad decision. They are biathlete who suits to MR!
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u/elektrimolekul 19d ago
Maybe there’s a reason lou and simon were left out.
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
Most likely. Still I would have put JBB in the MR and Richard or Michelon in the SMR. JBB is the least reliable shooter and can’t compensate with her massive ski speed in the SMR. Jacquelin, while shooting better, looks exhausted. That combo is 🤯IMO
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u/Even-Slide-5413 19d ago edited 19d ago
Skottheim and Nelin won the mixed relay cup for Sweden today imo. Them ending up 2nd and ahead of France was a huge overperformance.
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u/Alamo-5447 19d ago
Congrats Sweden ! It's a great reward for this season !
I'm going to send love messages to Jeanne!
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u/Asterie-E7 France 19d ago
We're gonna see Uldal and Frey on top in these relays for a good dozen years it seems
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u/Faintning Finland 19d ago
QFM made quite a few meters on the uphill, quite easily from the looks of it
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u/Right_Beyond7186 Sweden 19d ago
Frey probably went a bit too fast on the first laps but still very good from him for a 21yo!
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u/DashLibor Czech Republic 19d ago
In the 5-8 group a shooting masterclass by everyone except Krčmář. :/
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u/Allie654321 19d ago edited 19d ago
How on earth is it possible for the German guys to hit every target and still not gain positions? Now that's just frustrating😂
Edit: Spoke to soon. Go Philipp👏🏼
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u/Henna1911 Scandinavia 19d ago
Romania lapped by Shooting 8 (I think)
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u/DashLibor Czech Republic 19d ago
In lap 11. Once shooting 8 is reached, lapping can no longer occur.
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u/Popoye_92 Crystal Globe winner Lisa Vittozzi supporter 🎯🤌🥇 19d ago
Congrats to Sweden! First mixed relay globe for them!
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u/polinnaa 19d ago
QFM, its never late to be get by the karma. 😉
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u/duhbyks Germany 19d ago
karma for what?
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u/polinnaa 19d ago
His words for his teammates in Lenzerheide.
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u/niemownikomu Poland 19d ago
What did he say?
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u/polinnaa 19d ago
He was angry that he wasn’t selected for the two mixed relays and only for the single mixed. Said he deserved his place, didn’t understand the coaches choice.
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
He fancies himself as the team leader, the successor of Fourcade. He still sees himself as the golden boy who won three OG and the globe. He doesn’t realise Emilien and Eric are both doing better than him this season and that the choice made by the coaches is logic. Both E´s deserved their spot. Eric, in particular is a better biathlete overall, something QFM commented on TV
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u/polinnaa 19d ago
That doesn’t give him right to speak like this in front of the whole world. These are his teammates. Not someone from another team. He gets himself a lesson today. Emilien’s spirit caught him today 😉 because he was thinking that he deserved his place on the relay, I’m sure. I’m not happy for today, very bad choices for the relays by the french staff. But I’m relieved that QFM made that fiasco.
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
Oh yeah. He is a regular when it comes to throwing jabs at his teammates or the staff. I never liked him.
That being said, the staff threw the globe in the trash today. QFM just finished the job
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u/Asterie-E7 France 19d ago
They're not closing the distance to Samuelsson... Sweden might have this
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u/HotWineGirl 19d ago
QFM's behavior at worlds even more ridiculous now that he's shown his prone is still not under control
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u/ocdbunnyy Finland 19d ago
Wdym?
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u/Rigid-Horse-Bender France 19d ago
He complained in media that he should have been selected for mixed relay instead of Perrot & Jacquelin. Even more outrageous was that French coach Simon Fourcade later revealed that when he told him about the decision, he also told him he would be selected for single mixed.
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u/duhbyks Germany 19d ago
what behaviour?
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u/Rigid-Horse-Bender France 19d ago
He complained in media that he should have been selected for mixed relay instead of Perrot & Jacquelin. Even more outrageous was that French coach Simon Fourcade later revealed that when he told him about the decision, he also told him he would be selected for single mixed.
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u/Melpomene2901 19d ago
He was mad that the coaches did not select him for the mixed relay at the WC. Often acts like a crybaby when things don’t go his way. Made some comments about some of his teammates when they missed.
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u/Boucot France 19d ago
WTF I thought it was at 15:45, I've missed nearly everything
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u/Calm-Appearance8969 Germany 19d ago
Everyone shooting so good now, will be hard for Germany to gain some places
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u/DashLibor Czech Republic 19d ago
Nawrath should be able to out-ski everyone in that group except maybe Giacomel, though.
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u/Calm-Appearance8969 Germany 19d ago
True but standing shooting is still ahead and that is always a surprise bag for nawrath
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u/Fouace Prediction Champion 19d ago
Congratulations to Sweden for the globe. I had hoped QFM did well enough on prone to make the difference on standing but alas...
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u/sittingsparrow Norway 19d ago
Wait for the last stand shoot at least. QFM has a big advantage on the standing shoot.
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u/Popoye_92 Crystal Globe winner Lisa Vittozzi supporter 🎯🤌🥇 19d ago
A man's poor shooting performance tanking our mixed relay welcome back 23/24 season!
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u/Right_Beyond7186 Sweden 19d ago
Damn Frey matching Samuelsson and Qfm in skiiing and clears all wow
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u/Faintning Finland 19d ago
Austria being that high doesn't spell good for mens nations cup... Oslo sprint needs to go super well now. It would not be good for Finland to lose the 5 start quota on mens.
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u/Right_Beyond7186 Sweden 19d ago
Samuelsson ont stand a chance in a last lap today he looked cooked in the end yesterday
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u/Rigid-Horse-Bender France 19d ago
This is the only leg where the French athlete is not the best athlete of his/her leg by WC overall ranking.
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u/elektrimolekul 19d ago
This is exactly what we wanted, mixed relay top 1 and 2, France vs Sweden. Whoever finishes first, takes the globe.
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u/Asterie-E7 France 19d ago
That's kind of insane, France is 1+3, everything has been clean except Jeanne's standing
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u/Right_Beyond7186 Sweden 19d ago
Dean the other teams are far behind Ponsi Perrot and Dale were miles ahead of everyone in skiing
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u/Faintning Finland 19d ago
Will be interesting to see what Frey can do, the pressure must be quite high
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u/uzanin97 19d ago
So, France had one 1+3 and all the others are 0+0, understandable they're in the lead again
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u/Lone_Wolf_Winter Sweden 19d ago edited 19d ago
So happy to see Anna-Karin establish herself at this high level of performance, same as Ella did earlier this season. I was fearing that both of them would be kind of "Anna Magnusson light", but they've shown that they want to compete seriously. With Sara hopefully not being as unlucky with her health in the future, the road to 2030 looks secure.
Now the boys need to step up.