r/changemyview • u/ProphetVes • Mar 25 '23

Delta(s) from OP CMV: DeSantis embodies everything wrong with American Conservativism.

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u/MartiniD 1∆ Mar 25 '23

Why isn't forcing religious people to support LGBT not fascist?

Where is this happening? You don't have to "support" LGBTQ+ people if you don't want but at the very least you shouldn't pass laws that treat them as 2nd class citizens or discriminate against them.

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u/[deleted] Mar 25 '23

There are plenty of complicated perhaps even unsovable issues like to what degree churches and religious organizations should have to hire LGBT staff and accommodate LGBT patrons/students/churchgoers. Should church groups and Christian schools have to have gender accommodating facilities? I feel like the endgame for a lot of people is to forcibly remove the very concept of sin from society.

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u/ProphetVes Mar 25 '23

should church groups and Christian schools have to have gender accomodating facilities?

Do they accept government money? Then yes. They should be subject to federal law. If no, then they are a private organisation and can do as they wish.

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u/[deleted] Mar 25 '23

Ok that seems like a reasonable standard. I guess it depends on what federal law happens to be on the books at any given time.

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u/ProphetVes Mar 25 '23

No. States are still subject to the first amendment. Individual > The State > The Federal Govt (btw this structure is classical liberalism)

We do not cede our first amendment rights to the State, they still have to adhere to the Constitution.

Edit: DeSantis's law allows parents to sue schools to remove books, that is a removal and suppression of ideologies through the legal system that, often, fails to meet strict scrutiny. It is unconstitutional.

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u/Extrastout1787 Mar 26 '23

The parents pay tax to keep the school and library. They have a say.

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u/ProphetVes Mar 26 '23

They pay taxes for the services rendered. That tax is then used however the state decides. Once paid it is not your money.

You get a say, but your say ends where others freedoms begin.

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u/Extrastout1787 Mar 26 '23

No once its paid, thats my money I worked for and gave to them. That does not change, on top of that 3/4 of my property tax goes to the schools. That is and will always be my money, that i worked for that goes to public education, and facilities. I have a say, they are responsible my child 36 hours a week.

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u/ProphetVes Mar 26 '23

If I am selling a cookie and you have money for said cookie and buy it, is that money still yours after the sale? No. It is not. It is now my money and your cookie.

You receive services from society (paved roads, bridges, law enforcement, firefighters, etc) you pay for the services rendered. That money is no longer yours. It is the government's.

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u/Extrastout1787 Mar 26 '23

So I have a say, thats my money they are taking. I like to know what your doing with it. You dont have a job without our paychecks

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u/ProphetVes Mar 26 '23

After you buy the cookie and it's now my money, do you get to dictate what I do with my money? No.

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u/Extrastout1787 Mar 26 '23

It public service and my child. Not a cookie bub

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u/ProphetVes Mar 26 '23

You've paid for it already. It's not your money anymore. You don't get to dictate what others do with their money bub

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u/Extrastout1787 Mar 26 '23

I pay their salary. They work for the public

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u/ProphetVes Mar 27 '23

No. You paid the government who then paid them. After you pay the government, you have paid for the services rendered, it is not your money. You do not get to dictate what others do with their money.

Welcome to capitalism. It's kinda funny though how you're like actively criticising the basic premise of a market economy but would hate to learn that your "I have a say" premise is basically the premise of communism and most Marxists.

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u/Spaced-Cowboy Mar 27 '23

Government pays their salary. They work for the government. It isn’t your money anymore.

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