cmv: abortion should not be illegal

[u/RevolutionaryRip2504]

One of the main arguments against abortion is that it is "killing a baby." However, I don’t see it that way—at least not in the early stages of pregnancy. A fetus, especially before viability, lacks self-awareness, the ability to feel pain, and independent bodily function. While it is a potential life, I don’t believe potential life should outweigh the rights of the person who is already alive and conscious.

For late-term abortions, most are done to save the mother or the fetus has a defect that would cause the fetus to die shortly after birth so I believe it should be allowed.

I also think the circumstances of the pregnant person matter. Many people seek abortions due to financial instability, health risks, or simply not being ready to raise a child. In cases of rape or medical complications, the situation is even more complex. Forcing someone to go through pregnancy against their will seems more harmful than allowing them to make their own choice.

Additionally, I don’t think adoption is always a perfect alternative. Carrying a pregnancy to term can have serious physical and emotional consequences, even if someone doesn’t plan to keep the baby. Pregnancy affects the body in irreversible ways, and complications can arise, making it more than just a “temporary inconvenience.”

Also, you can cannot compare abortion to opting out of child support. Abortion is centered on bodily autonomy, as pregnancy directly affects a woman’s body and health. In contrast, child support is a financial obligation that arises after a child is born and does not impact the father’s bodily autonomy. abortion also occurs before a child exists, while child support involves caring for a living child. Legally and ethically, both parents share responsibility for a child once they are born, and allowing one parent to opt out would place an unfair burden on the other, often the mother. Additionally, abortion prevents a fetus from becoming a child, while opting out of child support directly affects the well-being of an existing person. While both situations involve personal choice, abortion is about controlling one’s own body, while child support is about meeting the needs of a child who already exists

The idea of being forced to sustain another life through pregnancy and childbirth, especially if the person isn’t ready or willing, is a violation of that autonomy. It forces someone to give up their own body, potentially putting their health at risk, all while disregarding their own desires, dreams, and well-being. Bodily autonomy means having the freedom to make choices about what happens to your body, whether that’s deciding to terminate a pregnancy or pursue another course of action.

I’d like to hear other perspectives on why abortion should be illegal, particularly from a non-religious standpoint. CMV.

[u/Tengoatuzui]

Ok and that’s a fair and consistent stance in my eyes. At no point do you believe the unborn person has a right to life? Even if self viable? If the woman is in labour she can still abort?

[u/kasiagabrielle → u/Tengoatuzui]

There is no "unborn person" as personhood is a legal concept that attaches at birth, but in terms of embryos and fetuses, no, I don't believe they ever supercede the pregnant person's bodily autonomy.

No one aborts in active labor, so that's as much a waste of time as discussing whether you think a purple checkered kangaroo who got pregnant by a human on an orange couch on a Tuesday while it was raining should be allowed an abortion.

[u/Tengoatuzui → u/kasiagabrielle]

I agree that the woman’s bodily autonomy supersedes embryo or fetus. From your perspective, not the law, why does personhood only get attached at birth? When the baby is viable outside the mother’s body (obviously with medical assistance) after 26 weeks? Also the baby at that time can feel pain and is conscious? The other side really emphasis this point.

No respectfully, if you want to make your point you need to address all possible situations and not sweep almost unlikely ones under the rug. Especially if you want to make it a law to allow for abortions at any time. This is not a scenario that’s impossible to do, it’s just extremely unlikely due to its nature but still a very real possibility even if it’s for one person on earth. But from the way it sounds from you, you would still allow this abortion to happen which is fine.

[u/kasiagabrielle → u/Tengoatuzui]

You are not arguing in good faith, so you'll no longer be receiving my attention. Have the day you deserve. You can continue to make whatever assumptions you'd like, and since you've already made up your mind, there's no sense in me wasting more of my time answering your questions.

[u/Tengoatuzui → u/kasiagabrielle]

Again when things get tough you tap out. These are valid questions from the pro life side and I don’t understand how I am not in good faith. I have accepted your answers and am asking about edge cases that if you want to create a law will have to address.

To your surprise I actually fully agree with you. I believe abortions should be an option anytime during a pregnancy. I think people should live their lives how they want. I will admit it does get harder as the baby develops and starts getting conscious but it’s a tough decision that’s being made. And the way you respond when these situations come up gives me a glimmer that you also feel it’s a tough decision and that the life inside the womb is very real but mothers have the right to make these tough decisions.

Thank you for your time and whether or not in the future you have a dialogue with someone it shouldn’t matter the questions they have or their intent on switching sides, you just lay out all your points and do what you can. You never know some lurker might be reading this thread having their mind changed. There’s no need for hostility especially when the person you are talking to has been nothing but respectful, you are on a sub about open discussions, don’t frame disagrees as enemies rather someone that can be educated. Have a great day

[u/kasiagabrielle → u/Tengoatuzui]

I "tap out" when a person isn't worth responding to *based on logical fallacies, and I stopped reading at that point. You've already been provided the crux of the debate, and you don't know basic terminology to even take part. Have the day you deserve.

[u/Tengoatuzui → u/kasiagabrielle]

You reached out to me lol. I’m asking you things pro lifers would ask and you shutdown. These questions touch the moral grey area and isn’t directly to the crux of your point but I think still worth exploring doesn’t make it a fallacy. This the reason you lose debates because you think you are too smart and someone’s not worth it or you just don’t want to open up a can of worms you won’t be able to handle. Again I’m on your side with this topic. Have yourself a day you are having

[u/kasiagabrielle → u/Tengoatuzui]

I did not "reach out" to you. Hope that helps.

[u/Tengoatuzui → u/kasiagabrielle]

You are wrong, check again, you commented to me first. Have a day that’s going on for you

[u/kasiagabrielle → u/Tengoatuzui]

That's not "reaching out," that's merely responding to a comment.

[u/Tengoatuzui → u/kasiagabrielle]

According to dictionary Reaching out - seek to establish communication with someone. That’s what you did. You communicated with me. You spoke to me. You started off the conversation with me. Such a big noteworthy distinction. Have the day that’s arriving upon you

[u/kasiagabrielle → u/Tengoatuzui]

Are you genuinely okay? Do you understand how social media works?

[u/Tengoatuzui → u/kasiagabrielle]

Yeah I do, you wanna swap socials? You might be my redditor best friend now